Black Holes and Hyperspace Animations for Odyssey

[jammedhamed]

Black holes need a complete rework, or at least a slight buff in danger, let alone the visual upgrade. The Odyssey combat of man-to-man is quite solid honestly, but for explorers and ship-to-star... well it's lacking to say the least.

I would really like to see some more danger involved with getting close to these huge, dangerous stars, such as of the black holes and neutron stars (5,000,000 Kelvin!)


Furthermore, the hyperspace jump animation really needs a small improvement. I think most of us agreed that the first hyperspace animation during the beta/ in the beginning was a lot better than the one we have now, even though that's debatable. The one we have now is also just a bunch of 2D textures that you can tell are just that, by looking out the side of your window. It's a bit too "Colorful" and I don't feel like I'm travelling at 20,000c or whatever, even though it's just a wormhole.

Again, considering the whole game got a refresh, I really am expecting these two things to get some love. We as explorers don't get much already.

 

[here_it_comes]

Black holes need a complete rework, or at least a slight buff in danger, let alone the visual upgrade.

In b4 the Knights of FD tell us that blackholes are perfect and need no change, as happens every time.

I concur, as always, that they really need a pass.

Furthermore, the hyperspace jump animation really needs a small improvement. I think most of us agreed that the first hyperspace animation during the beta/ in the beginning was a lot better than the one we have now, even though that's debatable.

Haven't seen it myself, but can't say I mind.

 

[Qualityoflife]

Everything old needs a face lift...frontier has no problem with wearing the same slacks and vests everyday but they really should stop be so graphically complacent...how about a little garnishments!

 

[Kenneth McGrew]

yep visually they're terrible...

danger agreed... visually? in the words of pew pew pilots.... Git Gud

 

[Brrokk]

What danger would you expect? We already have FSDs which can automatically drop to normal space when they encounter a steep-enough gravity gradient. Gravity gradient is really all a black hole has got to annoy you with. The only other possibility is that the black hole absorbs some matter just as you're nearby, showering you with radiation. We're already flying ships which can skim the surface of a blue-white star without any ill effects for the pilot, so that doesn't seem like much to worry about either.

I don't think an arbitrary "Roll 1d6 and explode on a roll of 1" would really improve the game in this or any other situation.

 

[jammedhamed]

What danger would you expect? We already have FSDs which can automatically drop to normal space when they encounter a steep-enough gravity gradient. Gravity gradient is really all a black hole has got to annoy you with. The only other possibility is that the black hole absorbs some matter just as you're nearby, showering you with radiation. We're already flying ships which can skim the surface of a blue-white star without any ill effects for the pilot, so that doesn't seem like much to worry about either.

I don't think an arbitrary "Roll 1d6 and explode on a roll of 1" would really improve the game in this or any other situation.

I agree about the FSD. However, when dropping to normal space, literally nothing happens to your ship. I'd expect some "tugging" motion on your ship, akin to neutron star jets, and then maybe a fade to black screen right before you cross the exclusion zone.

 

[Phenom D]

I'm following latest changes in Odyssey so I'm glad this thread was created so I can express my view on this topic too.

Blackhole animation:

About blackholes.There are three main types of how we can describe them.
Briefly.

1. Stellar blackholes
Those are collapsed stars, not so dense but dangerous. Occurs in huge numbers within galaxies devouring their parent stars.

2. Intermediate blackholes
Located mostly in the centers of huge star clusters creating their own small galactic bodies.

3. Supermassive blackholes
Those are gigantic stellar objects creating arms of dust and stars which essentially creates galaxies as our own.

Some blackholes might not be rotating at enormous speeds staying nearby any parent stellar bodies which in the end might create lensing effect like we know in the game but sadly, majority of blackholes are supposed to be nearby stellar object rotating at high velocity. Those blackholes are creating accretion discs from stellar material of devoured neighbor. This is where game should be way more detailed especially when talking about Sagittarius A* which has at least few stars orbiting it. This blackhole defintely has accretion disc and should provide real immersion instead of huge lensing ball...
Also gaming mechanics should be way more dangerous for those who dare to get in its proximity. Blackholes are massive gravity sinks with mass of 5 to milions of stars creating massive pull and ripples throughout spacetime itself. Since FSD is based on Alcubierre's drive using spacetime disortion it's argueably possible that you won't be able even to boot up your engine to prevent some serious damage incidents.


Artist visualisation of supermassive blackhole.


Hyperspace animation:

My first impression about jumping between systems overl wasn't bad at all. I can summarize whole process into three phases.

1. Entering witchspace
FSD is basically Alcubierre drive which i mentioned above, it's supposedly working by contrating spacetime infront of you and expanding behind. This is really well done here. You can see particles contracting into circular structure and i have nothing to say than just well done Frontier.

2. Travelling witchspace
This animation is refering travelling between systems way better than previous two animations where you were able to see dozens even hundreds of stars, countless nebulas etc. It felt more like you're travelling whole galaxy even if you were jumping to nearby star. This new animations nails it way better giving you feeling traveling the hyperlane past stellar dust not necessarily whole galaxy. Maybe there should be more animations for jumps like neutron boosted etc. But also very nice work here, transitions are smooth and looking good.

3. Exiting witchspace

Whoa... this is pure trash... I dont know but simply you just cannot make some animation colorful, cool and everything and in following frame change whole image to shi**y mess where basically nothing coresponds to frame you used before! On the upper picture you can see last frame of hyper jump animation followed by instantly changed frame when entering the system.
Everything is misplaced af... Star distance, cockpit lighting, enviroment stardust, FSD tunnel effect even ships HUD is offline...
From graphic artist point of view this is just unacceptable to present as transition!
I hope this will get way better in future because it seriously ruins the immersion you set up for yourself by smooth transition entering and traveling through witchspace.















Anyways thanks for patience reading
Fly safe CMDRs.

 

[Bottom Hat]

Is there a picture of a black hole in the big gap you left before your closing sentence? I can't get the picture to open on my phone....

 

[The Roofus]

Yeah naw, I don't get this...we already have people saying white dwarfs are too dangerous - they do the same for black holes and it'll just be the same.

Leave them as is IMO

 

[WR3ND]

If I had my way it'd be a game over character wipe if you got too close, as long as the animation was worth it.
Well, you know, I suppose I wouldn't want to drown in gamer tears either...

 

[Ziljan]

yep visually they're terrible...

danger agreed... visually? in the words of pew pew pilots.... Git Gud

Definitely a pretty picture, well done, but to be clear it is also highlighting the lack of local lensing. So you're kind of proving the poster's point that the lensing could use an update ? They did implement a similar local lensing effect on the sides of the helmet glass, so it should be doable with black holes even if they have to implement a simplified lensing (eg just modelling based on looking though the bottom of a wine glass) to get it done. Just hope that they can make sure that the lensing for black holes only changes when you move your ship, and not your head, for all background objects (not just background stars).

 

[jammedhamed]

I'm following latest changes in Odyssey so I'm glad this thread was created so I can express my view on this topic too.

Blackhole animation:

About blackholes.There are three main types of how we can describe them.
Briefly.

1. Stellar blackholes
Those are collapsed stars, not so dense but dangerous. Occurs in huge numbers within galaxies devouring their parent stars.

2. Intermediate blackholes
Located mostly in the centers of huge star clusters creating their own small galactic bodies.

3. Supermassive blackholes
Those are gigantic stellar objects creating arms of dust and stars which essentially creates galaxies as our own.

I agree.

My second point about Hyperspace jumping was well addressed imo, and Frontier deserves much of my respect for that. They really nailed it.

As for black holes;

About blackholes. There are three main types of how we can describe them.

Look at how detailed White Dwarfs are. You can class them into DAZ, DA, DB, DAB, etc. and they all have subtle differences in effect and danger. In fact, you'll notice differences in jet cones, exclusion zones, lens flares, and even the nerdy stuff like star description.

So why couldn't at least half of development go into making black holes, (arguably one of the most iconic stars) at least basically classifiable and/or dangerous? Again, we still don't know if Odyssey changed this. Could be a pleasant surprise.

 

[moorison]

Look at how detailed White Dwarfs are. You can class them into DAZ, DA, DB, DAB, etc. and they all have subtle differences in effect and danger. In fact, you'll notice differences in jet cones, exclusion zones, lens flares, and even the nerdy stuff like star description.

White dwarfs are an interesting example. If I am not mistaken, only certain white dwarfs create a jet cones, while all white dwarfs in Elite do.
I am interested to see if and how the black holes are improved in odyssey.

I like the new Hyperspace animation, while I agree there is something missing during the exit transition.

 

[Deio]

yep visually they're terrible...

danger agreed... visually? in the words of pew pew pilots.... Git Gud

Beautiful. Is it possible to share the location? The ones that I have visited, were only dark because there were no nearby stars to light them up a bit ... Thank you

 

[Brrokk]

Definitely a pretty picture, well done, but to be clear it is also highlighting the lack of local lensing. So you're kind of proving the poster's point that the lensing could use an update ? They did implement a similar local lensing effect on the sides of the helmet glass, so it should be doable with black holes even if they have to implement a simplified lensing (eg just modelling based on looking though the bottom of a wine glass) to get it done. Just hope that they can make sure that the lensing for black holes only changes when you move your ship, and not your head, for all background objects (not just background stars).

Lensing probably isn't a graphics card primitive operation, so we'd get our processors hammered and different hardware would produce different appearances.

 

[Hopix]

In b4 the Knights of FD tell us that blackholes are perfect and need no change, as happens every time.

I concur, as always, that they really need a pass.



Haven't seen it myself, but can't say I mind.

Who says they're perfect? Don't think I've ever seen that. I've seen people say there are bigger issues in the game to fix first, but never that they're perfect.

 

[Chazzie]

yep visually they're terrible...

danger agreed... visually? in the words of pew pew pilots.... Git Gud

Correct me if I’m wrong but you should not be able to see the star behind it?

I agree that they need to be more deadly though - at present you can still fly through them!

 

[jammedhamed]

yep visually they're terrible...

danger agreed... visually? in the words of pew pew pilots.... Git Gud

This proves my point even more. The black holes do not even bend the light of the stars around them, just the skybox.
And for the record they ONLY look that good with a nebula behind them.

If we had accretion disks, it'd do that job without nebula.

 

[here_it_comes]

In b4 the Knights of FD tell us that blackholes are perfect and need no change, as happens every time.

Who says they're perfect?...

 

[Qualityoflife]

Its whatever looks the best.