Bought HOTAS so need to start using Fixed Weapons?

[Star Ferret]

Yea, so as the title says...

For a long time, I've been playing with just the keyboard and mouse, and I always used Gimballed weapons cause they were easy to aim with the mouse.

But I've recently bought a HOTAS and have been using that for awhile and starting to like it, getting used to it; though I have not yet gone into combat with it.

Before I do though, I'm thinking I should be switching out all my Gimballed weapons, for Fixed Weapons?

After I do that, I'm thinking I should go find some low level npcs to practice against. Any thoughts on where to find such?

For reference, I have 2 ships outfitted purely for Combat. A Krait Mk II, and a Fed Corvette which also doubles as a heavy hauler for CG's.

 

[Red Anders]

<snip>

After I do that, I'm thinking I should go find some low level npcs to practice against. Any thoughts on where to find such?

For reference, I have 2 ships outfitted purely for Combat. A Krait Mk II, and a Fed Corvette which also doubles as a heavy hauler for CG's.

Whether you do or don't switch is a personal choice. Try it and see how it goes.

As for targets, Res Sites. Start with a low, where you'll get pinatas to shoot at so you can just practice your aim at virtually no risk and work your way up.

 

[deleteduser]

.

 

[Bigmaec]

For immersion, HOTAS is awesome.

For weapon precision... you took exactly the wrong step! KB&M is the META.
However, you can still have a very good time with HOTAS and wont be a million miles off after practising.

You'll want to stick with gimbals until you've got the muscle memory for the fine motor control needed to hold fixed weapons on their target... or dive right in to get the muscle memory.

Anarchy Neav Beacons
High Res
CZs
... all good places to go shoot stuff.

This

 

[Star Ferret]

Thanks for the replies, guys!

 

[deleteduser]

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[Brrokk]

Yea, so as the title says...

For a long time, I've been playing with just the keyboard and mouse, and I always used Gimballed weapons cause they were easy to aim with the mouse.

But I've recently bought a HOTAS and have been using that for awhile and starting to like it, getting used to it; though I have not yet gone into combat with it.

Before I do though, I'm thinking I should be switching out all my Gimballed weapons, for Fixed Weapons?

After I do that, I'm thinking I should go find some low level npcs to practice against. Any thoughts on where to find such?

For reference, I have 2 ships outfitted purely for Combat. A Krait Mk II, and a Fed Corvette which also doubles as a heavy hauler for CG's.

I don't think so, unless it's what you want to do. I've always used a HOTAS, and apart from a few experiments with fixed, I always use gimbals. Time-on-target is much more, at least with my skill level. As a rule of thumb, gimbal weapons give about 3/4 damage per shot, which means they'll beat fixed unless you can hit with more than 3 individual shots out of 4.

Two exceptions:

Gimbals become temporarily useless when facing chaff. I usually use that as a time to let "wep" recharge.

The best weapons against Thargoids are fixed ATM. Maybe that's about to change, we don't know.

 

[galahad2069]

Just build a FDL with 5 PAs.
Using fixed weapons is NOT a matter of aiming. It's all about how you fly.

 

[Rebel Yell]

We (me & Mrs. Diavoli) use fixed with M&KB as these are the way to go for most PvP stuff (PAs, pacifiers, rails, grom bombs...) and fly style but there are some considerations regarding the build (i.e. you can use a gimbal C4 MC with 4 rails on a FDL), context (i.e. fixed on big ships work better vs othe big ships most for PvP stuff, but are a pain vs. small PvE ships like the ones in CZs) and ship model (as fixed hitscan hardpoints need convergence, i.e. fixed lasers on a Clipper are worthless and so on...).

 

[Corvo Cardalis]

As usual in this game, the answer is: "It depends; try and see if you like it." I have a HOTAS and use all mount types, majority gimbals. I have a Type-10 currently configured for turret beam spam, other ships that are all gimbals, and a smattering of railguns. Right now my AX Krait has fixed modified shards equipped. Whatever works or is fun for you!

 

[Ashnak]

It's... complicated.
HOTAS/HOSAS for immersion - and if you want to fly in VR, KB is pretty much out unless you're good at touch typing (which I am not).

Gimbal vs. turrets vs. fixed... yes, self-aiming weapons give you more time on target - unless that target uses chaff. Fixed weapons hit harder. And quite a few weapons need a break every now and then - for reload or recharging. On the other hand, fixed weapons on e.g. an imperial driftship are something for specialists. Same for a T-10 - by the time you have turned and actually got the opponent in your sights, they may well have bored the hole in your hull to your power plant.

On the other hand, @Aleks Zuno posted a set of clips with a gimballed beam on the huge HP of a Mamba. I'd have considered this a waste of space before seeing those clips:

Advice for xmass combat or exploration

Hi, I played ED from release but stopped when Odyssey hit ( I have a carrier, 10 or so fully equipped ships and about 30 billion cr) - I will have some time over xmass to play again starting maybe as early as this weekend and would like some advice. I would like to progress my exploration and or...

forums.frontier.co.uk

 

[galahad2069]

It's... complicated.
HOTAS/HOSAS for immersion - and if you want to fly in VR, KB is pretty much out unless you're good at touch typing (which I am not).

Not true - M+KB is perfectly fine in VR, all you need is a keypad instead of a keyboard.
And while it's true that M+KB has its (minor) advantages (slighly easier hitscan aim in FAoff), that does not make it OP compared to other kind of controls.
A while ago (during the PvP League Season 5 in 2020 IIRC) there were users of all kind of controls among the top 10 PvPers at that time. Not only M+KB but also HOTAS, dual stick and there was even someone who was using an XBox controller.

 

[Aleks Zuno]

On the other hand, @Aleks Zuno posted a set of clips with a gimballed beam on the huge HP of a Mamba. I'd have considered this a waste of space before seeing those clips

Using three Fragment Cannons instead can have its moments; see here and here. Generally though, I find the Beam Laser very hard to replace for its versatility. It pinpoints a Power Plant, it saves Fragment Cannon ammunition especially against small targets, and it supports Shield Cell Banks without requiring any heat sinks.

For the benefit of @Star Ferret on the topic of Gimbal versus Fixed, it can help a lot to understand the essence of a Fixed loadout if I describe first the exact opposite of that, and it has not to do with what you use to move and turn the starship.

I am using a Mamba for bounty-hunting primarily because it has among the biggest hardpoints with the fastest speed for moving them around, thus reducing time between kills; from there, I am using Gimbal weapons on it not because its hardpoint separation is wide and therefore Fixed would be bad, but because its hardpoint directions are all upward, so that Gimbal weapons share the biggest arc possible. I am using Gimbal Fragment Cannons at point-blank range because they can all converge onto a Power Plant. Obviously, Fixed would be entirely better versus hull alone in that situation—but that isn't the only possible situation, and I have built it that way with the sole objective of maximising bounty claims per time.

Otherwise, were it more directly rewarding to use Fixed weapon loadouts, I would fly my Fer-de-Lance with shot-speed-matched Cannons and Plasma Accelerators. All Fixed, noting that the Fixed Cannons also enjoy a higher shot speed than Gimbal Cannons, and great fun to use. The Fer-de-Lance is very much the hardpoint opposite of the Mamba; its low separation is great for Fixed weapons, and the part which Commanders usually forget is that its four deployment directions are actually poor for Gimbal weapons. Many Commanders cover their new Fer-de-Lance with Gimbal weapons, then wonder why their aim needs to be close enough to hit with all of them that they might as well be using Fixed weapons.

Between those two examples, my point is that Fixed and Gimbal weapons are just as much of a design choice as which weapons you use and which starship will carry them for you, and when a design excels it is because those choices are all interacting well.

Footnote: Another snag with the Fer-de-Lance is that a Laser or Multi-cannon in the class 4 hardpoint will be blocked by its landing gear, imposing a negative tradeoff for gear-boosting in it which is not the case with the Mamba. The cargo scoop can be used for controlling boosts instead, though this then costs a few percent more power to keep it online.

 

[galahad2069]

Footnote: Another snag with the Fer-de-Lance is that a Laser or Multi-cannon in the class 4 hardpoint will be blocked by its landing gear, imposing a negative tradeoff for gear-boosting in it which is not the case with the Mamba. The cargo scoop can be used for controlling boosts instead, though this then costs a few percent more power to keep it online.

Gear / cargo scoop boosting is a richard move anyway

 

[Star Ferret]

Wow lotta replies.
Lots of good info and advice everyone, appreciate it!

Something I'm a little confused on though...

How do you actually aim the gimbals while using a hotas?

I mean, with a Kb/Ms set up you're flying your ship with the kb, and using the mouse to aim and fire the weapons.

But with a Hotas, everything's configured to control the ship, other then the trigger and secondary fire button on the stick.

Or do you just fly without aiming the gimbals and use them as though they were fixed?

 

[deleteduser]

This will depend on your make/model of HOTAS, but largely:

KB functions are mapped to the Throttle and the Mouse functions are mapped to the Stick.

You don't actually aim Gimbals. They're essentially turrets with a very restricted Range of Movement. You point your ship in roughly the right direction with your joystick and the gimbals will start to track the target.

 

[Tetra Trash]

^^ only thing I’d add is you need to select the target first (I have a key bind on the stick for this)

 

[babelfisch]

I usually fly with Gimballed MCs and Fixed Burst Lasers. In my opinion this gives you the best of both worlds, you can concentrate on aiming your lasers and you are not useless when your enemy deploys chaff. Everything fixed is too frustrating for me (I know that others can do it but I just don't have the patience and motivation to learn it).

 

[Jack Schitt]

Gimbals become temporarily useless when facing chaff. I usually use that as a time to let "wep" recharge.

A tip for gimbals and chaff that isn't always obvious until you know it, at which point it becomes very obvious:

Chaff only affects gimbals that are actively trying to obtain a target lock. If you deselect the target so they're not actively tracking, they lock forward and effectively become slightly underpowered fixed weapons. Because a chaffing target is often in close visual range, deselecting the target and aiming manually becomes a viable strategy. Once the chaffing stops -- and if your flying is good enough! -- the target should be right in front of you and you can quickly lock it up again with the Target Ahead button.

I'm a terrible combat pilot -- gimbals all the way and FA On most of the time -- but this technique in conjunction with quick toggling bursts of FA Off turns has served me well against NPCs. I imagine the degree to which it would work in PVP will depend largely on how good the other guy is.

 

[galahad2069]

I mean, with a Kb/Ms set up you're flying your ship with the kb, and using the mouse to aim and fire the weapons.

But with a Hotas, everything's configured to control the ship, other then the trigger and secondary fire button on the stick.

It's your ship, not your weapons, what you're controlling using M+KB, HOTAS or any other kind of controller, it works pretty much the same way regardless of the control method you're using.