Bounty Hunting Confusion / Rules of engagement

[Foyle]

Greetings commanders

I've just started my career as a have-a-go Bounty Hunter, but wasn't sure what was happening last night, so I thought I'd ask the pro's.

I accepted missions to kill pirates, flew to some piratey places (well, a resource extraction zone anyway) and proceeded to have a little scan and see if I could find anyone naughty enough to kill.

I'd killed a few, and then ran into 2 Sidewinders who were both instantly red on my radar and hostile although they scanned as clean. They attacked me, I retaliated only to receive a fine for shooting them... Not one to back down from a situation, I continued until they were both reduced to a rapidly expanding cloud of vapour and fragments of ship hull.

Upon destruction, I received a hefty fine for each kill (over 10,000 credits) and the local security forces started piling in so I scarpered.

Also on other occasions I've been approached, scanned, interdicted and communicated threateningly to by NPC's with a 'clean' status.

Can anyone give me a run down of the etiquette out in the inky black? At what point am I allowed to retaliate in self defence when someone attacks me (without getting fined)

Note: I also disabled the 'report crimes against me' toggle if that has any effect. (I'm not even sure what this is for to be honest)

Thanks

 

[Foyle]

Note to self, choose more inflammatory thread title in future :-/ bump

 

[Johaunna]

1 word: Broken

 

[Renegade Roach]

1 word: Broken

Not in this case.

NPCs can be hostile (red) and clean. You can be attacked by clean ships, not just wanted ships. If a clean ship attacks you but misses and you return fire and hit first you will be seen as the aggressor in the eyes of the law.

Having 'Report Crimes' off means the law won't turn up if you are attacked. In this case since you actually hit them first by the sound of it the law turned up to help them.

The thing you really need to watch for is attacking wanted ships which are aligned with the controlling faction of a system (minor faction, not major). This currently is bugged (or totally screwed if working as intended) because you will cause any police and ships of that faction in the instance to turn hostile.

Not sure how many times this has been posted today, several by me. Wish FD would get on the case and at least sticky some useful information (not a pop at you op)

 

[Cryonics]

1 word: Broken

Like your understanding of these basic mechanics. Well done.

 

[Hernandez]

Always check either via the reputation (right hand side tab) or system-map browser for the "controlling" group of the system you want to hunt in.

After you've done that, keep an eye out for that particular faction/group name in the "contact" tab.

Should you decide to open up on a "wanted" target that is affiliated with the aforementioned group, all npc's including the System Authority vessels ( System Authority always belongs to the controlling faction!) turn RED.
Now the following scenarios may occur:

You're being attacked by the System Authority immediately (No Wanted status >your ship<)
You're being attacked by the two escort ships that usually spawn with a third - these escorts are ALWAYS clean in the beginning, and will return to their protegee, should you decide to just bail (not supercruise!)
In case your "report crimes against me" status is set to true, any ship attacking you, with the exception for System Authority vessels, will become "wanted" and you're free to retaliate.

Should you decide to bail = supercruise, and return to the nav beacon/Resource extraction - everything will be RESET. Hostilities towards you will only continue if your ship is WANTED.

Hunting in "regular" or "common" space can be quite frustrating, both for beginners and veterans.

 

[dioogio]

Not in this case.

NPCs can be hostile (red) and clean. You can be attacked by clean ships, not just wanted ships. If a clean ship attacks you but misses and you return fire and hit first you will be seen as the aggressor in the eyes of the law.

Having 'Report Crimes' off means the law won't turn up if you are attacked. In this case since you actually hit them first by the sound of it the law turned up to help them.

The thing you really need to watch for is attacking wanted ships which are aligned with the controlling faction of a system (minor faction, not major). This currently is bugged (or totally screwed if working as intended) because you will cause any police and ships of that faction in the instance to turn hostile.

Not sure how many times this has been posted today, several by me. Wish FD would get on the case and at least sticky some useful information (not a pop at you op)

I am not sure this is true. Last night I was shot and hit repeatedly by a clean NPC allied to someone I had recently killed.
He remained clean and when I shot him after (10mins or so of getting fed up with him sniping me from behind) I immediately became wanted with bounty!

I occasionally turn report crimes against me on when a pesky wanted NPC from the major faction (who I don't want to kill) takes it in the head to hound me. They don't do any serious damage so I generally ignore them. Turning it on MAY get the feds to get rid of him for you.
I say may because not always.
Not totally sure whether I had it on or off in the first case described above... But in my experience just because they shot and hit you first does not mean its safe to fire back!

Edit:
I also try to use the kill scanner before I attack anything (unless they are doing serious damage to me).

 

[sammael]

The bounty mechanic is so counterintuitive I *NEVER* know who I can shoot and who I can't. Red color, green color how hard is to implement that?

 

[dioogio]

I agree. If someone shoots you, regardless of their faction, Wanted or not - you should be able to take them out. End of story.

 

[mh-sabre]

The bounty mechanic is so counterintuitive I *NEVER* know who I can shoot and who I can't. Red color, green color how hard is to implement that?

Its not the ship colour which determines criminal status. So some tips from a bounty hunter:-
When you don't report crimes people will shoot at you with impunity. Turning on the report crimes will see an infringement issued against the offender, they will then be wanted, shoot at will....
If you shoot first or before they are wanted that is a crime, infringement issued and everyone can shoot at you with impunity.
Similarly
You can be wanted in one system and not others, just because your KWS says fat bounty available doesn't mean that it is a criminal act to shoot at them. Some sought of protection racket with the police.

The rule to live by is make sure they are wanted first, not just hostile or have a bounty.

By the way I have seen a police ship become wanted, sweet revenge watching two police ships shoot each other because one of them hit a civilian with a stray shot, dead for a 200 credit infringement.

 

[eachann]

Its not the ship colour which determines criminal status. So some tips from a bounty hunter:-
When you don't report crimes people will shoot at you with impunity. Turning on the report crimes will see an infringement issued against the offender, they will then be wanted, shoot at will....
If you shoot first or before they are wanted that is a crime, infringement issued and everyone can shoot at you with impunity.
Similarly
You can be wanted in one system and not others, just because your KWS says fat bounty available doesn't mean that it is a criminal act to shoot at them. Some sought of protection racket with the police.

The rule to live by is make sure they are wanted first, not just hostile or have a bounty.

By the way I have seen a police ship become wanted, sweet revenge watching two police ships shoot each other because one of them hit a civilian with a stray shot, dead for a 200 credit infringement.

They can't have a bounty and not be wanted. If they have a bounty, they are wanted somewhere... just possibly not in the sytem you're in. I haven't had any of these situations come up with yet... but i've done most of my hunting in anarchy systems where everything scans clean.

 

[TheNameIsJambo]

Example:

1) Ship X is flying in Fed space, it is clean. You scan ship X with your KWS anyway. You check the contacts menu, he has a 60,000Cr bounty in Empire. You jizz your pants. You open fire, screaming with glee. You become wanted.

He's wanted somewhere, but just not in that system. You broke their law. But you're 60K richer in the Empire, your true home! So who cares about Federal jurisdiction

2) If you don't have 'Report Crimes Against Me' enabled and someone clean attacks you, they won't become wanted. Therefore, when you inevitably have to retaliate - You become wanted.

Assuming you have shields, you can probably afford to take a few rounds and take your eyes off of the enemy, you could always quickly just turn it back on again - then they'll become wanted.

3) People in red don't mean 'Enemies' per-se. It just means you've caused enough aggro against that faction. Security vessels will attack you, but possibly not everyone else.

Note - A good way to 'lure' out pirates is to buy Gold; just one.Their probability of spawning is increased - or so I feel.

Edit:
I too have witnessed two 5-0 ships going at it! The other policeman was taking his time so I put a swift end to his ex-colleague's life... Then had to bolt out of there! ;-)

 

[Foyle]

What are the negatives to having [report crimes against me] switched on?

I'm thinking now that is exactly my problem - They shot me, but as it was switched off they remained clean and I got fined when I retaliated.

So why not just leave report crimes toggled on all the time?

 

[Anchorshog]

Perhaps not quite broken but may as well be. The whole thing is highly unintuitive and very flimsy. A red target isn't an enemy, so why is it red? Surely it should only flag up as red (hostile?) if it has engaged you? And you, being an unwanted, law abiding, law enforcing citizen are now in trouble for defending yourself? Could be misconstrued as broken.

I also think, in general, unless your bounty exceeds a certain number you shouldn't be mercilessly head hunted by security vessels. I accidentally loitered in the station and recieved a 250cr, or so, fine. This is the equivalent of a parking ticket. Why would I be instantly and mercilessly disintegrated just for that?
Imagine if a parking attending came along, slapped a ticket on your windshield, pulled out a pistol and headshot you. Well he did have a fine.

You never have a chance to apologise for friendly fire, to pay small fines on the spot or even eject "stolen" cargo (it's flotsam, not stolen.). Law enforcement is far, far too aggressive on the whole and this needs to be changed.

 

[MikeB]

Not in this case.

NPCs can be hostile (red) and clean. You can be attacked by clean ships, not just wanted ships. If a clean ship attacks you but misses and you return fire and hit first you will be seen as the aggressor in the eyes of the law.

Having 'Report Crimes' off means the law won't turn up if you are attacked. In this case since you actually hit them first by the sound of it the law turned up to help them.

The thing you really need to watch for is attacking wanted ships which are aligned with the controlling faction of a system (minor faction, not major). This currently is bugged (or totally screwed if working as intended) because you will cause any police and ships of that faction in the instance to turn hostile.

Not sure how many times this has been posted today, several by me. Wish FD would get on the case and at least sticky some useful information (not a pop at you op)

Yeah, but this sounds so counter-intuitive and confusing that it really is very hard to imagine that this is indeed what the devs had in mind...

 

[Tunis]

Not in this case.

in this case not, it seem he atack first the red clean, so it's fault. Oh wait ! he just defend himself :/

the red clean that atack you and dont get wanted status so you can't defend yourself, etc.. is still an issue.

dev already said there are issue on that point and are looking at it, like many other bug. just need to wait that elite release, oh wait ! that the dev patch thing up ^^ (i will say around 5-6 month worth to fix all the pending issue and the new one that will come when they add basic feature like grouping/coop)

it's cool to be a beta tester ! oh wait, we are no more in beta x)

edit for executive : the problems here is not to make money, i do money too with bh, but the system is bugged and need work.

 

[Executive]

I just made a lot of cash with bounty hunting in 30-45 minutes.
Not Wanted.
No reputation loss with factions.
Lots of fun.

Had to stop because my hand began cramping up.

Hunt in Anarchy systems people...

 

[Drezden]

What are the negatives to having [report crimes against me] switched on?

I'm thinking now that is exactly my problem - They shot me, but as it was switched off they remained clean and I got fined when I retaliated.

So why not just leave report crimes toggled on all the time?

Reporting crimes means: the cops will show after a period of time, which at times can be a bother.
Also if you are fooling around with friends and don't want to get the law involved for shooting each other.

Not reporting crimes means: you cannot shoot at someone marked clean who shoots you first (other than in anarch systems) without incurring a bounty.

 

[harakan]

What are the negatives to having [report crimes against me] switched on?

I'm thinking now that is exactly my problem - They shot me, but as it was switched off they remained clean and I got fined when I retaliated.

So why not just leave report crimes toggled on all the time?

If you are doing something illegal (e.g. smuggling), you probably want to turn this off - if it is on, the cops will show up to defend you, but then might decide to scan you, find all those nice narcotics and stolen cargo in your hold and slap a huge fine on you. Turning off the reporting gives you a chance to run away (or kill the hostile) without that happening.

 

[Miimis Maks]

Its a bug since gamma and maybe late beta.
Killing wanted factions ships makes same faction attack you, you cant fight back or you get wanted status.
Players have to follow same rule. You attack clean ship, you get wanted status and bounty on your head. Same rule does not apply for npc. They can attafk you without consequences.