Elite / Frontier Bugs/Glitches in Frontier Elite 2 and Frontier First Encounters

[VictorT]

yes!!

I'm glad someone mentioned the clouds missing in FFE.. GOD WHAT I wouldn't give to have them there!! I offered JJ money to do it, but he doesn't care about little ol me.. *sniff* (plus it wasn't a lot of money, cuz I'm poor, BUT STILL!)(and lord knows Frontier doesn't care. )

the other "favorite" bug of mine is; after spending an hour manually flying down onto a planet, finding and lining up to land on the space port, i reach altitude 0 and KEEP RIGHT ON GOIN DOWN INTO THE PLANET.. spin..spin..spin.. KABOOM!!

that's always sucked. =( [autopilot+stardreamer bug to the rescue!]

and my least favorite bug of all isn't a bug, but the totally non-realistic combat physics in FFE.. it's literally been IMPOSSIBLE for me to get my mind around combat in FFE since i got the game. oh well, arcaders seem to be the majority of gamers and just think i'm a whiner.. *whine*

peace!

 

[Prycon]

I think "Facece" was a random name, but what a name for star system, if you are English that is. But since I'm Norwegian I have always ****ounced it "Faa-see-see", and not "fe-sis", no butt humor there. Anyway. It was one of those places you just had to visit form time to time. Wasn't there a robot, who used to be a human, who was a bar tender at a spacestation there?

VictorT: I stopped playing FFE because of the combat. 0,00004 seconds after i get a ship under attack warning, I'm dead. But FE2 was too easy, the enemy where fighting like they where drunk. The difficulties should be somewhere in between, in Elite4. Somewhere between Andy Cap and Bruce Lee, I hope.

 

[Steve O B Have]

I think "Facece" was a random name, but what a name for star system, if you are English that is. But since I'm Norwegian I have always ****ounced it "Faa-see-see", and not "fe-sis", no butt humor there. Anyway. It was one of those places you just had to visit form time to time. Wasn't there a robot, who used to be a human, who was a bar tender at a spacestation there?

VictorT: I stopped playing FFE because of the combat. 0,00004 seconds after i get a ship under attack warning, I'm dead. But FE2 was too easy, the enemy where fighting like they where drunk. The difficulties should be somewhere in between, in Elite4. Somewhere between Andy Cap and Bruce Lee, I hope.

You know I never looked at the name that way - how curious - I see it now that you have pointed it out.

Combat is going to be a very hard thing to keep people happy with but as long as it retains Newtonian physics then I'll be mostly happy

 

[DraQ]

and my least favorite bug of all isn't a bug, but the totally non-realistic combat physics in FFE.. it's literally been IMPOSSIBLE for me to get my mind around combat in FFE since i got the game. oh well, arcaders seem to be the majority of gamers and just think i'm a whiner.. *whine*

peace!

What's wrong with combat physics in FFE? The combat physics seems to be exactly the same in both games, the only differences in combat mechanics overall would be:

1. AI is no longer braindead - a good thing, as I remember shooting down an IC in FE2 with turret-mounted laser once while flying a Tiger Trader - it couldn't hit me, despite I didn't even bother to switch the autopilot off.

2. Enemies are no longer split by stardreamer - a good thing too, getting swarmed by pirates is a lot more interesting than series of 1-on-1 dogfights.

3. Separate target selection for combat mode - handy.

4. Controls automatically switching to full manual after the combat is initiated - saves you a precious few seconds and is generally a good thing, maybe except for low altitude combat scenarios.

So the combat is a lot harder, but the physics is exactly the same.

 

[Adrena1in]

What's wrong with combat physics in FFE? The combat physics seems to be exactly the same in both games.

Perhaps they were, but SOMEthing about FFE was just "wrong" with regards to the combat. I mean, yes, it was way too easy in FE2 - as long as my opponent didn't go bonkers, and start flying and shooting randomly, I would expect to be able to take out ANY opponent using only an entry-level craft and a 1MW Beam Laser.

I only played FFE very briefly, but I remember finding it almost impossible to defeat anything. Things would move too fast and disappear out of range too quickly. Realistic maybe, but not games-worthy as far as I was concerned.

Something like FE2, but with more intelligent AI would be ideal.

 

[DraQ]

Perhaps they were, but SOMEthing about FFE was just "wrong" with regards to the combat. I mean, yes, it was way too easy in FE2 - as long as my opponent didn't go bonkers, and start flying and shooting randomly, I would expect to be able to take out ANY opponent using only an entry-level craft and a 1MW Beam Laser.

I only played FFE very briefly, but I remember finding it almost impossible to defeat anything. Things would move too fast and disappear out of range too quickly. Realistic maybe, but not games-worthy as far as I was concerned.

The ship parameters are mostly unaltered, maybe you've never used full manual AKA 'Engines Off' in Frontier, as FFE automatically switches to that mode. Or maybe it's simply vastly improved AI. I remember my early dogfights in FFE looking like this:

"Oh shi...!"
*is vaporized*

Something like FE2, but with more intelligent AI would be ideal.

Which is basically FFE.

 

[Adrena1in]

Since getting GLFrontier and falling in love with the game again perhaps I need to give FFE another go.

I do go to Engine Off mode when dogfighting in FE2, but my technique for doing bettle in FE2 simply didn't covert over to FFE, and I found it way more difficult. I'll try again to give a proper opinion.

 

[VictorT]

not tryna elongate the combat thread, but

i liked the separate target mode for combat, it was useful for a great many things besides combat, I'd use it for measuring distances and such..

but there was something terribly wrong with combat. You weren't notified until the enemy was RIGHT on top of you, unlike Frontier, when you'd get notified a long time before you even saw the enemy, and had time to plan an approach, and position yourself, et al.

Also, in frontier, you had a LOT more of the slingshot effect during battles, as you and your enemy orbited each other and sometimes, when the angles were quite elliptic, it'd be a long time before either of you were in range again.. When attacked by multiple enemies, you could sometimes use their orbits to your advantage and try slamming them into each other.. Enemies "swarming you" in space ought to be extremely difficult, there are too many variables without an atmosphere, friction, or gravity..

Of course, that kinda strategic combat isn't always attractive to the Wing Commander, Tie-fighter, Quake type gamers out there.. but hey, that's space flight.. that's how combat will be at 14,000 K/s^2, I'll see the enemy coming from a long way away [based on a calculated trajectory of ships on intercept course][and all things being equal], and when they do eventally catch up, staying in firing range will require creativity.

All i'm saying is, please provide a [server side] slider for "realism" <---> "arcadism", that's all I [as a space flight sim afficianado] ask!

 

[DraQ]

but there was something terribly wrong with combat. You weren't notified until the enemy was RIGHT on top of you, unlike Frontier, when you'd get notified a long time before you even saw the enemy, and had time to plan an approach, and position yourself, et al.

Ah, yes. That was bad.

Also, in frontier, you had a LOT more of the slingshot effect during battles, as you and your enemy orbited each other and sometimes, when the angles were quite elliptic, it'd be a long time before either of you were in range again..

AFAIK the "slingshotting" was caused by failure to deactivate so called "manual" or set speed mode which simply won't work as intended when you're hurtling at several thousand km/s relative to the reference mass and you constantly change your ship orientation which your ship's computer interprets as feeding it desired flight vectors much faster than it can manage.

If you go to the engines off mode and start firing your thrusters manually, combat becomes remarkably similar to that in FFE where computer relased it's control over drives as soon as you were attacked and much easier to handle.

 

[Prycon]

I have given FFE another chance. But I get so angry when I'm in combat because I keep most of my time reloading a saved game, and this on the first medical run to system above Gateway.

I think you should be able to chose what you want to use as a relative reference, kind of a "relative target" besides "autopilot target" and "combat target". Or you could make combat target the relative source. I think it will make combat more understandable. In FE2 you just kept boobing around each other because you controls where relative to a planet 8 AU away, or the star. In combat with another spaceship it is more relevant to know what your speed is to your attacker than what your speed is to a planet 8 AU away. I think Elite 4 needs to put more attention to combat.

Make the difficulties reflect on where you travel. If you are in systems around Sol, Achernar and Gateway, the pirates count is low. And the further you get form those systems the harder it gets. Anarchy systems being the worst, maybe the system info could have a system pirate rating. I know FE2 and FFE already uses this philosophy, but make it a bit easier around the core systems, so new users can learn before they take on the universe. I think if Elite4 is as hard as FFE when it comes out, it won't do so good.

Sorry for the off-topic.

BTW. There is a bug in glFE2 that makes some people use a extra set of hair. God I miss the faces from FE2 in FFE, hope they return in Elite4.

 

[DraQ]

I think you should be able to chose what you want to use as a relative reference, kind of a "relative target" besides "autopilot target" and "combat target". Or you could make combat target the relative source. I think it will make combat more understandable.

That would be neat.

In FE2 you just kept boobing around each other because you controls where relative to a planet 8 AU away, or the star. In combat with another spaceship it is more relevant to know what your speed is to your attacker than what your speed is to a planet 8 AU away.

That's why it's wise to use not so aptly named "engines off" mode, also known as "full manual", in deep space combat in both FE2 and FFE.

I've found a little tutorial that might be very useful for learning the intricacies of Frontier combat.

 

[VictorT]

hmph, again with the offtopic! whats wrong with me??

what would really solve the reference problem [while I really prefer everybody reference the most gravitationally influential] is what they did in Terminus; there needs to be a "match target" mode, which used your engines to sync your heading and your velocity with that of your target's, then you could keep your distance [assuming you had the specs], bear down on them, and move in reference to it with far more control [even as your target changes course].

Terminus was cool.