Buyable slot split modules. Maybe an adapter too?

One thing that has always driven me crazy is some of the module limitations on some ships. Some have a fairly limited number of slots, yet those slots are huge compared to what you need. Sometimes surprisingly huge even for the ship's overall size and capacity. I can also imagine some people must run into the opposite problem perhaps.

I propose a fairly simple solution: a module you can buy that splits one slot into two and alternately another that combines two into one larger one. Now, this might be a bit balancing breaking, so I propose a bit of a limitation on that. For example, maybe produce something more like a 3:2 ratio. Say if you split a class 3 slot it could produce two class 1 slots instead of two class 2s (even though the 3 is actually double the 2.) Or perhaps it wouldn't have to be even. For example, a split 3 producing one 2 and one 1. Obviously I like that better, but I'm sure something more like the 3:2 would be more likely to be considered. Either way would significantly limit what could be done with this in a way I think would still be fairly balancing. (For example, even if you used this to fit, say, a fuel scoop, it would have to be a smaller fuel scoop with significantly worse results.) Lore-wise this balancing can make sense -- some extra capacity might be lost in the process of implementing internal mounting/etc to the "container."

Alternately -- and I may have a bit of bias in this as an owner of the alliance chieftain (I love the way the ship flies and almost everything about it except that it pretty much chose to give up at least one normal module slot in favor of having those three military slots) -- I would love to see a module "adapter. Something that could allow normal modules to go into one of those military slots. Even two if it just really had to be that lossy (though obviously I think that's overkill to the point of almost cruelty.) I think a single slot adapter having a 3:2 ratio like the splitter might make the most sense. For example, the chieftain has class 4 military slots and I think it would be reasonable if you could adapt one of those class 4 slots to a single class 3 normal. Even a higher loss might be better than nothing -- eg getting a single class 2 from one of those class 4 slots.

As another alternative to the 3:2 ratio idea for balancing, perhaps they could have somewhat of a limitation of what could be mounted. For example, it might be more balance breaking if you can use it for, say a heatsink launcher (since that could directly increase battle power in some cases) but something like, say, having a smaller cargo bay combined with, say, a fuel scoop or a discovery scanner or something wouldn't be unreasonable. Maybe a ship with a really big slot to spare could split it to have a vehicle hanger and a more medium range fuel scoop rather than a larger version of either while freeing up slots for carrying stuff like a surface scanner. I don't think it should be terribly limiting of module types though, so I only suggest this as a possible method of balancing that might be better than nothing.

I think this could be a real boon to explorers and multi-purpose ship users. With either of the limitations I mentioned I think this wouldn't be terribly balance breaking and would mostly just result in letting people use their favorite ships for more of what they want to use them for rather than having to specialize as much.
 
I am all for slot splitting at the cost of over all space as long as the split slots can not be used for defensive modules. IE a size 6 can be split any way you want for a total of a size 5. 2x2 and 1x1 or 1x2 and 1x3, or the like.
However, if a similar cost is applied to combining, IE two slot 3 combine to make a single slot 5, I don't see the feature being terribly useful outside of edge use cases.
Splitting is not two terribly lore breaking, but combining all three of the optional size 4 slots on a Cobra III to make a size 8 or 9 would challenge credulity more than a little bit. Provided you could power it, I don't really want to imagine a Cobra III with a class 8 prismatic shield generator. The optimal mass bonus would be extreme.

I would use it to turn a slot 3 into 2 x size 1, and stick a decon and collector limpet controller in it for AX CZ fun, others might do something a bit more troublesome.
 
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I originally started to suggest combining, but ultimately removed it since generally speaking it would have to be too lossy to be useful or risk being severely balance breaking (eg putting a huge shield generator on or something for instance.) I think having too many split options probably goes too far though. It makes sense a class 6 could hold a lot, but this would result in far too many possibilities and probably would go way too far into balance breaking territory.

You should search for previous suggestions for module/slot splitting, the responses to which address balancing issues.
And I think I did just address balancing issues...
 
I think I did just address balancing issues...

I don't think you did. Ship balancing isn't simply about combat statistics, which would be absurd without extra coding to limit specific modules from split compartments (ie 2X size 1 G5 HRPs > 1X size 3 G5 HRPs). Ship balancing is also about what different ships are capable of with respect to exploration, trade, mission running, mining, piracy, etc. Slot splitting would completely undo any balance or decision making/compromise, which is a pretty big part of ship choice & design.
 
Yeah, combining slots would be a bit crazy. PvP fight between competent commanders in FDL/Mamba already take 15-30 minutes. Imagine if they traded their size 4 and 5 slots for a single size 8. They would get tired of fighting b4 they got each others shields down, and they would have to farm a ton of mats for reloads.
 
I don't think you did. Ship balancing isn't simply about combat statistics, which would be absurd without extra coding to limit specific modules from split compartments (ie 2X size 1 G5 HRPs > 1X size 3 G5 HRPs). Ship balancing is also about what different ships are capable of with respect to exploration, trade, mission running, mining, piracy, etc. Slot splitting would completely undo any balance or decision making/compromise, which is a pretty big part of ship choice & design.
Why is that a really horrible thing? And you do realize you basically just argued against optional modules even being optional in the first place? By your argument every ship should have what it comes with stock and you can only upgrade the quality, not change the modules. But there are two things you're missing to that. First of all, every ship still has its own uniqueness ranging from how it handles to overall capacity which would still remain intact. This isn't No Man's Sky where they're all basically the same thing just with more or less module slots. A Diamondback will fly completely differently from an Asp no matter how you change your slots around for example. Second, the whole point of optional modules in this game is that they are universal things you can swap around at will to whichever sort most suits your needs. You can put the same shield generator in any ship that can hold that size of shield. You can put the same fuel scoop in any ship that can hold that size fuel scoop. Etc etc. The whole point of the optional modules from the very start was always to allow you to customize your ship a little bit to adapt it to different needs and purposes. As for combining stuff like HRPs, that's more an argument of having an overall limit on specific module types (like some modules already do) than a reason why splitting would be bad. Splitting a slot makes no difference insofar as combining things like HRPs goes versus combining without splitting.

Your idea of "balancing" is mostly just defined as "limiting." You want more limits, but aren't really giving a good argument for why those limits are truly necessary for good gameplay. Balancing doesn't mean "make it less fun." Balancing means find a way where any benefits are relatively offset by downsides so that everyone can enjoy it equally (eg no haves vs have nots.) It's worth noting that both sides of a firefight can have split modules and both would still have the limitation of those being smaller modules. Even defensive things (say a heatsink launcher) are significantly more limited in their smaller versions. And I've already mentioned that it wouldn't be unreasonable for there to be some limitations on what can be applied in the split slots.

A key part of this game is also being able to customize your ship your way. You're essentially arguing that shouldn't be a thing and I don't think most players will agree with you there.
 
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Ya the Op should of read the older topics about module splitting and the Exploit it would cause. So this is terrible idea. Ships do have limitations and ignoring the fact large ships should also have Limitations. Someone already pointed out Exploit and the OP is ignoring it.
 
I think I've addressed that rather nicely. Would you care to be more specific? And while accusing me of not bothering to read anything you failed even to read as far as my name...
 
I think I've addressed that rather nicely. Would you care to be more specific? And while accusing me of not bothering to read anything you failed even to read as far as my name...
No only thing you addressed is you did not do your research. Bravo for not researching.
 
I asked you if you had anything specific and it seems the answer is no. I should think it should go without saying that the flaming was wildly unnecessary and inappropriate, so let's just move on then.
 
The gist of the old anti splitting arguments was defensive module resistance stacking. Easily answered by not allowing defensive modules in split slots. Not allowing SCB/HRP/MRP/GSRP/GHRP/GMRP/GSEP/etc. does really eliminate most of the issues outside of the usual, "I don't want it, you shouldn't either", and "It's supposed to be hard", and "you just want an instant win button" sentiments so prevalent whenever someone makes any sort of suggestion.

Now combining, is insanity unless restricted to the point of being useless anyway.
 
A key part of this game is also being able to customize your ship your way. You're essentially arguing that shouldn't be a thing and I don't think most players will agree with you there.

No I'm not. The only way you can arrive at that conclusion is by that tired old reductio ad absurdum route. A key part of this game is being able to customise ships as you like, albeit somewhat imited by deifferent manufacturers strengths/weainesses, what different ships were designed to excel at, be passable at, etc. The module system isn't by any means perfect, but what your proposing eliminates the need for making compromises, or designing within any relative limits, which is also a key part of ship design in this game.
 
The gist of the old anti splitting arguments was defensive module resistance stacking. Easily answered by not allowing defensive modules in split slots. Not allowing SCB/HRP/MRP/GSRP/GHRP/GMRP/GSEP/etc. does really eliminate most of the issues outside of the usual, "I don't want it, you shouldn't either", and "It's supposed to be hard", and "you just want an instant win button" sentiments so prevalent whenever someone makes any sort of suggestion.

Now combining, is insanity unless restricted to the point of being useless anyway.

Unequivocally false. This banal accusation of yours is always touted out by certain people who don't like it when people are not in favour of their unique and brilliant suggestions, or forbid, against a suggestion. Whenever I (and many others) are not in support of a suggestion, it's because it's not a very good suggestion - it may add no real qol/gameplay benefit; it may add something minor, but at the expense of other aspects of the game; it may compromise some basic/core principles in favour of a benefit to a minority of players; it may simply be absurd. But nice try.
 
You're right. I think after this I'll stop responding to posts that just say nothing but "I don't like your idea" without really adding anything to the conversation. Like yours.

Unequivocally false. This banal accusation of yours is always touted out by certain people who don't like it when people are not in favour of their unique and brilliant suggestions, or forbid, against a suggestion. Whenever I (and many others) are not in support of a suggestion, it's because it's not a very good suggestion - it may add no real qol/gameplay benefit; it may add something minor, but at the expense of other aspects of the game; it may compromise some basic/core principles in favour of a benefit to a minority of players; it may simply be absurd. But nice try.
And yet that does seem to be what it boils down to...

No I'm not. The only way you can arrive at that conclusion is by that tired old reductio ad absurdum route. A key part of this game is being able to customise ships as you like, albeit somewhat imited by deifferent manufacturers strengths/weainesses, what different ships were designed to excel at, be passable at, etc. The module system isn't by any means perfect, but what your proposing eliminates the need for making compromises, or designing within any relative limits, which is also a key part of ship design in this game.
I repeat: each ship already has its uniqueness that has nothing to do with the optional modules and the optional modules are specifically intended to be optional and interchangeable. As far as prospective exploits go in stacking/etc goes, that applies regardless of if there are splits and is more an overall argument why some modules shouldn't be combinable in the first place. In fact, you pretty much just successfully argued why you think Frontier should remove engineering from ED... A python is slow? Just engineer its thrusters with dirty drives... A courier has too much weight? Engineer its modules for lightweight. Customization is a key part of the game Frontier is making and you're arguing that it shouldn't be there. The point of limitations is not just to be limiting entirely on their own, it is to find the right balance of things to make the game the most fun for the most people.
 
I asked you if you had anything specific and it seems the answer is no. I should think it should go without saying that the flaming was wildly unnecessary and inappropriate, so let's just move on then.
Thing is when you Post a idea. It your responsibility to research other topics like your and try to plug in the issue that already been pointed out.
 
For all the cries of doom, for all the rhetoric how this would destroy the world as we know it, there are two very simple solutions to the OP's solution:

(1) Make these new splitable slots Non-Military Use. Yep, way out there concept, never been done before, well except the are the exact opposite of what we already have in the game with Military Slots. Hard to fathom but yes, these slots will only accept non-military (read that as any non defensive or offensive modules). Now that would limit these new slots to game breaking modules like limpet controllers, fuel scoops, SCAs, DC/ADCs, fuel tanks and the like. But I am sure someone will quickly point out how having additional fuel is somehow gamebreaking ...

(2) Make all modules non-stackable. Again, yep a solution right of out left field here Commanders, how about FD make it that if you add a second HRP or SB you actually LOSE integrity or shield strength. OH NOES, but that will make it that my ship won't have a five digit shield strength - yep but neither will anyone else. All it does is low the ceiling but it will reduce the ridiculous TTK and boring fights we have now where it isn't based on the skill of the pilot.

My solution to the problem of not enough slots. Every ship loses it's 1 and 2 Size slots and instead gets a special Size 4 slot. This slot can be configured as follows:
  • One Size 4 Module
  • One Size 3 Module and one Size 1 Module
  • Two Size 2 Modules
  • One Size 2 Module and two SIze 1 Modules
  • Four Size 1 Modules
Make the new Slot non-military and put the onus back on the player to fit what they want, how they want it.
 
just result in letting people use their favorite ships for more of what they want to use them for rather than having to specialize as much.
I think you should put less "love" into your ships. "Love" here is unreasonable attraction which can't be explained. How could it be that you like the ship but the ship can't do what you need? There's other ships in the game for you.
 
I think you should put less "love" into your ships. "Love" here is unreasonable attraction which can't be explained. How could it be that you like the ship but the ship can't do what you need? There's other ships in the game for you.
What the amount of ships now almost 40.
 
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