Campaign to make trailblazers less of a grind.

[Dragsham]

Wow!
OK so we've soloed tier 1 outposts etc
Some of us have managed a high tech system. Built security, military, an array, comms, etc etc. Now on tier ll. 70+loads perhaps more who's counting.
Then there's tier lll. Possibly even tier lV. And once again there's a awesome grind! Even as a group of just 4 or 5 of us it's still awful. Back n forth, steel, titanium, cmm composite, aluminium, etc.
This just is not right.
Yeah l hear the white knights! Don't solo! Do something else to break it up a bit, do it as a group it's not designed to be soloed! Yeah all true.
But that does not detract from the FACT that it's a massive linear grind!
So l ask fdev bearing in mind this colonisation lark is in beta, to do something to address this frankly ridiculous gameloop.
You'll get cmdrs playing again, 1000s of them, they'll see it for what it is, and walk away again because fdev have this habit of grindfest gaming. That's their answer to all. Grind!
We all love this game. Try another tact! Another philosophy ! Another angle whatever you wanna call.it.
This current iteration isn't right.
There has to be another way?
Npc fleet of hauler we can employ on a load by load basis? Employ cmdrs on the same basis. For those of us who have more credits than sense.
Too much emphasis on hauling. As a professional hauler I attest to this as being tedious, brain damage.
There has to be another way!?

 

[Rat Catcher]

Good luck with trying to get things changed...

I don't particularly relish hauling, but am interested in the 'mechanics' of colonisation (after all, why use a lot of gaming time to build another BGS / PP system?), so have built my station, with help, and 2 other assets.

I'll go back and do some more another time, or not, depending on what I feel like doing on the day.

Unless things change massively and there are more benefits to being System Architect than a handful of credits each week, I don't think I'll be rushing to 'complete' the system I've been designing.

Yeah, it is tough for solo players, perhaps the first phase timer should be extended to 3 months, to enable the casual player to construct another BGS asset?

 

[Rubbernuke]

At its heart ED is a game about repetition and collective effort, so trying to lower grind would then unbalance effort elsewhere (such as with PP).

I do like the idea of abstracting the hauling though- it could be like hiring an NPC SLF pilot but block book a set tonnage. This tonnage is then injected into a system over a set time (the more expensive contracts being faster) and that via RNG you'd get POIs of pirate attacks that you respond to- and that if you don't (i.e. you let the timer wind down to 00:00) that cargo is lost.

Other modifiers could be used: say, sec level, power (so if youn a rival pledge in an enemy system you get PP NPCS after your hauling) and so on.

It would very much be like ship delivery and how thats handled, but with random events attached.

 

[GroG79]

+200k ton stations are absurd

 

[Dragsham]

Atm the bgs is playing up. I got one colony system that's at a state of war, has been for over a week. Pending! And yet nothing has changed. No combat zones and so on. So the trailblazers and PP2.0 rollouts seem to have affected the bgs. Course this may be intentionally as is. Fdev haven't yet clarified their intent as regards the bgs, I do feel for those solo cmdrs trying in vain to keep a lid on their status quo.
I get it... things are up in the air. But a post from fdev clarifying their plan as regards bgs, PP2.0, and trailblazers and what's the long term plan, would be a good read.
I suspect like some others that perhaps the bgs has had its day. To be replaced by some new rollout perhaps or even killed altogether.
But I stand by my point. I'll even elaborate.
They ALL rely too much on hauling. Whether it's commodities or cps it's just the same iteration. And that's my gripe.
We need a new angle.
Something that'll differentiate between the 3 disciplines.
Hauling hauling hauling isn't the way to go.
That's how alot of cmdrs see it.
Yes it works, it's got legs. For those who don't mind the grind, or who have large discord groups coordinated etc. But for the vast amount of small groups and soloists it's all just too much.
It's in beta. Hell even PP2.0 isn't rolled out 100% yet (rares+escape pods) and the bgs is in flux. So nows the time for a post telling the community what the plan is. Or at least fix things that need fixing.
Course that's a whole new gripe. So many bugs! And some years old.
Rolling out new content just like that other game, leaving a slew of unaddressed bugs in their wake.. a whole new post methinks.

 

[O'Roarke]

How much is too much?

I've seen people burn the midnight oil and invest every five-minute chunk of time they have during their week to stomp out four to seven stepstones just to get within reach of a precious that they desire. Clearly they had no problem committing to 400€$ to 700€$ of unpaid work to get there.
That's twenty hours to nearly a workweek of effort invested to just have the chance to claim something.

What would be the minimum effort required?

Autobuild a S80 G80 system by NPCs in... what... two years?
Just one year? -Or is that too long as well?

 

[vicwarrior]

I don't think its so much of a time investment things (althought it could absolutely still be brought down a bit), the greater issue is how goddamn monotonous and boring is the hauling loop, and that its the ONLY way to involve yourself with colonisation (which may have interesting mechanics underneath).

Even if its intended to be a group effort, boring a group still isn't a good idea, that kills videogames , there ought to be some ways of tying in more activities to colonisation.
Now, simple bandaids are to have npcs haul for you, allowing to replace hauling with credit grinding.

With how broken the credit economy is, it might be risky...

However, honestly, if theyre not going to overhaul colonisation with more activities/politics/npc investments, whatever systems to make colonisation more varied, id still rather take the bandaid fix over keeping the system as is. Theres several different ways grinding credits, and by my opinion, theyre all better than hauling a->b->a for hours on end.

 

[metatheurgist]

Would be better to campaign to make Trailblazers interesting.

 

[tomalus]

monotonous hauling is the same if you do it solo or in a group. The difference is everyone is now doing monotonous hauling instead of just one person

Grinds were reduced for engineering several times, power play was changed to be more accessible.
They need to reduce the grind for the majority of players (solo). They can do that with slow growth per day.
You who play in groups are a minority,just so you know. Solo players are the target audience.

 

[Dragsham]

Yes groups do not hold sway. They are a minority.
If this game is heading away from solo cmdrs it'll be a bad move.
We have jobs, family's, kids, grandkids, and other worldly commitments.

Game designers need to know that.
Time itself is our most precious commodity.
And grinding is passe

 

[BackToTheMud]

If you want to lower the grind you should work with other players. As was intended for the feature.

Only, hauling tens ot thousand of tones of cargo isn't less mind numbingly boring just because your poor friends are doing it too.

 

[Cosmo]

If you want to lower the grind you should work with other players. As was intended for the feature.

The problem is that we have only 1 option atm. Hauling (tedious) with more players = still a boring grind. There must be alternative ways to build a colony. Many suggestions are on the forums such as here: Integrate more Playstyles for Colonization.

 

[KRISXR]

I haven't even tried trail blazers yet and already feel the grind from the numbers I've seen players post. I'm burned out already. I think just about every post in this thread sounds valid.

 

[Mohrgan]

Wouldn't the sheer amount of facilities already completed, by Commanders, argue against there being too much grind? We're expanding like the plague throughout known space, tens of thousands of new stations erupted like pustules all around us, and you think FDev are asking for to much effort? It appears to be child's play.

The shipping requirements are exactly why I have not gotten involved with colonization, but I am in the minority, example surely shows that.

 

[aRJay]

It comes down too how many tonnes of cargo in a day is acceptable to you and your friends to move in a week, then divide the job up into that many weeks.

Today I hauled around 4,000 tonnes helping some acquaintances fun was had in chat and discord alongside the hauling.

But if hauling is an untouchable activity for you in volume then colonisation is not something you need to bother with unless some other activity is added to it that hopefully doesn't make it as exciting as buying a fleet carrier.

 

[Rainbro]

Making it quicker should be a last resort, that's when you've given up on making it fun and just want to minimise the damage. Yes, I'm looking at you, Engineers. Better than nothing but if I'm going to pretend Frontier are going to read this I may as well aim higher.

Some ideas off the top of my head:

• Completing missions for factions in exchange for them making a shipment to your station. Hunt down these pirates so it's safe for us to ship in some Steel. Deliver this data for us and we'll deliver some CMM for you. Maybe passenger missions for new residents/workers/officials could give a boost too. Add some variety and let people do what they find fun.
• Actually, that was already said earlier. All solid ideas there.
• Frontier seem to like their management sims, so if recycling existing gameplay doesn't cut it, lean harder on management. Maybe NPC trade can slowly fulfil requirements, but that can be improved by being smart with how you build your system. Make it an attractive and safe place to live so more traders come to take advantage of that. Maybe random events (and/or BGS states, if you want to fix the BGS?) affect things further, tradeoffs between freedom of trade and security and crime, I dunno if I trust Frontier to make that balanced but whatever. Seems a shame to have all these existing factors basically only influence if your port produces 210 Coffee rather than 200.

 

[galahad2069]

If you want to lower the grind you should work with other players. As was intended for the feature.

Working with other players can only lower the grind if you can find players who are willing to help you build your system but don't expect you to help them build theirs.

A group of 10 people working together to build 10 systems is the exact same amount of grind per person as 1 player building 1 system.

 

[ScruttocksRus]

I personally don't mind the grind I think the quantities of commodities are about right, but I fully respect and understand other people's views on the topic.

What I really don't appreciate are the bugs, particularly with surface ports, and the moving goalposts on economy influence with absolutely no communication from anyone from FDev. It's shows contempt and disrespect to the player base.

 

[SteveWW57]

Solo here. Completed an asteroid base and a Corilois along with about half a dozen outposts plus over a dozen installations/settlements since colonization was unpaused. I have the time to invest, so I choose to do so. If I want to do something else, I will. My interest is still there.

 

[ꝁestrel]

Solo here. Completed an asteroid base and a Corilois along with about half a dozen outposts plus over a dozen installations/settlements since colonization was unpaused. I have the time to invest, so I choose to do so. If I want to do something else, I will. My interest is still there.

Out of curiosity, approximately how much time did you spend hauling?