Cash for credits? Thoughts?

[Kipper]

So the mini update today mentions that 'probably' you'll be able to buy credits with real money to get ahead.

Wondered what people's thoughts were on this.

Technically, it's not a pay to win thing because you can earn credits by playing the usual way and use them to buy all of the same things as bought in credits (pay to win would involve buying ships or weapons you can't otherwise obtain).

Personally I think buying credits would take a load of fun out of the game and so I wouldn't do it - for me, the challenge is starting with the 100cr and basic ship and turning that into a fortune through clever trading and other activities.

I'd fund the game with microtransactions on cool paintwork or cosmetic add ons for my ship though (as long as it was 'owned' once bought and not rented, and transferrable between ships/usable on my next ship).

 

[Geraldine]

Hi Kipper
Although I can understand why Frontier want to do this (it helps maintain servers) I am with you 100% on this. The whole ethos of Elite was earning your way, taking the knocks, overcoming setbacks and learning your way around the galaxy. Paying for game credits is tantamount to cheating in my view. Sure you will be able to buy all the best kit, but where is the accomplishment after a lot of hard fighting and trading?

I spent months of game time in FE2, saving up for my first military drive. When I finally fitted it into my old bucket of a ship, I felt so proud

Mind you it didn't last long when I discovered you couldn't get free fuel for it

 

[Steve O B Have]

I'm not fussed to be honest. If someone wants to dilute their game by buying cash then all the power to them and if it means that Frontier can keep developing the game then all the power to me.

 

[SnowGhost]

Star Citizen has done the same thing with the latest pledges. You can go and buy, right now, carrier class ships and fighters to fill it. You gotta spend a lot of real $$$. It's a form of cheating (god mode effectivly). I don't see the fun in it, except for a short time run around. But long term, all you've done is cut the trip time.

And all the fun is in the journey, not the destination.

 

[deej]

I enjoy playing Elite using my keyboard, not my credit-card.

 

[Aewarin Jameson]

Personally I think buying credits would take a load of fun out of the game and so I wouldn't do it

Agreed, however it's a personal choice but I won't be buying any credits.

As Steve said - if it helps FD keep afloat then what do I care.

 

[Alien]

If you can buy in-game credits for real world cash ...
then what is the point in even playing the game?

The whole idea was to start with a low amount of credits and make more whether by trading, collecting bounty, collecting cargo or ore and selling it.

Being able to buy in-game credits just means you don't have to do the things necessary in game to make those credits, so what is the point of playing?

I have Buffet for FFE, and I can change my ship to any ship in the game, add any equipment I want, change my Elite ranking and Imperial or Federal rankings and I can change how many credits I have. All very nice, but then I am left wondering "what is the point in even playing?"

Buy in-game credits for real world cash? ... sorry but NO

 

[Styggron]

Hi Kipper
Although I can understand why Frontier want to do this (it helps maintain servers) I am with you 100% on this. The whole ethos of Elite was earning your way, taking the knocks, overcoming setbacks and learning your way around the galaxy. Paying for game credits is tantamount to cheating in my view. Sure you will be able to buy all the best kit, but where is the accomplishment after a lot of hard fighting and trading?

I spent months of game time in FE2, saving up for my first military drive. When I finally fitted it into my old bucket of a ship, I felt so proud

Mind you it didn't last long when I discovered you couldn't get free fuel for it

100% in agreement.
I know why Frontier want to do this but it is against the ethos IMHO. It is also just like SC.

I'm with ALIEN I'd say NO to this BUT....with what Steve says, if this is what it takes to get ELITE funded then so be it. I won't be buying a SINGLE credit. I will start with 100 credits and I'll build from there!

[ED: typos again]

 

[Styggron]

i enjoy playing elite using my keyboard, not my credit-card.

nice !

 

[Maliker]

I agree with most of you guys on this. I remember that incredible rewarding feeling when I actually could afford the Boa and beeing able to make some decent cash while trading. As a contrast, in Freelancer you basically got handed the better ships on a silver plate, and that actually took some of the fun out of it.

However, in Elite: Dangerous I can actually see the value of having creds4cash. I'm assuming the SP and MP will be different gameplays and that the SP profile isn't transferable to MP. So if I play single player for some time, get the ship I want and doing the missions I enjoy, I might just cash in for some creds to get the same setup for multiplayer.

Alot of assumptions, I know. But this will be a server based MP and not a mmo, so it seems logical to me.

 

[Winterdyne]

Makes no odds to me. Probably sensible to directly monetise ships and equipment (for collection at major systems like Sol) as well, not just credits.

Bear in mind the MP element is very loose; there's no real advantage to having paid RL money for kit (in fact a lack of practice could be a distinct DISadvantage).

 

[rgmarett]

I don't mind micro transactions at all, even cash for credits is fine. Star Citizen will be doing this...but...Star Citizen will be having regular (weekly) FREE updates. The micro transactions fund those updates.
The Elite kickstarter page says Elite Dangerous will have DLC but it'll be more traditional in the sense that you pay for each expansion - so in that regards ED shouldn't have micro transactions. You can't have it both ways.
If you need to 'fund' the servers you charge the right amount for the game in the first place - this model reminds me of how Call of Duty works. You pay one price for the game, no micro transactions, pay for DLC if you want more maps - though not compulsory if you want to play the game.

 

[shrapnel]

I kind of object to this on an overall scale as a trend in current video gaming. It's like people don't want to invest time in games, so they are things that just come and go. I don't see Elite as the sort of game you play for a month and then move onto the next big release. The idea of skipping the perceived "boring grind" part of the game is missing the point, to me, and failing to appreciate what Elite games have always been about.

As mentioned, this also means you would have people flying ships they don't have the skill to fly, and polluting their own experience because of their own impatience. As such, I feel that anyone that wants to pay extra money to bypass "actually playing the game" then they need to sit back and reflect on why they wanted to play the game in the first place. It's essentially like changing chess so that you can buy extra knights for a tenner, or a new queen for fifty notes.

Still, ultimately, if it works as a way of getting paid for FD, then fair enough. If people are so impatient that they actually do pay out, on top of the cost of the game, to bypass having to play the game, then good luck. It would only really matter to me if it was "conventional MMOG", as long as I can stay pretty single player in all this then what other players choose to do has no impact on me whatsoever.

However, I refuse to not be outraged about the overall concept of "Pay to win" being a "thing" in video games.

 

[Alien]

DB just commented on this :

On the 'buying money' debate, as Bill Irving originally said, this will probably happen in some way via Chinese money-farmers and eBay if we don't allow it. The way I see it, some people can play very nearly 24/7, whereas others only get to play games intermittently. This gives a chance to catch up with your friends. We do not force you to do it, but the revenue it generates will help fund the servers, so I see this (or something like it) as very helpful.
Please remember this is not affecting the skill or rating elements of the game - and doesn't affect you at all if you play within a closed group.

 

[Steve]

My first instinct is to be against it, but I have to accept that gaming has moved on and this is how things now operate. As others have said, it surely takes away most of the challenge of the game, but is it really that different from hacking your savegame file in Elite, or using Buffet in FFE?
If it helps fund the game, servers, whatever then it has its uses, I guess

 

[Kipper]

DB has a point about the chinese gold farmers. Which indirectly answers the question as to whether there will be a way to personally transfer money between individual players.

I'm not against being able to buy game money as long as it doesn't lead to people having a direct advantage over others in a competitive game; usually the way around that is to say that by playing more, you can earn the same stuff as people who can play less but spend more get.

First worry is that with Elite, it will turn people off the game who do this. Without the incentive to need to make money to get bigger ships and better equipment, what do you do in game? The day-to-day activities of a space pilot are making money through whatever means they choose, but when you don't need to do that?

Will these players end up contributing one decent sum then never playing the game again? Whereas smaller transactions for cool stuff but that isn't money would lead to people keep wanting to play (and pay), because they have a personalized experience and stuff have things to aim for?

 

[Zak Gordon]

I really hope this isn't to substitute for a badly launched KS? As in "ok so maybe we won't get as much money as we hoped from the KS BUT what if we added in-game real cash purchases? That could help the financial side of things?" etc

Commit a proper effort at the KS (and on your own site here) and you'll find yourself able to meet Chris Roberts effort of funding generation.

As an aside i plan to play both these games in solo/single player mode anyway, as that is what made the original Elite (and Wing Commander) so fun, it was my own skills vs the game, not my cheque-book vs everybody else's. Just saying. I really hope the idea isn't to create a MMO player-griefing PVP type experience around an 'Elite-like' shell, where's the fun in that (especially if you can buy your way to victory)?

 

[Aewarin Jameson]

As others have said, it surely takes away most of the challenge of the game

Only if you purchase some.

Simply put - if you want to play it the "pure" way - trade and deal your way up - that's fine .. If you choose to purchase some credits - to me that's fine also. As long as (as per Kipper) what you do doesn't affect me I dont care what you do.

The sad thing on the comments were the knee jerk reactions from people who couldn't define in what way THEIR game would be ruined by someone else purchasing credits ... It only affects them if someone PK's you and that's unlikely if you play with friends / solo.

 

[Kipper]

What about if you PK someone in a real-cash bought ship because they don't know how to fly it, and they can't afford the insurance money to re-fly?

The slight worry there is that after they've thrown their mouse/keyboard at the wall, they'll simply stop playing because they don't have the patience, skill or knowledge to be able to make credits through in game activities.

Paying or not, if people stop playing for whatever reason then the game won't receive as many updates.

Anyway, I'd still like to see some form of restriction on some things via the Elite Federation; some ships or equipment might require you to hold a certain Elite rating, no matter how much money you have.

 

[Alien]

I have been thinking on the exchange rate between real cash and in game credits,
As long as the rate isn't too high, it should not be too bad.
Let's take a 100MW Beam Laser as an example,
Say it costs 500,000 credits to buy, and the rate is £1 = 1,000 credits,
that laser is still going to cost £500 in real cash.
I can't see many people dumping that much money in the game to buy equipment.
The problems will come if the rate is higher than that.