Hardware & Technical CH Fighterstick Vs Warthog (stick only): help me wasting my money.

Njos

N
First of all I'm talking about the stick only. I'll grab a CH Pro Throttle for the combo.

I've read quite a lot about those sticks and their pros and cons, still can't really make a "better" out of the two. The fact is that not many of those reviews I've read were talking about spacesim but mostly about flightsim: civil or combat, WW1 WW2 or modern warfare, doghfighting, bombing, naval....... Basically the CH products are famous to last forever without having a glitch, but they're plasticky and light. Someone doesn't like the 2 axis mechanic but I didn't really get why. I also didn't really get what is that presumed "sloppyness of the centering" which seems to affect the CH fighterstick. The warthog on the other hand is stiff, metallic and heavy, gives a much better sensation but is anyway somehow poorer in built constructions (talking mostly about buttons here) and it's not gonna last really forever, and given the higher cost I'd be quite unpleased to have to re-buy it in 2-3 even 5 years. But its main con is that it's even too stiff and some of those "pro pilots" strongly advice against it for close dogfighting and bombing since it's nearly impossible to make very light movements and adjustments of the trajectory. This would be a no-go for me since in ED fast turning and flying in FA off needs to be kinda neat, agile and fast in those adjustments, even if it's quite different from a bombing run where you basically have to stay in line with your target, or -say- a landing platform.

So, people who tried both or at least one, please have a say now :)
 

Severian

Severian
Full CH set, wouldn't trade them for anything else I've tried. Never tried a Warthog though.

Tiny bit of wobble on the stick, but not on the sensors, they are smooth as butter. No centring issues at all.
 

Siggi

Siggi
The CH uses pots, which can wear out and give errors but in the CH sticks are extremely high quality. The Warthog uses contactless magnetic sensors which will *never* wear out.

The CH is a 'desktop' stick, the Warthog is more of a cockpit stick that ideally wants to be fixed down and have an extension fitted to give it lighter leverage and greater precision.

For a desktop space sim I'd recommend the CH stick.
 

Tarman

Tarman
I have the full CH setup too, and also highly recommend it. They are made of plastic, yes, and not showy. But they are super solid kit; industrial-grade plastic, not Walmart dollar-toy plastic. They are fairly light but you also don't need to reef on them to get them to do anything; I've found the stick to be very fluid once you realize you don't need to wrestle it.

I can understand about a centering issue seeming for some, if you just pull back and let go of the stick on an axis it'll go boioioioioing a bit. There's not a huge pull back to centre; if you're used to a stick that luurrves its centre position then it could feel weird. But again I'd comment that this is due to not needing to fight the stick so much in the first place, as guide it where you need to be. No wrist fatigue from extended maneuvers that keep you out of stick-centre.

Buttons are very well placed and set-up; there aren't any that are useless or feel awkward to use. Good response and feel from them. With the full set of kit the only controls I left on the keyboard were the lights and the Throw Away Your Entire Hold By Mistake button. That's without even touching the programming software for it. I can only say I've heard it's good since I haven't actually needed it yet.

As far as the third axis, yeah, if you like stick twist then the Fighterstick is a nogo from the start; doesn't have it. That's about the only minus I could think of for someone looking at the CH kit. Otherwise I'd recommend it over anything out there. It does cost a bit but it'll last forever, and without the super-sketchy QC and support issues surrounding newer Saitek offerings.
 

David Oliver

David Oliver
My brother and I have the triple-CH setup, and both purchased relatively recently. He got to lay his hands on a friend's Warthog, and tells me that it almost seems to "stick" once you've moved it to a position and that it requires some force to move again. He reckons the CH stick is better for games which require small and quick adjustments, such as ED.

Regarding the throttle, we've found that the mini thumb joystick doesn't center very well (it often settles on a point slightly above center - a generous deadzone in the CH software takes care of this well enough for me) and mine is a little too firm for my liking (I'm hoping I can reduce the friction somehow). My brother is currently on his second throttle return to scan.co.uk as one button from each of his first two didn't work properly. But I think we'll both be pleased overall; it's great to have so many usable buttons and that mini joystick for vertical and lateral thrusting available to the left hand.
 
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Njos

N
Tarman said:
They are fairly light but you also don't need to reef on them to get them to do anything; I've found the stick to be very fluid once you realize you don't need to wrestle it.
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I shouldn't say so, but I'm not sure that's a pro for me. I've always been using the x52 so far, which is very light and really entry level, but I'm not used to fly with 2 fingers on the stick. I'd like to make some kind of effort so that longer and extensive maneuvers give a sort of feedback of being "harder" to execute, but probably you can have that only with a proper force feedback mechanic which is missing anyway. So, I'm prolly just a bad pilot and should learn to fly :D
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Tarman said:
As far as the third axis, yeah, if you like stick twist then the Fighterstick is a nogo from the start; doesn't have it. That's about the only minus I could think of for someone looking at the CH kit. Otherwise I'd recommend it over anything out there. It does cost a bit but it'll last forever, and without the super-sketchy QC and support issues surrounding newer Saitek offerings.
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Yeah that's the second big guess. Used the x52 as my first hotas and I'm gonna miss the twist for sure, but in ED one must forget to yaw anyway so I believe I can cope with(out) that :)

So so..... anyone standing for the shiny warthog?
 
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Cmdr Thrudd

Cmdr Thrudd
Got all CH still here too and can't fault it. They're not great looking but not that it matters anyway when you're staring at the screen. They're fantastically well build, responsive and really comfortable. I've had many a 12 hour gaming session with no discomfort at all.
 

Siggi

Siggi
Njos said:
So so..... anyone standing for the shiny warthog?
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Only if a purchaser is intending to mount it and fit an extension (and then use two rubber gear-stick boots from a Ford to replace the loss of stiffness caused by fitting the extension). Mine is hard-mounted between my thighs, aka a real plane, and it makes a big difference vs a free desk-standing solution.
 

Njos

N
David Oliver said:
How do you mean, Njos? Yaw is still important for minor aiming adjustments, no?
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Well..... no :)

I yaw only for approaching stations and landing pads or some other "fine" maneuver I could do as well by strafing, such as while mining and scooping cans but in combat.... never used it.

But my main problem is that I'm one of those weirdos that has yaw mapped on the x-axis and roll on twist. I like this way exactly because the twist is "stiffer" than the x/y-axis and gives me the sensation of better control over the maneuver even if it's using roll as if it was a thruster instead of a proper engine turning on his axis. Maybe in a couple of days I'll get used having roll on x though, and learn to fly properly :)
 
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David Oliver

David Oliver
I see. I can't try yaw on twist as the CH stick doesn't twist, of course. I've never tried yaw on roll either, as I bought the pedals at the same time as the stick and throttle, but I imagine it would annoy me. I should probably try it out as I don't find the pedals great for small adjustments, but maybe I'll get better with them with practice. I'm a piloting noob, by the way.
 
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Non Grata

Non Grata
Siggi said:
The CH is a 'desktop' stick, the Warthog is more of a cockpit stick that ideally wants to be fixed down and have an extension fitted to give it lighter leverage and greater precision.

For a desktop space sim I'd recommend the CH stick.
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Absolutely agree - consider the TM stuff if you're building a cockpit, otherwise the CH stuff is probably easier to deal with.

Personally I'm not convinced pairing a heavy TM stick with a light CH throttle would feel right.
 

Morbad

Morbad
David Oliver said:
I see. I can't try yaw on twist as the CH stick doesn't twist, of course. I've never tried yaw on roll either, as I bought the pedals at the same time as the stick and throttle, but I imagine it would annoy me. I should probably try it out as I don't find the pedals great for small adjustments, but maybe I'll get better with them with practice. I'm a piloting noob, by the way.
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The CH Pedals are fine for small adjustments with a bit of practice, especially if you put a sensitivity slope in the software.
 

BigC208

B
I've had pretty much the full range of CH Products over the last 20 years. It all still works exept one button on my F16 Combat Stick has gone bad. When the Thrustmaster Cougar came out I bought that and wore both the throttle and stick out in less than two years. Went back to the CH gear for a few years untill the Warthog was released. Also swapped the pro pedals out for a set of MFG Crosswind rudder pedals that are awsome. Still, I got a good 10 years of service out of the usb pro pedals. So, CH Product quality is very good. The Warthog stick has stiffer springs than the Combat stick and feels better in my hands. I put a 7.5cm extension on the Warthog and now it's even better. Had the set now for little over a year and no problems so far.

If you are on a tight budget get CH products. The combination of the Warthog Hotas and the MFG Croswind is around $700. If you can swing that kind of expenditure, do it. It feels so much more precise than CH products.
 

Njos

N
BigC208 said:
The Warthog stick has stiffer springs than the Combat stick and feels better in my hands. I put a 7.5cm extension on the Warthog and now it's even better. Had the set now for little over a year and no problems so far.

If you are on a tight budget get CH products. The combination of the Warthog Hotas and the MFG Croswind is around $700. If you can swing that kind of expenditure, do it. It feels so much more precise than CH products.
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So you're saying that you didn't feel the lack of precision in fine maneuvering with the Warthog stick? I've seen the MFG Crosswind but I'm a nasty wookie and won't use pedals at all

Now, what if I throw in the fuss the Defender Cobra M5? I know it has less buttons/pov/hats and it's cheaper, but anyone knows how it is in regards to sensors and maneuvering in general? This guy looks pretty happy https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Qsrt_Sc4Seo&feature=youtu.be even if it compares it to the T-16000m and the Logitech which imho isn't the same ballpark. The Cobra is superior on all aspects. Probably not the same ballpark of the bigger brothers either but also costs less than the half of em
 
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BigC208

B
I liked the Warthogs sensitivity and precision from the moment I got it. The reason I got the stick extension was so I could attach the stick under my office chair and still reach it. Nice side effect is that the longer throw makes it even more precise than it allready was. I can now manouvre with very small corrections. I used to fly gliders with a control stick and this is as close as it gets.
 

Scrogg

S
One thing to consider is the software. If you are already going with the CH throttle you might be better off staying with CH for the stick as well. It is my understanding that the CH software provides a lot more function when all of the components are CH.
 

Njos

N
Just ordered the CH Fighterstick. Only problem: this very morning the Pro Throttle went out of stock damnit.

Might consider buying it in the usa, I'd spend some 20-ish quids more for import fees and shipping. Meh I'll see if it comes back available in the next week.

Thanks to all ;)
 
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Darkfyre99

Darkfyre99
Full CH HOTAS for the win.

CH's Control Manager software is robust, and the hardware is programmable as well. If you're going to get the throttle, then get the joystick as well to take full advantage of it. And the hardware itself is extremely durable. My first CH HOTAS didn't wear out, technology moved on and I had to buy the USB set because it became hard to find gameport cards.

edit:

Ninja'd! :)

I may be biased, but I think you made the right decision, and sorry to hear you won't get the Pro Throttle right away. :(
 
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