http://laveradio.com/the-conclave-episode-6-clash-of-clans-part-1/
O faint at my dulcet tones/high pitched whine.
O faint at my dulcet tones/high pitched whine.
Community Event / Creation Clash of Clans Podcasts vis a vis Group Mechanics
- Thread starter Anopheles
- Start date
Tar Stone
Banned
Posted this earlier today, it should be required listening for everyone playing ED right now.
I expected a massive discussion on here tbh. Listening to what the groups are actually doing and what they'd like to be doing, the penny finally dropped for me.
This is how we get a dynamic living galaxy, warts and all. I have serious reservations about FDs ability to get a basic bounty system in place never mind anything else, so it's probably time they engaged with these groups - and they can do that right now, there's nothing stopping them.
I expected a massive discussion on here tbh. Listening to what the groups are actually doing and what they'd like to be doing, the penny finally dropped for me.
This is how we get a dynamic living galaxy, warts and all. I have serious reservations about FDs ability to get a basic bounty system in place never mind anything else, so it's probably time they engaged with these groups - and they can do that right now, there's nothing stopping them.
I alt-f4'd at "guilds". I just cannot understand this mentality in Elite.
Tar Stone
Banned
With respect it's actually worth listening to the whole discussion. They aren't just talking about one topic and they aren't pulling any punches either. There's a lot of good stuff in there that would work beautifully with the game we have, not the game that's still lying in the DDF.
Respectfully - I can absolutely guarantee that it's composed mainly of "We want group mechanics, we want player owned stations, we want contested space for groups to fight over, and we want Open to have greater impacts and rewards than those scum Solo cowards, FD have no clue how a group game works the way we want it to do, and pets would be nice too!"
Yes. I am about halfway through now. It is a very interesting listen. One point of TL;DR: people are social, and stick around longer because of the bonds and friendships formed. Limiting groups too much is dangerous for long term retention of players. Even within the few groups ED has, some are already having trouble keeping their members interested in playing the game at all (for a whole constellation of reasons)
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i'll be interested in what Möbius has to say when they interview him
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i'll be interested in what Möbius has to say when they interview him
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Indeed - I'd look forward to that!
he's on the roster for a following episode I think
Tar Stone
Banned
What grabbed me was when one of the guys (apologies don't remember his name) said that solo players and single player commanders in open are booting up the game at each update, playing for a while... and then shelving it until the next update.
That's exactly what I've been doing.
Lugh was fun for a weekend, but doing it again somewhere else... I don't know, it hasn't really got any longevity.
That's exactly what I've been doing.
Lugh was fun for a weekend, but doing it again somewhere else... I don't know, it hasn't really got any longevity.
Me too - I play games when I want to enjoy a particular game. I don't feel any need to force myself to play any particular game at a time when I don't fancy it. Currently I'm going back through the Baldurs Gate series in between working, fixing my motorbike and writing a bass duet with a friend. If I have time to play Elite, and I want to - then I'll pop on for a bit and mess around in a Sidey or try and rebuild my Asp they way I had it before it got messed up with poor "upgrades". It's complete freedom to do as one pleases.
Group play takes some of that freedom away, as a member of some groups - you have some behaviours forced upon you. Wether it's mandatory play times, kill on sight lists, tithing, or leader hero-worship, there is always something that puts the group beyond the individual. In a game like Elite, where you are the focus of the gameplay, and groups are barely catered for, it seems counterproductive to me to put any reward bias to grouping at all.
My god everywhere i go you are like the beacon of solo hope, denouncing Open play and all it's objective benefits from the rooftops.
I don't play in Solo much
I just cannot stand guildies. OK - let me amend that. I cannot stand what "guild" expectations have become to the modern gamer. There was a time when grouping up with others was to increase the enjoyment of a game, enjoy the social experience and perhaps help out those with less time to devote to a game, or who's character lacked certain skills to build/craft/find/fight something. Belonging to a group helped out with those issues.Then there came a time when groups wanted to dominate, instead of simply helping each other. It all went downhill from there, and the "guild" became more important than the "player".
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Groups are as varied as people. Some are strict and disciplined. Others are easy going. I played in a WoW guild that was just the guys from work, and a few friends. It was great fun. Pigeonholing and stereotyping groups isn't helpful.
Tar Stone
Banned
The point I'm making, which was the same point made by the guy in the podcast - is that I'll not be booting up ED until the next update arrives. I share your your opinion on guilds, but I heard things from these guys that made me sit up and pay attention. After listening I have the distinct impression that it would be to the severe detriment of the game to completely ignore what these guys are actually doing and have done for the game already. If we're not even going to LISTEN to a player who is running large scale events with large numbers of players then we're sitting waiting for Frontier to implement everything else that's in the DDF.
The classic solo Elite experience that I had hoped for with Elite Dangerous isn't there and it isn't coming. That dream died when offline was ditched. Frontier have put all their eggs in the online basket - there are no persistent NPCs to chase around the galaxy, there is no real danger from the AI, we all zippity doo dah across hundreds of light years with absolutely nothing happening in between.
If it's going to be an online game then it's going to need to take a look at some of this stuff being discussed. It isn't delivering a solo experience and it isn't delivering a genuine multiplayer experience either.
If I was Braben for one day, I'd scrap solo mode completely, and probably be hunted like a filthy rabid dog til the end of my days.
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That was a interesting listen. I think FD should listen to it as well.
An interesting Interview, with some interesting thoughts on the impact of groups. my personal view is that while groups are not a bad thing but they can unbalance some situations that can then force people to either be in a group or dont play. While I liked the concept of EVE and tried to learn and play as an individual, it does not really work.
This is the very core of the group meta game Vs the individual player, the issue as I see it, EVE is EVE & good for those who want, enjoy and play the bigger meta game it has taken time to reach this place, and be pretty good at it.
ED is going to evolve but how it evolves without pushing out the individual player will take some time and should be a seen as positive learning curve for both FD and the players, there will be mistakes and things will have to be tried, some will work some will fail, as players though we have to manage our expectations, and perhaps be both open to each others thoughts without the toxicity that some of the forum meta game brings.
This is the very core of the group meta game Vs the individual player, the issue as I see it, EVE is EVE & good for those who want, enjoy and play the bigger meta game it has taken time to reach this place, and be pretty good at it.
ED is going to evolve but how it evolves without pushing out the individual player will take some time and should be a seen as positive learning curve for both FD and the players, there will be mistakes and things will have to be tried, some will work some will fail, as players though we have to manage our expectations, and perhaps be both open to each others thoughts without the toxicity that some of the forum meta game brings.
Look, the whole "can't play unless in guild" thing may be true in EVE, but this isn't EVE. ED has 400 billion system, instances, and Solo play. Groups could never hamstring things here like they do over there. Plus, EVE is just one game. There are plenty of MMOs where guilds are not nearly as powerful, but still allow players that social aspect of the game.
We're so worried about being EVE, we've stopped thinking about what would make a good multiplayer version of Elite. But that brings me to the other part raised in the podcast: It's Frontier's game to make, and it's their customers to win. If they don't think clans are a good idea, then they shouldn't implement them.
This is the great age of space sims. There's no lack of player choice. For example, I've backed Star Citizen, Rodina, Pulsar Lost Colony and Limit Theory. No Man's Sky is also just around the corner. And we still have the classics. I've never played EVE, but all the talk around here suggests its a game I might like. I am very very tempted to check it out. If I were to do that, I wouldn't be jumping ship -- I've already paid my investment to FD, and I can log back in and check it out whenever the mood strikes. Plus, they have my money, so nothing is lost if I pick up another game for a while.
We're so worried about being EVE, we've stopped thinking about what would make a good multiplayer version of Elite. But that brings me to the other part raised in the podcast: It's Frontier's game to make, and it's their customers to win. If they don't think clans are a good idea, then they shouldn't implement them.
This is the great age of space sims. There's no lack of player choice. For example, I've backed Star Citizen, Rodina, Pulsar Lost Colony and Limit Theory. No Man's Sky is also just around the corner. And we still have the classics. I've never played EVE, but all the talk around here suggests its a game I might like. I am very very tempted to check it out. If I were to do that, I wouldn't be jumping ship -- I've already paid my investment to FD, and I can log back in and check it out whenever the mood strikes. Plus, they have my money, so nothing is lost if I pick up another game for a while.
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Do we know when the next episode will be released?
Hi Guys
The next Episode should be recorded next Sunday and released shortly after.
Really glad it is sparking some debate, all credit to the guys that came on
ShadowGar from Emperor's Grace
Jp Anopheles from The Code (not the same as Eve Online)
Ian Honcharenko from Volcspac
And finally James Griffin from Big Harry Boys
Cheers
The next Episode should be recorded next Sunday and released shortly after.
Really glad it is sparking some debate, all credit to the guys that came on
ShadowGar from Emperor's Grace
Jp Anopheles from The Code (not the same as Eve Online)
Ian Honcharenko from Volcspac
And finally James Griffin from Big Harry Boys
Cheers