Coasters that fit multiple trains/cars in the station- unloading issue/thought

[Skyscraper1]

I finallygot Planet Coaster recently (it's awesome), and there is one main thing that I think should be changed; on coasters that fit multiple trains/cars in the station, the cars should unload guests straight away, not wait until they get to the front of the station. guests are just left waiting for ages, especially if a coaster is quiet.
Thoughts?

 

[ojonas]

A very similar thread about this was just started earlier today: https://forums.planetcoaster.com/showthread.php/30613-Stations-Need-an-Overhaul

Basically, the way it works now mimics the real world throughput very well. Any faster load and unload time and you will throw off the financials in the game and make it way too easy. It is already too easy to make money off coaster.

So from a simulation point of view, speeding this up will not be good. I agree that it would be nice to have the option of multiple stations etc. from a purely aesthetic point of view.

 

[LN]

A very similar thread about this was just started earlier today: https://forums.planetcoaster.com/showthread.php/30613-Stations-Need-an-Overhaul

Basically, the way it works now mimics the real world throughput very well. Any faster load and unload time and you will throw off the financials in the game and make it way too easy. It is already too easy to make money off coaster.

So from a simulation point of view, speeding this up will not be good. I agree that it would be nice to have the option of multiple stations etc. from a purely aesthetic point of view.

Agreed.

The key is to find the right configuration and track layout so all trains are constantly moving except the one in the station. Once that one leaves the next one should arrive.

 

[AngryH1]

The whole loading/unloading process in general is another thing that hasn't seen fundamental improvement since development. The fact that guests waiting to board stand there until the previous group is entirely off the platform makes no sense either, and slows things down so needlessly.

Thankfully they've tweaked queuing behavior in other ways so I rarely run into a real issue with it being the likely root cause of long lines anymore, but it's still an annoying behavior to watch.

 

[LN]

The whole loading/unloading process in general is another thing that hasn't seen fundamental improvement since development. The fact that guests waiting to board stand there until the previous group is entirely off the platform makes no sense either, and slows things down so needlessly.

Thankfully they've tweaked queuing behavior in other ways so I rarely run into a real issue with it being the likely root cause of long lines anymore, but it's still an annoying behavior to watch.

Waiting is never fun. Seeing people wait is boring as well. yet still, waiting is part of the process. If waiting takes to long hit "O" 2 times. Then another time when the waiting is over.

 

[AngryH1]

Yeah, I know this board loves to try to spin a web of made-up justification for a quirk or flaw in the game in the process of discounting a complaint, but I don't buy it. It's not there to teach you a parable about life and waiting. It's there because the loading process is artificially hard scripted to play out one step at a time, yielding an inorganic and nonsensical result, both visually and mechanically. In the real world unless there's some specific technical or safety reason, seats start to be filled the moment they're empty. There's a reason exits and entrances are so often on opposite sides of the platform. So it certainly doesn't happen the way it does because it's more realistic. Waiting is what happens in queues. The platform is a high-volume processing station, people standing around with cars waiting there means something's gone wrong.

It's time to get out of the habit of responding to a complaint by saying "here's how you ignore it, or change your viewpoint of it entirely to be mine." Not every complaint needs to be responded to with gaslighting or diversionary "actually...."s. Let them live and breathe. The game will survive negative feedback, it's a big boy.

As to the economy thing, which is an actual point, I don't think it needs to be relevant to this situation. They're two separate issues, and the loading speeds are not the core reason the economy is so easy or ineffective as a game mechanic. Price-response behavior on rides can be easily tweaked to adjust for higher throughput speeds if necessary.

*edit* I should also say my feelings about the loading process have nothing to do with their relation to real life times. I get the point trying to be made by the Super Official calculations about how loading times match up to real world times now, but we're talking about an in-game universe where it takes guests a week to walk across a large park, so that particular relationship is pretty irrelevant I think lol.

 

[LN]

As to the economy thing, which is an actual point, I don't think it needs to be relevant to this situation. They're two separate issues, and the loading speeds are not the core reason the economy is so easy or pointless as a game mechanic. Price-response behavior on rides can be easily tweaked to adjust for higher throughput speeds if necessary.

This still depends on the way the game(all necessary elements that involve economics) is designed.

I'm no dev, nor do I have any other knowledge with game development other than playing the games themselves, but even then I still think designwise this is a good solution.
The average boarding sequence in PC costs 18 seconds, which is facter than most real life coasters. Now I am no sucker for reality, yes, the process could be edited to make them do their actions simultaniously (boarding/exiting) but it should still take at least 18 seconds, as this is still much faster than any coasters I have seen IRL, but that's due to restraints checks and stuff that are not in the game.

So yeah, I understand the part of looking at peeps waiting to get onboard while others are exiting and the feeling it gives, maybe we should flood the station with more animations so it doesn't look so time-wasting?

I think this one is a minor case, and I wouldnot mind if the devs keep it as it is.

edit: this post only mentions coasters, tracked rides are IMO a different ball game that might need adjustments.

 

[AngryH1]

90% of my complaint about the system could be solved by simply changing the animation of it, yes. Like I said I don't need it to be empirically faster, I want it to look like it makes sense. Although before they fixed the absurd queue pile-ups, the current system WAS imposing an unnecessary negative mechanic on the game because it was a big reason things were backing up so much. And they've fixed that by forcing guests to spread out to other attractions moreso than changing the actual line speed.

But for the other 10%, I still think there's no reason to impose an artificial "stand around and wait" time on the routine. If you want to micromanage a ride's configuration to the point that it can literally assembly line guests one train after another, you should be able to.

But yes my ideal ride behavior would be one that just visually makes sense. Unless it's a ride where exiting guests have to cross the path of entering guests, let people start boarding as soon as butts leave the seats. And for coasters that would usually mean always, since platforms automatically configure themselves to have separated pre-seating stalls and exit gates on the track.

And if we're going whole hog, my true ideal would be to have assignable staff members standing there waiting to seat and strap in riders, which would provide a reason for boarding to take a period of time, add a satisfying managerial element with the choice about how many assistants to have working, and provide a better visual experience (and one that makes sense).

 

[Vanamerax]

And if we're going whole hog, my true ideal would be to have assignable staff members standing there waiting to seat and strap in riders, which would provide a reason for boarding to take a period of time, add a satisfying managerial element with the choice about how many assistants to have working, and provide a better visual experience (and one that makes sense).

This would be my best solution as well. Ideally, operators would be hireable staff just like vendors are since the latest update. Rollercoasters require 2 operators, one for the control panel and one for checking seats. Add boarding animations when guests enter and exit the their seats to increase time a little to make up for the time waiting for a clear station. Then let guests put down their own restraints (again, animation), an operator checks the whole train from front to back and gives the green light.

This way, longer trains also take longer to check (more seats for the operator to check) so there arises a track design-specific balancing task. Longer and fewer trains? Shorter and more trains? Depends on the track length and number of block sections. E.g. how fast the trains return to the station compared to how long loading a train takes. This will also improve the throughput for low seat number rides (think wild mouse, Looney Tunes, log flumes) which now seem notoriously slow.

If Frontier would implement this alongside with managable operator staff, you could call me excited. [happy]

 

[LN]

This way, longer trains also take longer to check (more seats for the operator to check) so there arises a track design-specific balancing task. Longer and fewer trains? Shorter and more trains? Depends on the track length and number of block sections. E.g. how fast the trains return to the station compared to how long loading a train takes. This will also improve the throughput for low seat number rides (think wild mouse, Looney Tunes, log flumes) which now seem notoriously slow.

But longer trains already take slightly more time because there are more guetss exiting the platform.

It's actually the shorter trains where there is almost nothing to gain, even when you are designing the track around it. (that's why I say tracked rides might need some improvements).
But the Barghest (Gerstlauer Eurofighter) is actually a coaster with a crappy capacity IRL as well, great for smaller parks but not for overcrowded parks.