Coriolis Station Physics

[drew]

I've just worked out, because I could, the internal centripetal G of the Coriolis station and the station isn't rotating fast enough, or it's much bigger than previous estimates.

I assumed that the station was 1km in diameter, as per the original Elite manual.

One complete rotation takes about 80 seconds, about 4.5 degrees s-1

That gives:

Radius (R) = 500 metres
Angular Velocity (Ὠ) = 4.5 degrees s-1

Centripetal acceleration at the outside edge is therefore 0.315 G. Nowhere near enough for the 1G we're after - though it would be quite usable.

To achieve 1G at the outside edge, the Coriolis needs to be significantly larger at the current spin rate.

I've calculated it as follows.

Desired Centripetal Acceleration = 1G
Angular velocity (Ὠ) = 4.5 degrees s-1

Radius (R) = 1590 m

Thus, if the Coriolis is producing 1G at the outside edge, it's over 3km in diameter.

If someone could time the rotation more precisely I can give a more accurate figure.

It would also be interesting to see if people can estimate the size by some cooperative triangulation in the multiplayer, if you can put away your guns for a few moments...

Cheers,

Drew.

 

[Deaks]

Its my understanding that the coriolis stations aren't supposed to be big enough/spin fast enough to generate 1G. A third of normal gravity is sufficient to prevent things floating around while enabling individuals to lift cargo canisters unassisted.

(Edit) Just noticed your other posting covering the idea of moving canisters unassisted. Power loaders it is then!

 

[Bobbydylan]

Maybe it's bigger on the inside?

 

[Captain N]

Couldn't you just measure the size by looking at the reported distance in the HUD? (Which would be your distance to the middle of the station I presume)

However, my guess would be the gravity is purposely left lower than 1G.

 

[popuptoaster]

Some people have to much time on their hands! i'm sure its right for what looks best even if it happens to be a bit out for reality (which im not sure it is, looks bigger than 1k across to me)

probably be better off in a maths class than gaming if all your gonna worry about is station spin rates and cargo handling. :S

 

[Frank]

Does it say in the literature that they spin the station at one Gee? They might spin is slower to reduce the coriolis effect. Maybe there's a few spacers out there that just can't handle a full Gee.

Maybe it's a compromise in the size of the station an the difficulty in docking at a higher rotational speed.

Why is the docking door a horizontal slot? Surely a circular door bigger than the wingspan of spaceships would be a bit easier on the paint?

 

[Maxeren]

Is the coriolis a big or small station in the elite universe? i saw drew mentioned 1km from the books, but the station in alpha3 looks bigger than that..

 

[Slythe]

Does it say in the literature that they spin the station at one Gee? They might spin is slower to reduce the coriolis effect. Maybe there's a few spacers out there that just can't handle a full Gee.

I'm pretty sure that Braben said that the outer levels of the station simulated 1G, as well as having some of the best views, and were used for the most expensive housing apartments as a result.

Maybe there's a few spacers out there that just can't handle a full Gee.

The inner levels will be at lower Gs.

Why is the docking door a horizontal slot? Surely a circular door bigger than the wingspan of spaceships would be a bit easier on the paint?

A larger door would be more difficult to defend and more expensive to close off with shields... ...and everyone likes to watch the crashes anyway!

 

[Patrick_68000]

if you can put away your guns for a few moments...
Cheers,Drew.

Watch out ! It is a trap !

 

[Darren Grey]

It looks bigger than 1km to me, but I'd certainly like to see some proper measurements to make certain. We obviously need to hold David to task for any scientific inaccuracies in the game

 

[Associat0r]

Michael Brookes already said some months ago that the Coriolis station in ED has been enlarged to be about 4KM in diameter.

It worries me that you fiction writers aren't getting up to date enough information.

 

[Patrick_68000]

It worries me that you fiction writers aren't getting up to date enough information.

Yes it is surprising

 

[Darren Grey]

We don't get a lot of specifics on things like this, since much of it is still being thrashed out. We couldn't tell you much in the way of ship specs that you don't already know, for instance.

Also, for the purposes of a story it's completely irrelevant. Or if it was relevant it would be individually flagged up.

 

[-o-]

I can feel a rewrite looming

 

[Iskariot]

David Braben himself was talking about 0.1G (if I am not mistaken), but whatever it is it is definitely not 1G.
He mentioned it in the so called Outside Broadcast part 1 or part 2 published by Lave Radio.
Also I do not really mind if it diverges from 'reality' a bit. If it is believable I am happy.
Gameplay first!

And as far as the size is concerned, I do not care at all. I love it the way it is.

 

[Cmdr Eagleboy]

According to David in space stations dev diary space stations usually won't have 1G, most likely 0.1G, which is very good for transporting goods around.

 

[Yaffle]

Just checking - do we need Allen to check Drew's figures?

 

[drew]

I believe that 0.1g was the simulated gravity inside the docking area, which is much closer to the axis of rotation. Assuming the docking area is say 250 metres in diameter this is about right.

My calculations show that if there is 1g at the outside edge the station needs to be bigger than 3km in diameter, thus if Michael has said that, it's consistent with physics as we know it.

I'd already calculated for my book the size the stations needed to be, so no need for me to rewrite. 1km was never going to be enough.

I'd be interested to know if the station in the Alpha is that size. If so, Frontier have done a good job on the physics.

Cheers,

Drew.

 

[Cmdr Eagleboy]

I believe that 0.1g was the simulated gravity inside the docking area, which is much closer to the axis of rotation.

My calculations show that if there is 1g at the outside edge the station needs to be bigger than 3km in diameter, thus if Michael has said that, it's consistent with physics as we know it.

I'd already calculated for my book the size the stations needed to be, so no need for me to rewrite. 1km was never going to be enough.

I'd be interested to know if the station in the Alpha is that size. If so, Frontier have done a good job on the physics.

Cheers,

Drew.

It is definitely more than 2km when I flew yesterday. Have to actually get in game to measure that of course Well, maybe in 3.1

 

[Cosmo Bozo]

I'm pretty sure that Braben said that the outer levels of the station simulated 1G, as well as having some of the best views, and were used for the most expensive housing apartments as a result.






A larger door would be more difficult to defend and more expensive to close off with shields... ...and everyone likes to watch the crashes anyway!

I'm not sure about that comment about the best views, yeah they would be the best views, but surely they it make you dizzy to actually look at them?


The door doesn't need to be bigger, it just needs to be rounder. I'm sure they just did that because it is how elite has always been, best just not to think about it too much