Death should = Credits only

Poacher886 · Oct 31, 2015

I have to say as a late comer to this sim (last 2 months) but an original '84' player i find it all to "laid on". I've only had a approx 6 dogfights and was killed in 3 of them, but what struck me is the lack of loss, its no wander there are so many persistent greifers in the Sim.

Its so easy to just "take off where you left off", and the numerous post's regarding the millions people are earning in a session its no wonder that greifers who already have a power house fully kitted top tier ship, can get shot up and just "take off where they left off" greifing again without anymore than a few minutes downtime. When you start pulling in the millions and lets face it this game just throws money at you for all orifices its no 'Hit' at all to get killed.

In order to provide some 'value' to your belongings, there should be a feeling of loss involved with dying, this in-turn makes folk more wary of just wading in regardless, which in-turn makes folk play with some caution and thus more realisticly. Getting dead should set you back, at least for a while.

I propose that when killed you lose your ship and equipment and all your left with is your credits. If you have enough to buy the same ship again then fine, but of course your then need to go shopping to equip it again and this takes time and more money which stops the instant "straight back as you were" scenario. If you dont have enough to buy your previous set-up then your have to go for a cheaper option, which will again at least provide some semblance of loss and a rightfully backwards step.

Lets face it, there is nothing to spend your money on in this sim apart from your ship, with money all to easily acquired, and a point reached where it just poors in, in its millions, there is no value to anything unless it can be lost. It would add the missing edge to the game and make persistent greifers either think twice or find them selfs in less and less potent craft.

Futuristic Kung Fu · Oct 31, 2015

You're still in a sidewinder? When you get into an Anaconda with 10s of millions of rebuy, you might change your mind. Although I agree with you that even a 30 million rebuy becomes very little when you have 2 billion in the bank... You could also have an insurance system where you need to pay for the insurance at high rates even if you don't crash your ship.

Defacto · Oct 31, 2015

It would be interesting if the reduced rebuy cost from insurance started tapering off as your net worth increased. Or something like that.
Don't expect your suggestion (100% rebuy cost) to ever happen. This is just too radical, I don't think FD would even consider it. I do agree that death (especially death caused by you going on a murderous rampage and then being taken down by a group of commanders) should have more consequences.

Groener · Oct 31, 2015

Sounds more like an invitation to more griefing than a solution tbh. Harassing expensive trade ships with millions of credits worth of cargo in a cheap disposable fighter would become a griefers wet dream.

Retu81 · Oct 31, 2015

Current system isn't that different from the way it was in the original Elite. You could buy an escape capsule that came with an insurance that covered the ship and the equipment minus the escape pod. Only differences in ED are that the escape capsule and insurance come as standard when you buy a ship and you don't need to fire the capsule manually.

Plaidygami · Oct 31, 2015

Groener said:
Sounds more like an invitation to more griefing than a solution tbh. Harassing expensive trade ships with millions of credits worth of cargo in a cheap disposable fighter would become a griefers wet dream.

This. That is a horrible idea.

CMDR Brock Samson · Oct 31, 2015

Let's go a step further: Death = the game automatically uninstalls itself.

xondk · Oct 31, 2015

Hrm idea is interesting, that people would need to go build the ship again, but they would have the money for it from insurance?
Course if people got their full value back when dying people would use that as a way to get more for a ship they are selling.

Maybe instead you still have to pay the insurance premium but instead of just getting ship you get vouchers for the various parts in your ship.
Then you would need to find a place that had the parts at those prices the vouchers were good for? say if you got 15% off your basic ship, then the voucher would only cover that amount? if you couldn't get the discount you would need to pay the difference?
would be same with the modules you'd need to find the places that sold those and claim them with the insurance voucher?

ShimEnki · Oct 31, 2015

Defacto said:
It would be interesting if the reduced rebuy cost from insurance started tapering off as your net worth increased. Or something like that.
Don't expect your suggestion (100% rebuy cost) to ever happen. This is just too radical, I don't think FD would even consider it. I do agree that death (especially death caused by you going on a murderous rampage and then being taken down by a group of commanders) should have more consequences.

I totally agree

and reduce the severity of friendly fire while increasing the severity of outright murder

Crimson Kaim · Oct 31, 2015

Futuristic Kung Fu said:
You're still in a sidewinder? When you get into an Anaconda with 10s of millions of rebuy, you might change your mind. Although I agree with you that even a 30 million rebuy becomes very little when you have 2 billion in the bank... You could also have an insurance system where you need to pay for the insurance at high rates even if you don't crash your ship.

The EVE insurance or .. the real life insurance would be appreciated. I mean just 5% of its costs? Imagine what a LOSS the insurance company has made until today.

CmdrJacks · Oct 31, 2015

Aggressor pays third-party CMDR insurance costs first, then if they have enough left, their own. Unless their target is wanted in the system, breaking the law invalidates their insurance but 3rd parties who are innocent are still covered. It's all meaningless if FDev keep making CGs with minimum tiers in the millions as it encourages people to flit between CGs, doing very little yet earning enough to keep risking their ship with reckless abandon.

Cmdr Wullfen · Oct 31, 2015

Easy enough to think that when your rebuy is a few thousand credits, also losing 50% of your battles will make for some nice costs later on in larger ships

Just erase your save when you die TC, in lieu of an Iron Man mode. Sounds like what you need

Kristov · Oct 31, 2015

CMDR Brock Samson said:
Let's go a step further: Death = the game automatically uninstalls itself.

No, a step further would be that when you die, you die, all credits, hardware and ranks are lost and you get to start all over again from the beginning.

Which would actually be something that would keep griefers down a bit, a Sidey isn't exactly dangerous after all.

Roraima · Oct 31, 2015

I think it should be the other way around - no consequence at all for being killed, i.e. no insurance re-buy. Would make people much less wary and much more likely to play in Open and participate.

Jockey79 · Oct 31, 2015

Crimson Kaim said:
...Imagine what a LOSS the insurance company has made until today.

Well, you don't if the current ship prices include lifetime insurance.

For example;

An Anaconda could really worth 50 million, the rest is the lifetime insurance we pay.
The sum on death is just Admin costs to process your claim.

Mark Lock · Oct 31, 2015

I don't agree, having to start over again would drive players away, especially those with expensive ships like Pythons, Orcas etc.. Having to find the parts again would be too boring as well, as it is now you pay a rebuy price to get your vehicle back you lose your accumulated bounties and merits, I think it is already fair enough, you get the sense of loss without ruining the fun.

I don't understand what you guys mean with GREIFING, there is none in this game, the only type of griefer here are those who log out to avoid the loss in combat

RidingTheFlow · Oct 31, 2015

Poacher886 said:
In order to provide some 'value' to your belongings, there should be a feeling of loss involved with dying

Wait till you trash you 50-million Fer-de-Lance, then realize that you just couple thousands short of insurance cost in your account (and now bye bye 50 millions).
This will give you quite some "feeling of loss"

Chainguns · Oct 31, 2015

We already have too many people in solo, too many people not experimenting, too many people pulling out their lan cable when interdicted. This is all because the death penalty is far too HIGH, not too low.

Lower the death penalty and people will stick around for fights, they will trade in the open and will try backflipping a T9 through the mailslot.

If you call for a higher death penalty, don't then start a thread that asks 'is this game dead? I haven't seen a live CMDR in x days!'

Ben Ryder · Oct 31, 2015

Iron man mode please

xondk · Oct 31, 2015

Mark Lock said:
I don't agree, having to start over again would drive players away, especially those with expensive ships like Pythons, Orcas etc.. Having to find the parts again would be too boring as well, as it is now you pay a rebuy price to get your vehicle back you lose your accumulated bounties and merits, I think it is already fair enough, you get the sense of loss without ruining the fun.

I don't understand what you guys mean with GREIFING, there is none in this game, the only type of griefer here are those who log out to avoid the loss in combat

Thoughts on my variation on the idea posted on page one?