Newcomer / Intro Defence turrets... Do I get a fine/bounty by shooting them?

[CraZed2256]

I know shooting power generators issues bounties in non-anarchy systems, but is it the same with the defence turrets? I am at a mining installation. I also know that showing signs of hostility will result into being mobbed by skimmers.

https://drive.google.com/open?id=1U3exnFR6X8Rlx_kKf5XyUKEM7Q664hWU
https://drive.google.com/open?id=13vWZQTcCyy0IuO3TQlIY8ySjC_bqfXZr
https://drive.google.com/open?id=1SvtFoykXM47d7fdUfAsRoozej5vCIO2f

Image 1: The mining installation
Image 2: A defence turret
Image 3: Another defence turret

 

[Demonlord79]

Ya know, that is one of the GREATEST mysteries of EDh right now...…There once was a time when you would land on a planet and come across things that would, targeted, give back information that would indicate whose property it belonged to, was it wanted property or was it clean. Now you still get this information on salvage but not defenses anymore. FD completely F'ed that up with the drop of the 3.0 and nobody has heard anything about it since.
I personally have been kicking and screaming every month threw bug reports but sadly nobody cares I suppose. FD says they know about the issue but that was, OMG I've lost count of the months that it has been broke. Quick someone help me out, when did the 3.0 come out...lol
50/50 chance but be careful, not only can you get a fine but a bounty, factional bounty, superpower bounty, and destroy the reputation of the faction that owns what your shooting. I've had a long hard lesson in all of these areas. Good luck.

 

[Faded Glory]

It depends... Sorry, I know that's not really the answer you wanted.

Since the info about planetary things went missing, it's not easy to tell whether they will be clean or wanted.

If you are doing a mission, then surface installations and skimmers are usually wanted at the building or outpost you are sent to, so no problem, no bounties, but yes, they will start to shoot at you when you attack.

If you do shoot clean turrets or skimmers, it only counts as assault even if you destroy them, so you don't get notoriety whatever, and the bounties are fairly trivial and you can just pay them off any time you want at a local Interstellar Factors.

Random POI's aren't so easy to tell. If there are any cargo canisters lying around in the vicinity, target them and if they show as legal salvage, everything will be wanted, if the show as illegal salvage, they will be clean.

 

[aRJay]

Ya know, that is one of the GREATEST mysteries of EDh right now...…There once was a time when you would land on a planet and come across things that would, targeted, give back information that would indicate whose property it belonged to, was it wanted property or was it clean. Now you still get this information on salvage but not defenses anymore. FD completely F'ed that up with the drop of the 3.0 and nobody has heard anything about it since.
I personally have been kicking and screaming every month threw bug reports but sadly nobody cares I suppose. FD says they know about the issue but that was, OMG I've lost count of the months that it has been broke. Quick someone help me out, when did the 3.0 come out...lol
50/50 chance but be careful, not only can you get a fine but a bounty, factional bounty, superpower bounty, and destroy the reputation of the faction that owns what your shooting. I've had a long hard lesson in all of these areas. Good luck.

3.0 came out 3 chapters ago so basically January 2018 or thereabouts.

 

[Maenden]

I've done a lot of scan the datapoint missions recently.
Most of these were late at night so I might be confused.
But I'm pretty sure I turned up at some place that was nice and green and friendly, until I accessed the datapoint.
Then the locals turned red and started shooting at me.
I might be wrong but I think I got a bonus for shooting down the skimmers and a bounty for shooting at the turrets.

I also went to one where the data downloaded but the mission didn't update. I shot down 3 skimmers then went home.
I returned the following day, scanned the same datapoint and the mission updated.
As I retreated, not firing a shot, 3 skimmers crashed into the ground.

Perhaps there's a possibility that it's not me who is confused but Elite?

 

[Rob_the_Sparky]

If a data point is marked as "private" then the locals will not like you scanning it, probably what happened to you.
.
There was a thread a little while back in newcomers where someone stated that the message you get when entering a trespass zone varies depending on whether the locals are wanted or not. Not got time to search but seemed like the best method I'd heard of to tell the difference.
.
As above I wish FD would do something about this as it is very annoying but there has been mooted that this was intentional due to people stacking skimmer kill missions, hence them not fixing it. Maybe the mission server update might mean they fix it??

 

[Hacker#451563]

I know shooting power generators issues bounties in non-anarchy systems, but is it the same with the defence turrets? I am at a mining installation. I also know that showing signs of hostility will result into being mobbed by skimmers.

https://drive.google.com/open?id=1U3exnFR6X8Rlx_kKf5XyUKEM7Q664hWU
https://drive.google.com/open?id=13vWZQTcCyy0IuO3TQlIY8ySjC_bqfXZr
https://drive.google.com/open?id=1SvtFoykXM47d7fdUfAsRoozej5vCIO2f

Image 1: The mining installation
Image 2: A defence turret
Image 3: Another defence turret

Hi CMDR,

The score is this: You will ALWAYS get a fine/bounty from shooting a Defense turret because they can't be "Wanted" no matter what the ethics of the faction that owns them is, even the "Purple Hand Drug & Nun Trafficking Cartel" or something like that. They are unmanned so you will never get "Notoriety" either so you can always clear your name.

As soon as a skimmer turns Red you will be able to shoot it and gain a reward for doing so, which is often more than the fine you just received. Strange, I know.


THE KEY TO THESE MISSIONS

Planet base scan missions are a good way to get Engineering data materials and often a large payout but you have to be prepared to do something before you turn them in or go back to your normal business.

Visit an Interstellar Factor. You can search for these in you galactic map using the filters for system types (I think) and "Services" (I'm certain of this one). You will find Interstellar Factors in low security systems. Go there, Land>Contacts>Interstellar Factor>Pay fines & collect bounties. Now you're clean.

You can shoot all the turrets, skimmers, and stingers (a type of skimmer) you want and then go and clear your bounties and fine at the Interstellar Factor before handing in your missions.

PRO TIP: Don't take scan missions in the same system as the Interstellar Factor that you use to clear your name. One does not defecate upon ones doorstep.

Keep these in mind and you'll be raking in the Crs and data from these missions without much danger.

o7

Hacker

 

[Para Handy]

......
The score is this: You will ALWAYS get a fine/bounty from shooting a Defense turret because they can't be "Wanted" no matter what the ethics of the faction that owns them is, even the "Purple Hand Drug & Nun Trafficking Cartel" or something like that. They are unmanned so you will never get "Notoriety" either so you can always clear your name.
............

Actually the score really is:

Defence Turrets, like Skimmers etc can indeed be "Wanted" (they can also be "Lawless" in anarchy and of course can be "Clean").

Unfortunately F D, in tackling the issue of people gaming the system by stacking mega-bucks worth of skimmer missions, decided to stop displaying details of these assets. So now when you target them you don't see what faction they are owned by nor the legal "status" of them.

So yes, they can be wanted, you just can't see if they are - hopefully F D will sort this stupid situation when they implement their "stop board flipping" solution of introducing a dedicated mission server.

 

[Hacker#451563]

Actually the score really is:

Defence Turrets, like Skimmers etc can indeed be "Wanted" (they can also be "Lawless" in anarchy and of course can be "Clean").

Unfortunately F D, in tackling the issue of people gaming the system by stacking mega-bucks worth of skimmer missions, decided to stop displaying details of these assets. So now when you target them you don't see what faction they are owned by nor the legal "status" of them.

So yes, they can be wanted, you just can't see if they are - hopefully F D will sort this stupid situation when they implement their "stop board flipping" solution of introducing a dedicated mission server.

Every time I shot a turret I ended up with a fine or bounty....every time....I must have been really unlucky then, so I stopped shooting them unless i had to.

Then, effectively, you should consider they will always give you a fine because relying on them not doing so will be a role of the dice with stacked odds against you.
Out of interest, when did this wonderful feature get implemented?

 

[Faded Glory]

Every time I shot a turret I ended up with a fine or bounty....every time....I must have been really unlucky then, so I stopped shooting them unless i had to.

Then, effectively, you should consider they will always give you a fine because relying on them not doing so will be a role of the dice with stacked odds against you.
Out of interest, when did this wonderful feature get implemented?

If by wonderful feature you mean the missing info for planetary objects (skimmers, turrets), that turned up when 3.0 was released. It's never been confirmed as a bug or intentional.

Regarding turrets not being wanted (and you refer specifically to planetary scan missions), I have to say that in my experience, and I've done hundreds of them, they've always been wanted, as have the skimmers. If on the other hand you are referring to the missions given by anarchy type factions to hack into a planetary base's systems (or whatever), then those will usually be clean unless the system (or faction controlling the base) is anarchy.

So basically, get sent to a non procedural base / location, they could well be clean and you will get a bounty. Get sent to a procedurally generated outpost or building (where the target is located by following a HUD marker that moves around as you get close), and there's a good chance they will be wanted.

 

[Para Handy]

.......... when did this wonderful feature get implemented?

^^^^^^^^^^ Wot Faded Glory said ^^^^^^^^^^^


I don't do surface scan missions any more because of this, in fact I can't remember doing any surface mission at all since this change. (You had to shoot out skimmers and turrets for some recover XXXXX missions if I remember correctly, I might be remembering it wrong though, so apologies if so.)

I can't find any reference from F D giving definitive statement about this, certainly there were floods of bug reports and angry threads ever since 3.0 dropped but all I ever saw were "I'll pass this on" staff posts.

 

[bitstorm]

I honestly have no idea.

Surface stuff confuses the hell out of me.

Yes I'm probably an stupid idiot.

I've shot stuff and got done for it where I thought I didn't before, and so now generally don't bother due to C+P punishing me for stuff I don't understand.

This probably means I am bad at planning or am not responsible enough.

 

[Faded Glory]

I honestly have no idea.

Surface stuff confuses the hell out of me.

Yes I'm probably an stupid idiot.

I've shot stuff and got done for it where I thought I didn't before, and so now generally don't bother due to C+P punishing me for stuff I don't understand.

This probably means I am bad at planning or am not responsible enough.

Not really the players' fault IMO. If it's a bug, it should have been fixed by now, and since there was nothing in the patch notes to indicate that they were removing surface objects info, it's likely a bug. If it was intentional, then it's a very poor design decision - "Let's make it more difficult by not giving players the information they need to make a decision". Meh.

Anyway, to the potential workarounds, depending what you are trying to do on the surface, there's a decent chance of knowing skimmers and turrets status, and if we get it wrong, then at least the bounties that we get for our troubles are small (even destroying a skimmer or turret only counts as assault, not murder), and since you have no notoriety can be paid off immediately.

So, if the skimmers / turrets are guarding a non procedural (named) base they will very likely be clean so you will get bounties (with the exception being anarchy system / faction ones).

In my experience, if you are taking a mission to scan a planetary data beacon that is procedural (you will be sent to an unnamed outpost or building), then the defenses are always wanted, even if the target has a trespass zone. You will still get a bounty for scanning the data beacon if it's private, that's unavoidable, but you can shoot the skimmers or turrets if you want, and you'll even get paid if you destroy the skimmers...

If you are hunting skimmers or just casually salvaging stuff and find it by hunting random POI's, then the method I mentioned above works. Before you start shooting anything, target a canister. It (for reasons unknown) will still have info displayed, and that info will be 'Legal or Illegal Salvage' or sometimes 'Illegal in Jurisdiction'. If it's Legal Salvage, skimmers guarding will be wanted, if Illegal Salvage they will be clean. If it's Illegal in Jurisdiction that just means the contents is illegal, but typically the skimmers are wanted.

 

[D.D.Hariman]

If you are hunting skimmers or just casually salvaging stuff and find it by hunting random POI's, then the method I mentioned above works. Before you start shooting anything, target a canister. It (for reasons unknown) will still have info displayed, and that info will be 'Legal or Illegal Salvage' or sometimes 'Illegal in Jurisdiction'. If it's Legal Salvage, skimmers guarding will be wanted, if Illegal Salvage they will be clean. If it's Illegal in Jurisdiction that just means the contents is illegal, but typically the skimmers are wanted.

Since a lot of what I am doing is planetary salvage while searching for planetary elements, I would love to make the extra CR for killing the skimmers but so far for me it is a crap shoot. Sometimes I got a bounty and sometimes I got a fine so I quit shooting at any of them no matter what kind of planet/system I am in. Even Anarchy.

Humnnn,,, At present my experience is at odds with this.
I have been fined for just banging into one of them trying to extricate myself with UP THRUST from the wreckage around a canister labeled LEGAL SALVAGE.
Then there is the fine you get (usually from the local controlling authority) if you stay inside the exclusion zone too long even when everything in there is LEGAL SALVAGE..

 

[Faded Glory]

Since a lot of what I am doing is planetary salvage while searching for planetary elements, I would love to make the extra CR for killing the skimmers but so far for me it is a crap shoot. Sometimes I got a bounty and sometimes I got a fine so I quit shooting at any of them no matter what kind of planet/system I am in. Even Anarchy.

Humnnn,,, At present my experience is at odds with this.
I have been fined for just banging into one of them trying to extricate myself with UP THRUST from the wreckage around a canister labeled LEGAL SALVAGE.
Then there is the fine you get (usually from the local controlling authority) if you stay inside the exclusion zone too long even when everything in there is LEGAL SALVAGE..

If you ram a skimmer with your ship, then you get a bounty, and presumably the same mechanic applies if you ram them in an SRV. I cannot say I've ever tried it. (It's because FD feel that destroying little skimmers with big ships by ramming them isn't fair play, they want us to shoot them.)

Regarding the fine for staying inside a trespass zone too long, again, somehow this hasn't happened to me. I've had the "Defenses Activated" warning, but never got a fine. How long do you hang around in the trespass zone?

 

[Red Anders]

It's been skimmer roulette since 3.0 was released. This thread is the first time I've seen a suggestion that it was a deliberate change by FDev rather than a bug - did that come from something in the patch notes or the forum that I missed?

Either way it's ridiculous. They just fix them from falling 6K out of the sky onto your ship (not a fun day out when they did it as you were trying to land and the base defences opened up on you when they blew up) and instead we aren't allowed to know who they belong to.

 

[Faded Glory]

It's been skimmer roulette since 3.0 was released. This thread is the first time I've seen a suggestion that it was a deliberate change by FDev rather than a bug - did that come from something in the patch notes or the forum that I missed?

Either way it's ridiculous. They just fix them from falling 6K out of the sky onto your ship (not a fun day out when they did it as you were trying to land and the base defences opened up on you when they blew up) and instead we aren't allowed to know who they belong to.

I'm pretty sure it's a bug - at least two multi-page bug reports and the last feedback from QA was "We are aware of the issue and looking into it." And I certainly didn't see anything in any patch notes.

Sadly it's just standard procedure for bugs that they don't think negatively affect player's game experience.

 

[D.D.Hariman]

If you ram a skimmer with your ship, then you get a bounty, and presumably the same mechanic applies if you ram them in an SRV. I cannot say I've ever tried it. (It's because FD feel that destroying little skimmers with big ships by ramming them isn't fair play, they want us to shoot them.)

Regarding the fine for staying inside a trespass zone too long, again, somehow this hasn't happened to me. I've had the "Defenses Activated" warning, but never got a fine. How long do you hang around in the trespass zone?

I have never hit a skimmer with my ship. Only with my SRV.

I spend as little time as possible in the exclusion areas. BUT, sometimes it is a big one and there is wreckage and i get hung up in the wreckage going after some platinum or palladium so i spend too much time or I bang a Skimmer using UP THRUST trying to get clear of the wreckage or both.

Staying too long does indeed ALWAYS cause me to get shot at.
BUT I have stopped shooting back because I don't want the fines.

 

[Para Handy]

It's been skimmer roulette since 3.0 was released. This thread is the first time I've seen a suggestion that it was a deliberate change by FDev rather than a bug - did that come from something in the patch notes or the forum that I missed?

............

As I mentioned earlier, I couldn't find anything from F D other than "we will pass on your report" - it is listed in the known issues as "Scanned Skimmers and Turrets may not display their faction, wanted status or mission target". Note the "may" - LOL

The idea that it was a mechanism against skimmer-mission stacking is I think just a suspicion (perhaps well-founded) on the part of those salty types in DD.

 

[jpjeffrey]

There are 2 ways to find out if the skimmer is a CRIMINAL or not

1. As already mentioned elsewhere in this thread - scan a canister; if the scan shows the canister is LEGAL SALVAGE then it's ok to take out the skimmers, they're CRIMINALS
If the canister is ILLEGAL SALVAGE then the skimmer is legit. You can still take it out, but you will cop a bounty.

2. The other way is to infringe slightly on the 'red zone' to bring up the infringe message (and quickly reverse out again)
If the message mentions '.... to avoid THREAT' then the skimmers guarding it are CRIMINAL.
If the message mentions ' .... to avoid SANCTION' then the skimmers are legit.

Hope this helps
JJ