Off topic but if you are ever in the states you should definetely make a stop in the San Diego area and see both the Zoo and the Safari park. If you plan ahead of time it's quite accessible and the staff are for the most part friendly and helpful. You can also bring someone with you for free (for both admission and extra experiences) so that you can have someone to help you out. I believe if you are visiting alone they will also provide a staff member for 3 hours to help you get around if needed. They have been redoing some of the habitats and improving the older, smaller ones. Definetely a full day for each place but a lot of fun if you enjoy animals/zoos. There is a bonobo there that understands cell phones and likes to look at pictures of herself on the phone (she will ask you to open the pictures and swipe through to the ones she wants to see via hand motions). I went for the first time after my worst surgery and keep going back!
Disabled and eldery visitors
- Thread starter RayPool
- Start date
Off topic but if you are ever in the states you should definetely make a stop in the San Diego area and see both the Zoo and the Safari park. If you plan ahead of time it's quite accessible and the staff are for the most part friendly and helpful. You can also bring someone with you for free (for both admission and extra experiences) so that you can have someone to help you out. I believe if you are visiting alone they will also provide a staff member for 3 hours to help you get around if needed. They have been redoing some of the habitats and improving the older, smaller ones. Definetely a full day for each place but a lot of fun if you enjoy animals/zoos. There is a bonobo there that understands cell phones and likes to look at pictures of herself on the phone (she will ask you to open the pictures and swipe through to the ones she wants to see via hand motions). I went for the first time after my worst surgery and keep going back!
That's your opinion. I will argue for you to be allowed that opinion but I don"t agree with it
Frontier managed the physics of individual animals poop, shadows based on position of sun...
Different design of basic toilet inc. disabled toilets and baby changing rooms.
Lifts to go from one level to another...
Ramps as well as stairs.
We have boats, trains, monorail, gondola, 4x4 jeeps. Not lifts (that would help elderly, pushchairs etc)
Not too much to ask really is it? No one would really build a zoo that excluded disabled, children in pushchairs, elderly etc.
Frontier managed the physics of individual animals poop, shadows based on position of sun...
Different design of basic toilet inc. disabled toilets and baby changing rooms.
Lifts to go from one level to another...
Ramps as well as stairs.
We have boats, trains, monorail, gondola, 4x4 jeeps. Not lifts (that would help elderly, pushchairs etc)
Not too much to ask really is it? No one would really build a zoo that excluded disabled, children in pushchairs, elderly etc.
I am disabled and I love Builders like Jonti (Geekism) for taking care of accessability of zoos. Adding this as a feature to planet zoo and similar sandbox games could actually change a lot. It would make ablebodied people more aware of disabled people and accesability. And next time someone opens up a shop, or a theatre or even a zoo, he or she might think twice.
Frontier cares a lot about education, so why not educate passively with adding at least users in wheelchairs. I am normally against stereotypical representation (which is why I don't want disability in Sims 4), but in a sandbox game, children, adults and elderlys in wheelchairs would already be enough. It would also add more management and planning to the game. Just like the (arguably) feature with negative impact of staff buildings. Though discrimiation of guests would be much more realistic than someone complaining about keeper huts.
Frontier cares a lot about education, so why not educate passively with adding at least users in wheelchairs. I am normally against stereotypical representation (which is why I don't want disability in Sims 4), but in a sandbox game, children, adults and elderlys in wheelchairs would already be enough. It would also add more management and planning to the game. Just like the (arguably) feature with negative impact of staff buildings. Though discrimiation of guests would be much more realistic than someone complaining about keeper huts.
I REALLY think this needs to be added, as someone who volenteers for a disabled campsite (and someone with a disability) I can 100% say that we go to Zoos (and theme parks). There needs to be more representation in this game (and PlanCoaster)
I understand the message behind this idea, but really the guests in the game could simply be amorphous grey blobs and still serve the same purpose (pumping money into the park). I'm not opposed to the idea of creating more variability in the guests but it's not something I particularly care about either. My father-in-law is tetraplegic and we go to the zoo quite often with him whenever he's in town, but my local zoo is naturally wheelchair accessible without any real effort in terms of planning.
I would really like this, but it would have to come as part of a wider path rework as right now, woah it would be so much harder than it ought to with how hard to place paths sometimes, the for arbitary game reasons where IRL a ramp there would be super simple and etc problems.
I have been on Loads of trips to roller coaster centric theme parks with physically disabled people
Ramps are a pain - and you even can't get the right incline ingame. We need elevators!
Elevators would be a godsend
It would have been simple. Path with stairs are not accessible to disabled or elderly people. Path with slope are more accessible to disabled and elderly people. No need to check path angle and all etc. And may be they could add elevators as a utility feature to place beside two levels of paths.
First off, props for bumping/using an older thread (finally someone using that search button 
)
- the look of visitors is not something i'm bothered by.
I think it's better to think that visitors are just moneybags.
If it were included in the base game, I'd be fine with it. But at this stage no - looks like a lot of effort for a small group. I really think people would be upset if this would mean if certain features aren't adressed because they want to include this. (Let's face it, that is what's going to happen with the mob-mentality nowadays)
You could continue on and on, blind people, amputees, burn victims or maybe other (physical) disabilities. Maybe some people want to see visitors with Down-syndrome in their game.
Personally I think it's a tricky subject/topic and the reason why almost no games don't feature them.
Many years ago I remember similar topics concerning The Sims. That's a game that heavily focuses on life.
)I really don't pay that much attention to visitors. I'm not against any visitor variation and get your point
- the look of visitors is not something i'm bothered by.I think it's better to think that visitors are just moneybags.
If it were included in the base game, I'd be fine with it. But at this stage no - looks like a lot of effort for a small group. I really think people would be upset if this would mean if certain features aren't adressed because they want to include this. (Let's face it, that is what's going to happen with the mob-mentality nowadays)
You could continue on and on, blind people, amputees, burn victims or maybe other (physical) disabilities. Maybe some people want to see visitors with Down-syndrome in their game.
Personally I think it's a tricky subject/topic and the reason why almost no games don't feature them.
Many years ago I remember similar topics concerning The Sims. That's a game that heavily focuses on life.
I highly doubt this would be simple. Also a lot of people already have issues with the current pathing - I don't think you are doing them a favor of adding more stuff to that system.
As long as visitors look like overscrewed cartoons without any near-reality propotions, I don't think we should worry about realism regarding disabled and elderly persons. Frontier could just pop white hair on them and/or change their legs for wheels.
slippery slope arguments dont work as like, all those people you listed are you know, people. who go to zoos and are players of the game. not ridiculous why ever would anyone want things.Like existence of disabled people isn't a tricky subject it's just reality. erasure of them in media is a tricky subject and thats the thing accepted as straightforward and easy by excluding.
If the game cares enough to give bad points for bad viewing or bad proximety to water treatment stations, then doesn't have wheelchari accessible ramp 'sad face points to exhibit' would be as basic and not a effort for a small group but as much as any of the other things taken into account in PZ as a representation of things zoos have to thing about and get bad ratings for ignoring. Like half the game is about planning your zoo to get the positive ratings not the negative from guests so it's not like this is outside the focus of the game.
just having there be wheelchair uses and having their 'good view of X animal' rating be calc'd based on vantage of without using stairs would do it, just as it doesnt use staff paths to do it as guests cant stand there. there's no need to be bringing sims and its whole different genre and famously corners cutting standards into it. PZ doesnt need to simulate visitors is different furniture or social settings or sims complications, just A. Can they reach exhibit, B. can they reach shop C. is the view of the elephants any good.
with that as the bar, adding in wheelchair users, and hey, prams or walkers maybe too, that get unhappy thoughts if they cant get to habitats or shops. Would add alot more to the game than zones of distress for power transformers or a new animal do. While feeding directly into the core of gameplay for the planning/building aspect of the game.
like just tldr.
add in a cant access path if stairs if wheelchair=yes the same as cant access path if staff path, so all those 'guest thought' ratings and shop sales would be with ramps only. PZ is not comparable to the sims with all the stuff that game has to account for, just add stairs into the can guest X get to Y for some of the X's.
If the game cares enough to give bad points for bad viewing or bad proximety to water treatment stations, then doesn't have wheelchari accessible ramp 'sad face points to exhibit' would be as basic and not a effort for a small group but as much as any of the other things taken into account in PZ as a representation of things zoos have to thing about and get bad ratings for ignoring. Like half the game is about planning your zoo to get the positive ratings not the negative from guests so it's not like this is outside the focus of the game.
just having there be wheelchair uses and having their 'good view of X animal' rating be calc'd based on vantage of without using stairs would do it, just as it doesnt use staff paths to do it as guests cant stand there. there's no need to be bringing sims and its whole different genre and famously corners cutting standards into it. PZ doesnt need to simulate visitors is different furniture or social settings or sims complications, just A. Can they reach exhibit, B. can they reach shop C. is the view of the elephants any good.
with that as the bar, adding in wheelchair users, and hey, prams or walkers maybe too, that get unhappy thoughts if they cant get to habitats or shops. Would add alot more to the game than zones of distress for power transformers or a new animal do. While feeding directly into the core of gameplay for the planning/building aspect of the game.
like just tldr.
add in a cant access path if stairs if wheelchair=yes the same as cant access path if staff path, so all those 'guest thought' ratings and shop sales would be with ramps only. PZ is not comparable to the sims with all the stuff that game has to account for, just add stairs into the can guest X get to Y for some of the X's.