Disappointment

[Dino droppings? Droppings?]

Until recently, Jurassic World Evolution has been my single most anticipated game of all time. I have followed every single bit of information, every youtube video, every tweet. There is a good argument to be made for my own hype escaping reality, however, in all good conscious I cannot make that statement for reasons I shall elaborate. I would also like to stress that everything you are about to read is subject to change as I'm very much aware that the game has not been released and Frontier have seemed very open to constructive criticism.

First of all, this is not a post attempting to change peoples opinions on the game. If you are excited about the game and you agree with the design choices, more power to you. No one should attempt to disuade you from your opinion; least of all me. However, if you are open to an honest diologue then please read on.

The reason I titled this post 'Disappointment' is two-fold. One, its a catchy, click-bait title, and Two, I am disappointed. I am disappointed not because I think this game is going to be bad but because I feel as though (judging soley on the information available) that some frankly lazy and bewildering design choices may unnecessarily handicap and otherwise stunning game. When I first saw the in-engine footage of the dinosaurs I was blown away. I still am blown away. However, possessing beautiful dinosaurs does not a good game make.

I think it may be helpful to create a short list of things that are particularly worrying to me, however, I want to emphasize that my disappointment stems not so much from missing features so much as the design choices. That being said, some of the missing features are fairly inexcusable.
The list is as follows:

- Lack of any deep vegetation/enclosure/park customization (no rocks, logs, individual trees, water depth etc)
- No true day/night cycle on Nublar
- No campaign mode on Nublar
- Apparent lack of any floodlights at night

Now this may sound like a very minimal list and it is. I didn't want to criticize the game for missing features like a lack of og JP style buildings etc because we are still yet to see everything. If it isnt out on release theres a very plausible chance that it will be at some point.
So why have I chosen these features? Because quite frankly, they seem really really idiotic.

99% of people wanted a sandbox mode. We got one, however, it's the wrong one. Unless I've been in a bubble for the last few months, we've been screaming for just a good old campaign (with no story) mode on Nublar. Not an unlimited mode where you have control over the weather, unlimited money etc.
I really want people to think about what I'm about to say because it is really quite important: what is the point in having an unlimited sandbox mode for a game whose entire goal is to be a management sim instead of a game like Planet Coaster which was all about creativity? They have purposefully limited customization of parks due to it being a management game first. So then, I ask you, what on earth is the point of having a creative, unlimted mode for a game that lacks the customization elements necessary to make an unlimited mode fun in the first place. They have effectively removed all the tension and excitement out of building a park from the beginning without adding the elements that would make such a game mode worthwhile.

Moreover, why not have both game modes? Why not have a campaign mode analogous to JPOG which requires you to start from the beginning AND an unlimited mode? You're adding unnecessary limitations to an already limited game. This is fundamentally the same issue I have with the day/night cycle or lack there of. I understand that some people don't want a proper day/night cycle but again, give us the option! Why not give players the option of a day/night cycle AND the ability to change the lighting. The fact that I see people saying, 'I'm happy with this' when they have previously begged for a proper day/night cycle is very saddening. It's a totally unnecessary compromise players are having to make and for the life of me I don't understand why.

The other concerns I listed are more aesthetic and are fairly self-explanatory. This entire post can be summed up with, 'Give us more options, not limitations'. You have smart people at Frontier and I really don't understand some of the decisions that have been made.

Lastly, this is addressed to the gamers and Youtubers, particularly Bestinslot (who is my fav youtuber of all time and well done on 500k subs, I've been one since 2012!). Do not settle for mediocrity. We all want this to be the best dinosaur game ever created but it has some serious flaws and it's okay to admit that. Pointless optimism is just that: pointless. It doesn't achieve anything and we will be stuck playing a game that has the potential to be great but is lacking minor details that hold it back. Do not be afraid to be disappointed either; there is nothing noble in forging on pretending that everything is fine.

As it stands, I will most likely not buy the game on release. I plan to wait and see how it develops. I hope I am wrong and I hope Froniter continues to be open to change. I also hope that everyone who does buy the game enjoys it immensly and that I am proven wrong. Despite the negative tone of this post I genuinley want this game to succeed.

James

 

[PCMR4Life]

What we are getting is a sandbox mode. We have to unlock things in the main campaign/story mode to use them in the sandbox/Nublar. I am fine with this. I believe what you want is something like challenge mode in Planet Coaster. This is basically what you will get while playing the other 5 islands. If you want to worry about finances and park management then just play one of the 5 islands. Obviously the story and missions will run out. So you will be stuck with 5 islands with nothing to do but manage the parks you have built on them.

This is a problem I have with a lot of these topics on Reddit. You're basically asking for what is already in the game. People on Reddit don't seem to understand this or refuse to understand it. Why should Frontier go through extra trouble and do extra work to put something in the game that is already in it? It's not like the story mode with the missions will last forever. Obviously you will be able to keep playing after completing it.


Yes everyone wants the game to be the best it can be. No one is settling for mediocrity. But it gets to the point with all the whining, raging, complaining and begging people start to feel like maybe these people should just go away if they are that unhappy. Cause complaining isn't going to work all the time no matter how much you whine and rage about it. Maybe it's not the game for these people and they should either accept it for what it is or move on and look for a game that has what they are looking for. Frontier can't meet everyone's little demand. They have to release the game, they can only do so much. I am not talking to you personally. I just came back from Reading Reddit and that place is garbage. But it's basically got people asking for the same thing you have and I told you and them the same thing, it's already in the game. On Reddit I got down voted, for telling people the truth.

 

[Dino droppings? Droppings?]

What we are getting is a sandbox mode. We have to unlock things in the main campaign/story mode to use them in the sandbox/Nublar. I am fine with this. I believe what you want is something like challenge mode in Planet Coaster. This is basically what you will get while playing the other 5 islands. If you want to worry about finances and park management then just play one of the 5 islands. Obviously the story and missions will run out. So you will be stuck with 5 islands with nothing to do but manage the parks you have built on them.

This is a problem I have with a lot of these topics on Reddit. You're basically asking for what is already in the game. People on Reddit don't seem to understand this or refuse to understand it. Why should Frontier go through extra trouble and do extra work to put something in the game that is already in it? It's not like the story mode with the missions will last forever. Obviously you will be able to keep playing after completing it.


Yes everyone wants the game to be the best it can be. No one is settling for mediocrity. But it gets to the point with all the whining, raging, complaining and begging people start to feel like maybe these people should just go away if they are that unhappy. Cause complaining isn't going to work all the time no matter how much you whine and rage about it. Maybe it's not the game for these people and they should either accept it for what it is or move on and look for a game that has what they are looking for. Frontier can't meet everyone's little demand. They have to release the game, they can only do so much. I am not talking to you personally. I just came back from Reading Reddit and that place is garbage. But's basically got people asking for the same thing you have and I told you and them the same thing, it's already in the game. On Reddit I got down voted, for telling people the truth.

You actually haven't responded to the substance of my argument. But thats fine, as I said you're entitled to your opinion.

I find it a little bit funny however, that you in the past have asked for exactly for what I'm asking for. Perhaps instead of labeling any criticism as 'whining' you look at the substance of the argument rather than simply dismissing it.

 

[Dino droppings? Droppings?]

You actually haven't responded to the substance of my argument. But thats fine, as I said you're entitled to your opinion.

I find it a little bit funny however, that you in the past have asked for exactly for what I'm asking for. Perhaps instead of labeling any criticism as 'whining' you look at the substance of the argument rather than simply dismissing it.

I also very clearly expressed what I wanted which is mode similar to how the normal mode of JPOG is played out. The entire point of my argument is why not have both?

 

[Dino droppings? Droppings?]

I also very clearly expressed what I wanted which is mode similar to how the normal mode of JPOG is played out. The entire point of my argument is why not have both?

Also, due to the nature of reddit and the current emotional state you're in, perhaps it may be best to take a while to calm down and then objectively think about the things that I have said because I believe them to be pretty reasonable will no malice intended.

 

[BanzaiZAP]

I think its too early to say. Your points 1,2 and 4 could be easily patched at a later date.

Your main disappointment seems to be in the way Nublar is handled. I too have seen many videos, but other than vague descriptions of unlimited cash and certain things available, we don't know the details of how this is achieved.

For example, the unlimited cash. We don't know the actual mechanics. It might be: You start with 2 million, and Press J to Add 5 million. It works out as unlimited cash, but remains your choice. Nobody needs to be disappointed about that. Plausible? Yes. Definite? No. Let's wait until June 11 to find out.

Similar arguments could be made for other points. True, the Day/Night ship has sailed, but several interface menus and things have changed over the last sneak peeks, so I'm willing to wait until release to decide. Disappointment at this stage of the game is just hype in the other direction. Anti-hype? Deep breath and recenter until June 11.

 

[Dino droppings? Droppings?]

I think its too early to say. Your points 1,2 and 4 could be easily patched at a later date.

Your main disappointment seems to be in the way Nublar is handled. I too have seen many videos, but other than vague descriptions of unlimited cash and certain things available, we don't know the details of how this is achieved.

For example, the unlimited cash. We don't know the actual mechanics. It might be: You start with 2 million, and Press J to Add 5 million. It works out as unlimited cash, but remains your choice. Nobody needs to be disappointed about that. Plausible? Yes. Definite? No. Let's wait until June 11 to find out.

Similar arguments could be made for other points. True, the Day/Night ship has sailed, but several interface menus and things have changed over the last sneak peeks, so I'm willing to wait until release to decide. Disappointment at this stage of the game is just hype in the other direction. Anti-hype? Deep breath and recenter until June 11.

The amount of cash is irrelevant if gameplay features (ie; customization) have not been included to allow for an enjoyable sandbox experience in the first place. What incentive is there to enjoy an unlimited sandbox, the specific's of which are irrelevant, if every park looks close to identical.

As previously stated, everything in the original post is subject to change. With that in mind, it is reasonable to speak about the information we do know. To say that some features may be patched in is speculation and unhelpful in this context. What harm is there in discussing confirmed features whilst keeping in mind that Frontier will likely add more?

 

[MrGoodbytes]

A lot of sim games have what you call an unlimited mode. Zoo Tycoon 2, for example.

 

[Dino droppings? Droppings?]

A lot of sim games have what you call an unlimited mode. Zoo Tycoon 2, for example.

My argument is not that an unlimited mode is bad but that JWE lacks the customization that games like Zoo Tycoon 2 had to make it good.

 

[PCMR4Life]

You actually haven't responded to the substance of my argument. But thats fine, as I said you're entitled to your opinion.

I find it a little bit funny however, that you in the past have asked for exactly for what I'm asking for. Perhaps instead of labeling any criticism as 'whining' you look at the substance of the argument rather than simply dismissing it.

Fine.

There is no logs and rocks cause the Dinosaurs would clip through them. But of course we haven't seen the final product.

A day and night cycle would be great. But that isn't part of Frontiers design for the game. We can set the time of day/lighting on Nublar ourselves and that's a good compromise.

We don't know if there any lights for the park at night cause we haven't seen the finished product or explore the game for ourselves so we can see what's in it. I can guarantee that Frontier isn't going to make a big deal out of flood lights. The Dinosaurs are the stars of the show here just like in the movies.

I already covered the other issue with Nublar. But there is already a campaign mode in the game. It's the 5 islands. It's there. Again why should frontier do the same work twice?

Having a challenge mode would be nice. But that's essentially what you are doing on the 5 other islands. I am happy with what we are getting. The sandbox mode sounds good. We aren't getting a challenge mode. The developers are right, it's already in the game. If you want a big open space just stick to Sorna.

 

[Shelly]

This is fundamentally the same issue I have with the day/night cycle or lack there of. I understand that some people don't want a proper day/night cycle but again, give us the option! Why not give players the option of a day/night cycle AND the ability to change the lighting. The fact that I see people saying, 'I'm happy with this' when they have previously begged for a proper day/night cycle is very saddening. It's a totally unnecessary compromise players are having to make and for the life of me I don't understand why.

Reason for not having day/night cycle is probably that the lighting is pre-baked for all three lighting conditions, which saves a lot of processing power.
And I am glad they've done it this way. A full cycle is nice to have, but would you rather have less graphics and/or less performance?
I don't!

 

[Dino droppings? Droppings?]

Fine.

There is no logs and rocks cause the Dinosaurs would clip through them. But of course we haven't seen the final product.

A day and night cycle would be great. But that isn't part of Frontiers design for the game. We can set the time of day/lighting on Nublar ourselves and that's a good compromise.

We don't know if there any lights for the park at night cause we haven't seen the finished product or explore the game for ourselves so we can see what's in it. I can guarantee that Frontier isn't going to make a big deal out of flood lights. The Dinosaurs are the stars of the show here just like in the movies.

I already covered the other issue with Nublar. But there is already a campaign mode in the game. It's the 5 islands. It's there. Again why should frontier do the same work twice?

Having a challenge mode would be nice. But that's essentially what you are doing on the 5 other islands. I am happy with what we are getting. The sandbox mode sounds good. We aren't getting a challenge mode. The developers are right, it's already in the game. If you want a big open space just stick to Sorna.

I'm curious, did you actually read anything of my post other than the 4 things I listed? My concerns were a lot more nuanced than me simply saying 'I want these features'.
You're also somewhat helping to prove my point by making unnecessary compromises about features that are standard for these types of games.

What is occuring on the other five islands is completely irrelevant to anything I have spoke about and I've never asked for a story mode for Nublar.

 

[Dino droppings? Droppings?]

Fine.

There is no logs and rocks cause the Dinosaurs would clip through them. But of course we haven't seen the final product.

A day and night cycle would be great. But that isn't part of Frontiers design for the game. We can set the time of day/lighting on Nublar ourselves and that's a good compromise.

We don't know if there any lights for the park at night cause we haven't seen the finished product or explore the game for ourselves so we can see what's in it. I can guarantee that Frontier isn't going to make a big deal out of flood lights. The Dinosaurs are the stars of the show here just like in the movies.

I already covered the other issue with Nublar. But there is already a campaign mode in the game. It's the 5 islands. It's there. Again why should frontier do the same work twice?

Having a challenge mode would be nice. But that's essentially what you are doing on the 5 other islands. I am happy with what we are getting. The sandbox mode sounds good. We aren't getting a challenge mode. The developers are right, it's already in the game. If you want a big open space just stick to Sorna.

I guess what I find jarring about your response is that I have seen you countless times ask for EXACTLY the same things.

 

[Exlare]

i understand, but i think you have to calm yourself and wait for the game to be released and see if it is the same,
* We don't now what build they have used.
* They haven't ( quite sure) showed us everything yet.

 

[Dino droppings? Droppings?]

i understand, but i think you have to calm yourself and wait for the game to be released and see if it is the same,
* We don't now what build they have used.
* They haven't ( quite sure) showed us everything yet.

Firstly, in my original post, I addressed precisely the substance of your message multiple times.

Secondy, don't you see how lazy that is. What is the entire of forums if to not discuss features we like and don't like about the game so far. We can only talk about the information we know. Simply saying, 'the game isn't out yet' is an not a valid argument for anything other than unconfirmed features.

Thirdly, I never once spoke about the game build. I spoke about confirmed designed choices.

 

[blubbit]

It's not that Jurassic World Evolution is going to be a bad game. You just think you will not like the game, which is fair, but to call it a bad game, to describe it as subpar, is objectively incorrect in many cases. For it to be a bad game, it would need to have nigh unanimous agreement from those who have played it stating that it was not a fun game. Bad games are not fun. It's just not the game you want it to be, and it won't be. No game will ever truly be that for anyone. You're not entitled to the things you deem "inexcusable" to not be included.

And that's okay.

Frontier can change certain aspects of the game for the betterment of it, and that would be great, but even so, Frontier isn't always going to change things, and you may not like that. But that doesn't make it a bad game.

Unlimited money on Nublar doesn't make it a bad game.

Indestructible vehicles don't make it a bad game.

No day and night cycle doesn't make it a bad game.

Jurassic World Evolution is not JPOG, and that doesn't make this a bad game.

There are things that disappoint me about Evolution, but I'm not letting it spoil the fun. As a kid, when I played board games with my dad, I would just quit because I was losing. Sometimes I would do this at the very start of the game. Your post reminds me of myself in those regards. Minor details aren't holding the game back, you're holding yourself back by letting details you call "minor" have a major influence on your opinion of a game you have never even touched. I think I'm going to greatly enjoy this game, regardless of the issues I may have with it. Compromise is necessary where it counts, otherwise you're going to find yourself very disappointed when you don't get what you want. In compromisation, the only one who loses is the person who doesn't compromise. If you don't think you'll like the game, that's okay, but don't call it a bad game just because Frontier won't cave into each and every want you have. Don't call it a bad game because certain aspects that literally only pertain to 1/6th of the game aren't exactly what you'd want them to be.

I'd like to close with this: settle for mediocre if you want. It's a video game, and if you're having fun, that's what matters. Don't heed the words of someone who thinks lack of floodlights in a video game is an inexcusable missing feature worthy of its own bullet point.

As for the lack of any deep vegetation/enclosure/park customization, I agree with you there. But that's about all I agree with you on.

 

[m2wester]

One thing I'd like to point out here is that as far as we know, the game had a fairly short release cycle and it could not be pushed back under any circumstances. Frontier had to get it done in time for Fallen Kingdom, there never was an option to push it back a quarter or two, they had to focus on what they thought were the key features.

Otherwise, of your points the only one that matters to me at all is the park customization thing. I would like them to have put more effort into that part of the game, even to the extent that I'd rather have fewer dinosaurs and more customization, but then, I'm not sure that everybody would see it that way. I find day/night-cycles annoying, so I really don't need it at all, and while I would like to get a limited sandbox the way you describe it, we'll mostly get something very close to that on Sorna. (btw, a lot of people wanted the ability to create a reserve like JPOG Sorna, which is not possible with limited money, so I don't think you are completely right in your assumption that everybody wanted it the way you do...)

All things considered, the game looks good enough for me to buy on release. I can still hope for free or even payed updates that will focus more on the design aspect of creating a jurassic park, but I'm sure I'll have a lot of fun playing it as it is. If you don't feel that way, you can obviously wait, but I do think your expactation was probably more than they were ever able to deliver on release.

 

[PCMR4Life]

My argument is not that an unlimited mode is bad but that JWE lacks the customization that games like Zoo Tycoon 2 had to make it good.

By customizations I believe you mean decorations and other items like that?

That's probably never going to happen cause the game is also on consoles. Frontier isn't going to give PC gamers something that isn't in the console version. The lack of decorative items is obviously a simplification for consoles. Trying to place all those items is tedious on the PC, it's even worse on consoles. I take it that you have played Planet Coaster? If so then you should understand what I am talking about. The mouse and keyboard makes it easy, it still gets boring after a while. But its simple to do. It would be boring and miserable having to do that with a console controller. That is probably why you don't see any kind of decorative items. Any kind of decorations will be automatically placed down and it won't be many. Of course I could be wrong but I doubt I am.

There some things Frontier can't fix. I wish the game had been a PC exclusive like Planet Coaster but that isn't what happened. I guess it's not financially viable.

 

[PCMR4Life]

I guess what I find jarring about your response is that I have seen you countless times ask for EXACTLY the same things.

Yes I asked for it. We aren't getting it. I don't see the point in asking for it again. Maybe they will put it in later. I doubt it though cause as I said there is already a challenge mode in the game. It's the first five islands. Once the story and missions are all completed you will be able to play the islands with no interference except the typical park management stuff.

 

[blubbit]

By customizations I believe you mean decorations and other items like that?

That's probably never going to happen cause the game is also on consoles. Frontier isn't going to give PC gamers something that isn't in the console version. The lack of decorative items is obviously a simplification for consoles. Trying to place all those items is tedious on the PC, it's even worse on consoles. I take it that you have played Planet Coaster? If so then you should understand what I am talking about. The mouse and keyboard makes it easy, it still gets boring after a while. But its simple to do. It would be boring and miserable having to do that with a console controller. That is probably why you don't see any kind of decorative items. Any kind of decorations will be automatically placed down and it won't be many. Of course I could be wrong but I doubt I am.

There some things Frontier can't fix. I wish the game had been a PC exclusive like Planet Coaster but that isn't what happened. I guess it's not financially viable.

Ah yes, the trade of having to go multiplat. This is where Frontier might have had to compromise. To broaden their audience, they had to standardize between platforms and simplify the ability of the player. With an IP as huge as Jurassic Park, it would have been silly not to release it multiplatform from the business point of view.