Don’t get me wrong I enjoy the building pieces and support the division of animals and building pieces. But I’ve been watching some YouTube videos and although some builds are gorgeous they for the most part simply aren’t realistic. Not to many zoos have big extravagant buildings at least in the US. So I do kinda question has planet zoo become all about building in comparison to realism.
Do most people focus too much on the building aspect?
- Thread starter paul78
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I guess it depends on the player. For instance I'm a 50/50 player. I like both the building aspect of the game and enjoying the animals. I know some people have complained that the animals are not stars of the game, but I think with a few minor changes that can be fixed. I still love building creatives zoos.
I think YT videos wouldn't be interesting if they would focus on the animal part. Tbh, they aren't that interesting to look at for 20 minutes.
I think it's more about creating your own version of a zoo. Making a realistic zoo might be not that interesting for most people and they want to see a extravagant zoo in a specific theme. That's something people want to see and/or copy. I also think it's only of the few aspects where you can be creative and that's the interesting part. And PZ allows for a lot of creativity on that part.
I think in overall the game has more focus on building/management than on caring for your animals. I don't mind this.
If this were Planet Zoo Keeper, with only 30-40 animals but with very complex AI / interaction. That would be interesting enough to watch animals on YT.
I think it's more about creating your own version of a zoo. Making a realistic zoo might be not that interesting for most people and they want to see a extravagant zoo in a specific theme. That's something people want to see and/or copy. I also think it's only of the few aspects where you can be creative and that's the interesting part. And PZ allows for a lot of creativity on that part.
I think in overall the game has more focus on building/management than on caring for your animals. I don't mind this.
If this were Planet Zoo Keeper, with only 30-40 animals but with very complex AI / interaction. That would be interesting enough to watch animals on YT.
Well, it certainly doesn't help that this "zoo" game came with tons of themed stuff while offering close to zero basic pieces needed for realistic zoo building, like working animal gates and other backstage holding area stuff...you can try to put some stuff together (I did as well) but it takes ages, adds unnecessary pieces that put yet more strain on the already poorly utilized CPU and most of the time still doesn't look anything like it really should. Not to mention that stuff like traversable area and huge hitboxes make it next to impossible to build on a realistic scale, while still making it work and reachable for keepers and animals alike.
Tbh, everytime stuff like this comes up I find myself wondering what they were looking at when visiting zoos during the development process of this game. It certainly wasn't the actual holding and managing of the animals, which imo should be the core aspect of a zoo game. Here's hoping that will get a lot more of that in future updates to balance out the theme park portion of the game and finally make a real zoo game out of it.
Tbh, everytime stuff like this comes up I find myself wondering what they were looking at when visiting zoos during the development process of this game. It certainly wasn't the actual holding and managing of the animals, which imo should be the core aspect of a zoo game. Here's hoping that will get a lot more of that in future updates to balance out the theme park portion of the game and finally make a real zoo game out of it.
Making an interesting YouTube video about the management aspects of a game is mainly about making decisions and solving problems. Planet Zoo doesn't offer much if this
The gameplay-loops of Planet Zoo after building a habitat and setting up workzones are not that interesting to look at. There is mostly uninteresting micromanagement like sending I'll animals to quarantine, dead to the trash and mature offspring to the wild. The only interesting decisions the player faces at this point are about the genetics in their breeding programs. That's enough to keep simple minds like myself entertained, but not enough to make a interesting video series.
The gameplay-loops of Planet Zoo after building a habitat and setting up workzones are not that interesting to look at. There is mostly uninteresting micromanagement like sending I'll animals to quarantine, dead to the trash and mature offspring to the wild. The only interesting decisions the player faces at this point are about the genetics in their breeding programs. That's enough to keep simple minds like myself entertained, but not enough to make a interesting video series.
I still think they should have named the game "Planet Guest", because everything you build (including habitats and exhibits) you have to build in a way that your zoo-guests can enjoy it and give you good ratings (and good money). The animals are only decorative accessories. You have to match their needs, because if you don't you'll get protestors and bad guest-ratings as well as less money.
My favorite aspect of this game is building.
My favorite aspect of this game is building.
I think the themed stuff does allow for more extravagant building, compared to having basic pieces. The themed pieces gives a push for building larger/detailed than necessary (at least for me).
Personally think this is a way to allow people to create their own version of their ultimate zoo or section of a zoo. A local small zoo has an Indonesian theme with only Indonesian animals, while the bigger zoos go with the more traditional approach. Both choices are great.
I think the lack of traditional zoo building pieces gives a wrong impression and also a more "theme park" vibe to the overall building experience.
I also think that PC building mechanics is the reason why PZ feels to have a different focus.
In short: more traditional building pieces to balance this. In the last months a lot of people requested the basic/traditional building pieces. I think that would give a different view on your entire zoo when you zoom out.
Edit: I do want to point out that a lot of people complained about ZooTycoon 2013 and it's lack of building. I think it's difficult to find the middle-ground for this one.
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Pretty much this, yeah. I mean let people build whatever crazy stuff they like, heck I like building crazy stuff as well from time to time, I'd just like to be able to combine it with the reality of actual zoos when it comes to behind the scenes stuff, and right now that is sorely lacking all over the place. That's why I said I'm hoping for those pieces and options in the future so the crazy and heavily themed gets more balanced with the standard and basic stuff. One doesn't cancle out the other, but right now the game does a very poor job at providing the best from both worlds and instead offers a ton for the crazy and almost nothing for the basic.
As someone who has the creativity of a rock and the patience of a honey badger, I am very thankful for the builders who create amazing buildings. Sure, I can put together a small shelter with four walls and a ceiling, and what i can make is functional but it isn't pretty. so I say, let the detailed builders get wild. When they share to the workshop we all benefit.
Now...it would be really fantastic is paths could be included in with blueprints, but that's not the builder's fault.
Now...it would be really fantastic is paths could be included in with blueprints, but that's not the builder's fault.
I understand the point you are making, but allow me to show you a somewhat different take on the same subject. Most of those builds you are seeing in YouTube are being uploaded by very talented players, who are extremely creative, but have no real experience with zoos and what they primarily consist of. The building and scenery pieces provided by Frontier can be utilized to create realistic zoos, it is really up to the player what he does with them. There is however an enormous limitation in all other aspects of creating a realistic zoo based on the very limited amount of objects available within the current game. Zoos come in all sorts of variety and styles, however there are fundamental principles when creating a layout that must be followed in order to achieve a realistic virtual park, and sadly at this time with the current state of the game this is not possible.
The biggest handicap of the game is not the building pieces available, but everything else that is missing. Mainly the landscape scenery, one of the core components of any realistic zoo has a very limited selection of flora. As you already know, there are major gaps within all of the animal collections, some are almost entirely missing (birds, small carnivores, any and all aquatic species, and the list goes on.
The good news is that this will eventually change, In my opinion the two most critical elements that will transform this game are the inclusion of billboards/user zoo signs/etc, and the eventual addition of the Thememaker's Toolkit. If you have ever played Planet Coaster, and are somewhat familiar with that game, you will know that there are thousands of realistic objects and components that have been added by players, and I can only dream of what can be added to Planet Zoo. When it comes to billboards, these are the single most underrated tool in Planet Coaster, the players never really understood what they had, but since it is a game that is mostly focused on rides and so on, it is understandable. However when it comes to Planet Zoo, this addition to the game, will change everything mark my words. I have been working on a project in Planet Coaster, that has nothing to do with what that game was intended for, so far I have put in over 1200 hours and when it is complete, it will showcase the full potential of billboards and what they can do for Planet Zoo.
I have included a few pictures below, of a very small project I worked on Planet Zoo, as I have postponed building a zoo, since capturing a high level of realism is not possible at this time. There is just too much missing within the game.
All of that reality will eventually join the game, but it will in its majority not come from Frontier, but via the Thememaker's Toolkit. We will have thousands of objects and building components needed to recreate anything and everything to create realistic looking zoos and anything else you want to create. As Frontier taking note of Planet Coaster knows that all of this will eventually be available there, so they will primarily continue focusing on themed and beautifully detailed architectural components as well as the animals of course. Everything else will be added by the players themselves, I have already invested a great deal in downloading high end 3d models for a project I have been working on Planet Coaster, and when the opportunity is afforded to me, I will add all of those components to this game.
That's not really an excuse for the devs not to add critical pieces and features that are needed to build a realistic and functioning zoo in their ZOO game. On top of that no-one even knows if we'll get a TMT for PZ as well, not to mention that it had an extreme impact on the already less than great performance and I don't see that changing should they really add it to PZ seeing as the game already has those performance issues without it.
Most of the stuff that's added by players also doesn't fit the games original style very well. Not saying that it's bad, it just has a completely different approach and look to it so it doesn't really fit in and makes everything look like a weird mix of stuff that shouldn't be put together...even the signs you showed above don't really fit in the PZ world IMO, since they're way too detailed, busy and show actual pics and illustrations of the real animal that looks quite a bit different from the PZ one, so it's not really something I'd like to put in my zoo when playing.
So yeah, while it might be a nice addition if we ever got it and it worked properly, I would certainly hope Frontier doesn't use it as an excuse not to add those basic pieces we're still missing.
That is your opinion, but it is the players playstyle...
Eveyone has a different way of playing the game and they like/focus on different aspects of this game, has nothing to do with ' planet zoo has become X'Is not meant to be an excuse, but in any case there are thousands of items that are needed to create realistic zoos, that is of course if you want them to look highly detailed. The majority of those everyday items however, are not a priority for any DLC, so the TMT is an excellent option. Not sure about the impact you are referring to, I have been using mostly all of this items in PC and there are no issues whatsoever. That brings me to my second point, I was addressing realism in the game, sure that some of the items uploaded might not necessarily fit the PZ theme, but that would be up to the player to decide, what works for them in their eyes. A great number of the items found in the TMT on PC are perfect fits for the game.
You are incorrect about the signs, none of them are pics or illustrations of real animals, they are all drawings, sketches and paintings, I created all of them with attention to detail blend in with the game, and it might be the look you see in the pics, but they fit in perfectly, at least to me. I go after realism, and signs with lines, blocks, and imaginary detail does not work for me, it takes all the realism away from the game, the same with all of the other items created and uploaded to the workshop, street signs out of scale, make believe vending machines and water fountains and everything else. My aim is creating the most realistic and life like maps possible, however it might be a very different priority in comparison to other players, and I understand it. As an FYI, pictures of in game animals can also be used to create signs, posters, wall murals that break the generic vibe of what is currently found within the game, it would just take additional work.
@TigerPaws I suppose you are right. I don’t know I guess sometimes the game seems a little too much amusement park/Planco at times. As in a much earlier thread Danny_zoo has some very good ideas for the game and things hopefully to come. Btw Danny_zoo that’s a stunning exhibit and great ideas you got there. Don’t get me wrong this game is amazing but it does still lack many things to make a very realistic zoo at this point.
Thank you, it is an experimental exhibit I worked on, that would eventually lead to me building a realistic Zoo, but as you have stated in the thread, with the content that is currently available and key missing game features it is a bit pointless for me to even start building the zoo, as it would just look like an empty shell, at least from my perspective. In addition when i started experimenting with the billboards concept in Planet Coaster, I stumbled onto something that has captivated my full attention since and it is a very large work in progress.
I came back here around the time it was assumed that we will get a DLC to see what that could potentially bring us. What i meant earlier to tell you with my response, is that I agree with you, that most of what is possible now looks largely unrealistic, however as you have seen yourself with the mood of the forum, fantasy zoos seem to be quite popular. Nothing wrong with it, as many have stated, as long as it brings you each and everyone of them joy, it is all that matters. For me, if I can not capture the realism withing the build, that is where the fun stops.
Expanding also on another point of the thread, there is great amount of detail in realism as well, actually I will go as far as saying that it is quite more detailed than anything that can be created in fantasy. It really comes down to how it is presented, and who is doing the presentation.
@Danny_zoo i absolutely agree as long as people are happy building whatever they want or how they want I’m more then happy for them. Also I hope no one was offended by the thread or took it as bashing how anyone plays or builds and the YouTube creations are amazing as I stated. I only ask for more realistic zoo pieces,objects, and features. You can literally create anything in this game but it is incredibly tedious work and having more barrier options and other objects would be great.Btw amazing signs as well. The West African lion sign showing with the porcupine and conservation was a great creation and would be great if we could design our own signs. Like you said tho I’m sure that will eventually make it in game.
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I honestly do not see anything offensive with the thread, in any case, you have brought up a very good observation of what is mostly being built with the current tools the game provides. There is a great deal of focus on unrealistic architecture and parks, because there is not much available to really fill in all the gaps needed to create realistic builds. The ability for the players to insert their own designs and signs would be a major step on adding to that realism element, as well as overall feel of a zoo. Without this, all parks not only look completely bare and sterile, but they all seem to resemble one another, another element that takes away from any realism that can be captured.
The key when creating anything signs/banners/posters/etc related and inserting those creations successfully within the game, is to make sure the images and style you are using blends in with the game's own (a bit cartoonish sadly) I have created all of the media for my future built using drawings/illustrations/concept art/ etc, as real life animal pictures would stand out, and would not blend in well, with what is already available.
These two are just a small example of displays I have created specifically for my future built. I have created over 400 different media elements for that future zoo, from menus and banners to complete thematic panel sets that will tell a particular story when walking thru an exhibit. Of course all of this was created with the hopes, that when this feature does make into the game, we will receive the same treatment as Planet Coaster, and receive many different sizes of billboards, etc. Maybe Frontier brings something new in, that is not genetic and actually resembles panels and signs found in zoos. The screens from Planet Coaster that fit the 4M walls are a must, since it would enhance creativity and the use of this feature.
The sign in the far left I created just as a point of reference, since it really does not fit the theme of what I will be building. The images of the Red Panda are of course Frontier's property and the exact image of the animal model found in the game, as it can be observed there is no real visible difference between these images and the drawings/illustrations/sketches I have been using to create custom displays, they all fit together since none are real life animal pictures. While I have followed on that cartoonish style of the game, I also added to that element of realism that makes it such an amazing game.
As you know, this game has some exceptional features, one of them is the way light hits objects, unfortunately this works both ways, from this angle as with the pictures first posted by me in this thread, the lighting hits the billboards making them stand out, and the picture also has special effects as did the others, and that might be what our German friend noticed when making the comment that custom designs would not blend well in the game. Now take a look at the picture below.
This is a different angle where the light does not reflect adversely against the billboard, and the picture has no special effects, in my opinion it not only blends perfectly within the game style, but it complements it in a way that all of its beauty is enhanced. In addition it adds an element of realism and uniqueness that otherwise would be lost without this feature. I have said it from the beginning even before the game came out, that this would be a game changer if handled in a similar way to Planet Coaster.
Still on the subject of realism when creating a Zoo, this is just a genetic zoo exhibit I created, sort of a testing ground for any new items/features/animals that are added into the game. Even though it is by no means an example of anything remotely close to being realistic as a zoo exhibit, it is however highly detailed in every aspect of what you would find in a real life exhibit. During this testing built i just wanted to incorporate different elements of barriers and game components while conducting an in depth study of the traversable area element. It does help tremendously to lay down a foundation for any project, without any props or landscaping components being added, as you can gauge that element of realism much better this way. As you can see in the picture above, this is the genetic exhibit with empty moats and lagoons, as well as no vegetation or props.
Even thought this exhibit is bare, every single inch of it has already being planned out, from the water levels, to the location of every tree and plant. I sketch everything out on paper first, just to give me an overall look of what I'm going after. The second step is to lay down the foundation, much like it is done in real life, I then built the architectural structures and work on the rock-work (A major element of all zoos, and currently not properly used by most players, the ones that do use them tend to create unrealistic rock formations that would not necessarily fit in well in a zoo or animal park) Lastly comes the landscape and props (This is another area that needs an immense amount of work by frontier) Someone point it out in a thread a while back, that with the construction pieces currently found within the game, almost any building can be created. I completely agree with that statement, Frontier has done a fantastic job with walls, roofs, columns, etc, however one critical aspect of all zoos is its landscape. Modern Zoos are in many cases accredited botanical gardens, and there is a great variety of species that represent the animals habitats. One of Frontier's favorite zoos, The World Famous San Diego Zoo had a saying over the years, "people come for the animals they stay for the plants" That is because their botanical collections are superb, and a real treat to visitors. I say all this, because there needs to be a substantial increase of the plants species found within the game. I do know that when the TMT is released this current problem will be somewhat relieved. The official content in this area is however fantastic in this game, so I would like to see the Planet Zoo team focused on this a bit more.
The exhibit fully planted, and with all of the assets in place. Since this was not an actual zoo built, I completely went overboard with the landscape design, in hindsight when building an actual zoo, and to capture a maximum level of realism, the animal areas would not be so heavily planted (depending on the species of course) When we build zoo exhibits in real life, what we are asked to do as landscape architects is not only to envision the areas being constructed with fully matured landscape, but to take into account how this landscape will interact with the animals and the visitor's experience. I have always favored zoo's that invest heavily on landscape since this will always pay off when the exhibit reaches a maturity level.
If and when Planet Zoo has reached its own level of maturity and user generated images can be uploaded via billboards, TMT support has been enabled, the foliage collection has been increased significantly and of course last but by no means least, there is a substantial animal roster with no visible gaps in its collection, then highly detailed and realistic zoos will not only become fashionable but they will cement this game as the best building simulation of its kind ever created.
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