Newcomer / Intro Does anyone make money from normal trading?

DogTailRed2

D
I've made money from missions and I've made money from rares.
I'm not talking a few creds I'm talking 100k a pop at least with a 40ton hold.
But I've never made any money trading normals.

So what's the secret?
 

Vhaegrant

V
It's unlikely you'd ever see that sort of return from a 40t hold just trading normal commodities.
There's no secret. Look for trade lanes that haven't been run into the ground ;)
 

Evyl Minkey

E
By food at agriculture systems and sell it at systems that don't have agriculture, buy metals from extraction to sell at high tech, buy things from high tech and sell to the agri or refinery/extraction. Make sure before you sell that they pay more than you spent.
 

theEmohawk

T
DogTailRed2 said:
I've made money from missions and I've made money from rares.
I'm not talking a few creds I'm talking 100k a pop at least with a 40ton hold.
But I've never made any money trading normals.

So what's the secret?
Click to expand...

I did a couple of runs last night in my Asp that were 1100cr/t one way, buying performance enhancers to start, selling them and buying gold to come back for 950cr. It's not stellar profit margins but enough for me to repeat it twice, not bad for a route I stumbled across.
I might head back there at some point and see if there's a better system to sell the P.E. at.

A lot of traders say that you can make more profit trading regular commodities with a 100t ship than trading rares, which makes an Asp an interesting cutover ship because it can be equipped with 100t of cargo. But it is also a very good armed rare carrier with 80t capacity, good jump range, still running reasonable shields.
 

Arithon

Arithon
Profitability is dependant on hold size. I frequently find runs that make 1,700cr profit per ton for a single jump. In my Anaconda with 420T cargo space I make 700K+ per trip and if I can find a commodity for the return, it is easy to made it a 1M cr round-trip.

If I still had a Lakon Type-9, it'd make 850K+ for a single leg on the same run.

So yes, straight trading can be very profitable.
 

Pyrion

Pyrion
while rare trading you make a constant amount of money, the size of your ship not being important beyond a certain limit. That profit looks great while your ship is smallish, but when you get a T7 things change. Those 1100cr/t runs suddenly mean 220000cr per run, and it's usually a fast run. Add the same (on a good route) for your way back and you look at about 400000cr per round trip. Each round trip may be from 10 to 15 minutes, so you will quickly out earn the rare trading. And the T7 is NOT the biggest trade ship.
 

Hexcaliber

Hexcaliber
I can make 480k profit every ten minutes on a 6 hop round trip with 200 cargo; so that would be 96k for your 40 cargo space, every ten minutes. I could make more if I optimised the cargo space but being a combat pilot and pvper at heart, it felt wrong dropping any and all defence for the sake of a few more credits per hour when profits are already so damn high.

Note, this is not some optimised trade route, I did not pull it from a website, or spend ages finding it, I was so annoyed reading and hearing about the profits of trading compared to other trades, I decided to try it myself. I sold my asp, bought a type 7, and simply traded the most expensive items available between the station I was at, and a station I knew would have items to trade in the other direction.

The bit you are interested in, I am sure, are the items and stations, I was trading between a high population High tech and high population extraction/refinery, hauling Palladium to the high tech and either Performance enhancers or consumer tech the other. After a few hours I found rotating the consumer tech with performance enh I was not saturating the route dragging down my profit as much as I would otherwise do only trading one and not the other. The palladium price being far more per ton than anything else available, the profit V profit loss due saturation was not so much that I could make anything like the same trading an alternative on that leg of the trip.

Although I am sure you are not interested, and nor would I blame you, I became so disgusted after a few days that this sort of profit is available, so easily, that I have stopped playing until such time that the developers get a clue and the other careers are brought in line or failing that, until they reward the career paths requiring the greatest effort, and greatest player skill more than the easiest mechanic in the game.
 
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nazartp

N
DogTailRed2 said:
I've made money from missions and I've made money from rares.
I'm not talking a few creds I'm talking 100k a pop at least with a 40ton hold.
But I've never made any money trading normals.

So what's the secret?
Click to expand...

Profitability of what you do strongly depends on your ship's hold.

Early stages with little hold - exploration and missions are your best friends.
Slightly upgraded ship with a bit of weaponry (i.e., 8-16 size cargo hold) - bounty hunting, missions and, if you know how, mining.
Intermediate size hold, i.e., Hauler and Cobra - trading rares is by far the most profitable per unit of time.
Starting with Asp, marginally (it is still a good ship for trading rares due to its jump range) and above - normal trading brings the best return per hour.

As you see, there is a natural progression to trading. If you are in a Cobra, just run rares. Participate in pirate hunting at Tanmark and you'll get some extra Onionheads next week.

When trading rares DO NOT go on the crazy 70-stop routes that are floating around these boards unless you want to explore along the way. The best return per hour is either running between Witchhaul and Lave clusters of rares or Zeessze and Lave clusters (I prefer the latter). I tend to run those long 70-90 stop routes when I get a new ship - lets you explore along the way and with frequent stops you are getting used to the quirks of your new ship. Return per hour though is nowhere near the return on those cluster runs.
 

the100thmonkey

the100thmonkey
I found the key to a consistent profit that doesn't nosedive after a few runs is to make sure the population in the stations is high. This stops the supply crashing and prices rising, or demand crashing and prices falling.
 

Hudsonn

Hudsonn
What would you say is the best profit per hour in cobra would be? (trading rares) Or what would you be aiming for?
 

nazartp

N
Hudsonn said:
What would you say is the best profit per hour in cobra would be? (trading rares) Or what would you be aiming for?
Click to expand...

Cobra - definitely trading rares. Consider the following. Without dropping shield we are talking 44T of cargo space. Excellent routes yield about 12,000 to 15,000 cr per ton per hour. We are talking about 660,000 cr per hour at best. Trading rares would yield similar amount, but remember, those 12-15k routes are, first, not common (typical average return is 10-12k), second, tend to get run into the ground by competition. Rares, on the other hand yield perfectly predictable results and are known.
 

Protoplasmic traveler

Protoplasmic traveler
DogTailRed2 said:
I've made money from missions and I've made money from rares.
I'm not talking a few creds I'm talking 100k a pop at least with a 40ton hold.
But I've never made any money trading normals.

So what's the secret?
Click to expand...

I am no expert on trading by any means but I am consistent, obsessive and I stick at it no matter how bored I get because I keep my eyes on the objective.

Find a good route and keep it to yourself - I make one million with my anaconda in a round trip that takes only 15 minutes from start to finish (dock). Start with the small ships and grind, upgrading it as you need to and then buy the next ship up from that and then upgrade it as you are able to. Keep going and do not stop or be distracted by other things like bounty hunting or rares. If you want to make big money trading you need big ships and the funds to allow you to buy the expensive commodities. Once you have the big ships and the funds behind you to power your trade you have the keys to the kingdom.

I only ever traded rares once and that was right at the beginning. The money was there to be made but the problem I find that it was not a part of my mind-set and work ethic, which is to make the most amount of profit for the least amount of effort.

I found that conventional trading paid off better in the long run and as my ships got bigger the profits got better but only if I kept pouring the profits into upgrades.

The trick is to have two ships, one exclusively for trading and the other, and the little one (I used an Eagle) exclusively for scouting trade routes with the requirement within the vicinity of my base of operation. Keep the maximum to 30 to 40 light years and you will start making profits for the least amount of effort. Sure, there are better monies to be made if you jump out further but time is money or rather time means more outlay for fuel which in the big ships is quite an expense (good cargo space take up good amounts of cargo space) so keep your trade routs short and lucrative.


[video=youtube;OC42WSS5Jr0]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OC42WSS5Jr0[/video]
 
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Alshain

Alshain
When I had a 40 ton cargo bay, I just traded rares and bounty hunted until I could afford a T6. That is when the real trading begins.

I'm currently making just shy of 260k round trip profit (roughly 1.5million/hour) in my T6 with a 104 cargo hold. I found two stations really close to their stars within 2 jumps (25 ly) where I can do a trade of Palladium for Performance Enhancers. It's been pretty lucrative, but it took me about an hour to find it.

I started out fuel scooping but found I was only spending 3000 credits worth of fuel round trip and 4 tons palladium made more money than that alone, not counting the 4 tons performance enhancers (pure profit) and about 1 extra trip time savings (more pure profit). So now I'm just buying fuel.

This video was immensely helpful, however keep in mind he is in an Anaconda, in a T6 you can make do with about 7,000 supply, as long as it is marked as High demand and high supply at the two stations, you should get a tidy sum. You aren't going to deplete the market all that fast with a 100 ton cargo hold.

[video=youtube;oXyYykbk07A]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oXyYykbk07A[/video]

Once you get enough money, that Asp will get you a small cargo hold improvement, but more importantly, it will get you that 25ly 1 jump range. It's worth the update. My long term goal is a clipper, I haven't planned beyond that.
 
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cmdr lowest

C
Hudsonn said:
What would you say is the best profit per hour in cobra would be? (trading rares) Or what would you be aiming for?
Click to expand...

Maybe two trade runs in a Cobra then buy a T6 if you're into trading. You get about 100T of cargo in a T6; more if you gut the shield but forget rares at that level. It will take you all day to fill it.

I'm surprised nobody has mentioned slaves yet. Very profitable returns. My Asp is kind-of like a passenger ship... kind-of.
 

Starnr

Starnr
Asp At 100 T= + 1million an hour.
T6 At 100T = + 1million an hour.
T6 at 100T is the answer. you can figure out why on your own:)
 

SGTHACK

SGTHACK
I just got an Asp from normal trading. Up to this point all together 18m. Its a grind, but for me very fun..
 

GJ51

GJ51
100k with 40T hold = 2500 cr/t round trip

You can find those all over the Empire, Imperial slaves one way beryllium/gold/progenital cells on return.
 

Alshain

Alshain
Starnr said:
Asp At 100 T= + 1million an hour.
T6 At 100T = + 1million an hour.
T6 at 100T is the answer. you can figure out why on your own:)
Click to expand...

Correction

T6 At 104 T with 19.5Ly max laden range
Asp At 120 T with 25.3Ly max laden range

Now which is better? I'm making way more money with the Asp, simply because my 2 jump route became 1. T6 is still good though because Asp is more expensive, but the Asp makes a good stepping stone between T6 and T7 or Clipper
 
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