Does Frontier use gameplay design testers?

[B33 ENN]

Are assassination missions well designed?

UPDATE: This is intended to be a constructive discussion, not a ranting complaint thread, so please try not to take it that way.

Continuing from the title, it seems to me, not really. I'll explain. Many concepts in this game are great, no argument there. However, the execution leaves a lot to be desired in terms of respecting the players enjoyment of activities for time spent.

For example, a few months ago, when I played, I avoided assassination missions because they were a major time sink of hopping from USS to USS hoping the RNG would spawn your quarry. Until the battle itself, there was no challenging gameplay because flying the ship, particularly in supercruise requires no skill whatsoever, i.e. unlike a real flight simulator where constant management against the physics of flight is the piece de resistance of the genre.

No, I'm on a rank progression mission for the Emire, something that took me ages just sitting around doing tedious trucking missions to get. Unfortunately, it's an assassination - all that was available. I hoped this aspect might have improved by now. The only thing I can see so far changed is that I need a FSI device because they can appear in supercruise. I was optimistic about this because I thought this would literally cut to the chase.

Now, after an hour or so aimlessly supercruising around clicking targets, hoping into USS, etc.. again requiring no hunting skills, I found him. Unfortunately, before I could attempt an interdiction, he hyperspaced so I lost him. Assuming he'd come back, I continued searching as before, even hypering out of the system and back again, telling myself, "well the game RNG might respawn him quicker that way" (great immersion right there ).

He hasn't re-appeared after another hour or so, and I'm in the Steam Overlay catching up on websites while supercruising around hoping to find him before the timer runs out on the mission. So, in the hours I've spent so far today doing this, I'm asking myself why didn't I just go blast some pirates in a RES until I'd had my fill, and then go play Mad Max which finished downloading? Well. the answer is I'm not ranking up because there is some enjoyable career benefit as an Imperial Navy man in the game, because so far as I can see there is no career system. I'm doing it simply because it's an artificial hurdle the developer threw in to make me grind for the chance to fly an Imperial Eagle or Courier, and that's the part of the game that will be fun again for me.

So, I'm throwing this out to you folks. What am I doing wrong, or is this the way this game is meant to be played by deliberate design? Do you enjoy this process, or do you put up with it, like me, simply to grind to the fun moments?

 

[CMDR Byr Goefin]

For example, a few months ago, when I played, I avoided assassination missions because they were a major time sink of hopping from USS to USS hoping the RNG would spawn your quarry. .

It always amazes me when someone writes a big long screed about how the game is broken when the problem is that they are doing it wrong.

 

[B33 ENN]

It always amazes me when someone writes a big long screed about how the game is broken when the problem is that they are doing it wrong.

Can you quote me the part where I said the game is broken? And did you get to the end paragraph where I asked for input saying: "What am I doing wrong...?"

 

[SentineI]

when the problem is that they are doing it wrong.

This has got to be a contender for least-helpful reply. (Hint: What should they be doing that they are not?)

 

[B33 ENN]

I do understand that there are often many complaint threads that pop up from frustrated players, and I want to avoid that as much as anyone. If I'm "doing it wrong" that's exactly what I need to know. I've got a couple of hours left to hunt this guy, and the game is giving me no further clue as to his possible whereabouts or how to track him, except that he's in this system. No indication of a particular point of interest to wait around or scan... So if Frontier have added a way to track him specifically apart from the other NPCs floating about, I'd love to know!

 

[CMDR Byr Goefin]

This has got to be a contender for least-helpful reply. (Hint: What should they be doing that they are not?)

He did not ask for help, he just starting complaining about something he did not understand, and claimed Elite did not test things.

This is Elite Dangerous, not Elite Let Me Do That For You.

You interdict them. They are easy to find in Hyperspace. Hell, sometimes they are transmitting.

You can also follow them around and drop in on their wake when they drop.

But randomly dropping in on Signals?

MADNESS!

OP: The whole premise of the thread is something is wrong with Elite. That, by definition, means it is broken.

P.S. I probably would have told you if the title was "Help with Assassination missions" and not "

Does Frontier use gameplay design testers?

Continuing from the title, it seems to me, not really.​

Because one is asking for help, the other is complaining.

O
​

 

[MottiKhan]

You probably need a better FSD interdictor. The better ones have a longer range. Also, sometimes, you fail a mission. I've found that assassination missions are the most prone to failure, but are also the most rewarding.

If you're just looking to rank up, there'll be other ranking missions available so you don't have to take the assassination ones if you don't care to. The extra missions will likely be in another system, so you might have to travel a little. You can also log out and log back in under a different mode (solo/private/open) to reset the missions.

Good hunting.

 

[Kicks]

I understand what the OP is saying, and I also understand what the detractors are trying to say.

My answer is that we're at the birth of a new kind of gaming, and Elite Dangerous is a stepping stone to where we want to be.

There is a bit (or a lot?) of RNG in some of the missions.. the background simulator doesn't really live up to expectations in many people's eyes, and the universe does feel a little bleak.


All of that said, with Frontier's resources, one or both of two things are going to happen. ED's universe gets richer, or a competitor does it better. Frontier have an advantage at the moment in the realistic simulation of the Milky Way, and some game-play mechanics to hand-wave some other discrepancies.

Personally, I love the direction FD are going with this. But it won't happen overnight.

 

[Cynaqq]

Just gonna speak my mind. May or may not actually answer your question.

This game speaks to me. Every speck of light I see around me, every sound my ship makes as I boost through the vast emptiness that is space... I turned off the game music, just so I can hear the wonderful background chit chat of celestial radiators all around me and listen to the song of supercruise. Did you know supercruise sings a delightful song at full speed? May be it's the FSD that sings, I don't know, but something does.

Let me tell you a story, once I was carrying some weapons to fellow rebels in a small system. They were preparing to go against the tyranny of the corporate scum controlling their homeland. I was cruising happily, one eye on the sensors, one looking ahead, when suddenly alarms went off. What ever was interdicting me had to be quite close cause I couldn't get away easily so I submitted. No biggie, being in a Cobra fitted for max speed. I started boosting away as soon as we dropped out. Two ships they were, one python and one eagle. They were after my cargo. Apparently either my supplier was double crossing me or the rebel guys had a mole in their midst. I didn't care much, my girl, the ICCS Irata is way too fast for them. But then another pyton dropped in right in front of me. A sudden upwards thrust was all that saved me from crashing into it head on. Then another dropped and then another. I was frantically dodging ships dropping left and right until the FSD cooldown was done. When I finally jumped back into SC, my shields had took a bit of a beating but I had nothing a cold beer in the station couldn't fix. Last I heard the corporate tyrants had almost wiped my rebel pals out but I never get too attached to clients anyway.

Stories like this are what make this game for me. Maybe it really is a story tellers game disguised as a space sim. Some don't even agree it's a sim, well, I don't really care. Everything about this game make sense to me. Trade being the easiest but the boringest way to make money with some risk of losing it all? Just like real life I would say, I'm a simple man. Most of the missions being about trucking stuff from system to system? If you colonize thousands upon thousands of star systems, you bet you gonna have all the trucking you can get since it's all about resources and those resources need to get around somehow.

About the imperial ships locked behind the rank, I couldn't care less, fed ships either, though I get the notion. If I had any ambitions of becoming a big player in a game of houses, Daes Dae'mar it was called in another age, an age yet to come, an age long past, I would too devise some tedious gruntwork to weed out weaklings from the truly loyal.

I hope I made sense.

 

[B33 ENN]

You interdict them. They are easy to find in Hyperspace. Hell, sometimes they are transmitting.

Checked my comms... nothing from him before he vanished.

You can also follow them around and drop in on their wake when they drop.

Okay, will try that if it happens again if and when I find him.

OP: The whole premise of the thread is something is wrong with Elite. That, by definition, means it is broken.

It only implies it is broken if you think in black and white. Broken in software design means it doesn't work. Here that is not the argument, because it does work. The criticism is how long it takes, how random it is, and whether that's a fun way to design it.

This area of the game was criticised in the past, and they improved it by adding the supercruise detection of these targets, which wasn't there before, and back then you could ONLY find them by dropping in on USS, etc. Even then no one said it was broken, just not good fun.

If criticism of the game bothers you, and you have nothing helpful to add, just ignore the thread and move on. For me, I tend to criticise, as constructively as possible, the things I like most.

 

[Kristov]

Just gonna speak my mind. May or may not actually answer your question.

This game speaks to me. Every speck of light I see around me, every sound my ship makes as I boost through the vast emptiness that is space... I turned off the game music, just so I can hear the wonderful background chit chat of celestial radiators all around me and listen to the song of supercruise. Did you know supercruise sings a delightful song at full speed? May be it's the FSD that sings, I don't know, but something does.

Let me tell you a story, once I was carrying some weapons to fellow rebels in a small system. They were preparing to go against the tyranny of the corporate scum controlling their homeland. I was cruising happily, one eye on the sensors, one looking ahead, when suddenly alarms went off. What ever was interdicting me had to be quite close cause I couldn't get away easily so I submitted. No biggie, being in a Cobra fitted for max speed. I started boosting away as soon as we dropped out. Two ships they were, one python and one eagle. They were after my cargo. Apparently either my supplier was double crossing me or the rebel guys had a mole in their midst. I didn't care much, my girl, the ICCS Irata is way too fast for them. But then another pyton dropped in right in front of me. A sudden upwards thrust was all that saved me from crashing into it head on. Then another dropped and then another. I was frantically dodging ships dropping left and right until the FSD cooldown was done. When I finally jumped back into SC, my shields had took a bit of a beating but I had nothing a cold beer in the station couldn't fix. Last I heard the corporate tyrants had almost wiped my rebel pals out but I never get too attached to clients anyway.

Stories like this are what make this game for me. Maybe it really is a story tellers game disguised as a space sim. Some don't even agree it's a sim, well, I don't really care. Everything about this game make sense to me. Trade being the easiest but the boringest way to make money with some risk of losing it all? Just like real life I would say, I'm a simple man. Most of the missions being about trucking stuff from system to system? If you colonize thousands upon thousands of star systems, you bet you gonna have all the trucking you can get since it's all about resources and those resources need to get around somehow.

About the imperial ships locked behind the rank, I couldn't care less, fed ships either, though I get the notion. If I had any ambitions of becoming a big player in a game of houses, Daes Dae'mar it was called in another age, an age yet to come, an age long past, I would too devise some tedious gruntwork to weed out weaklings from the truly loyal.

I hope I made sense.

Well said, damn well said.

B33, assassination missions aren't easy, they aren't meant to be. You are usually told your target has been SEEN in a certain system, which implies they may or may NOT be in that system, it doesn't mean they will be in that system, you will have to HUNT your target down. I've run across my target in the same system I got the assassination mission in, which was 10LY from the system he was last seen in, interdicted him, killed him, got my reward, that quick. Other times, I've spent hours hunting the system last seen in, nothing, jumped to a system nearby, et viola, my target! USSs aren't where you go hunting for assassination targets, as your target will usually be found flying around in SC, maybe in the system last seen, maybe not, you'll need to go hunting.

 

[CMDR Byr Goefin]

If criticism of the game bothers you, and you have nothing helpful to add, just ignore the thread and move on. For me, I tend to criticise, as constructively as possible, the things I like most.

Criticism from a point of misunderstanding and lack of knowledge is not criticism.

If you criticized Weeping Woman because Picasso didn't finish painting it, that is not serious Criticism, that is lack of understanding.

 

[DNA-Decay]

Maybe.

Not important.

What counts is:

FDev are engaged with their community.
And the game is being actively worked on.

Whatever you might want a gameplay design tester to do.
Will have to be done live and in the wild.

 

[jgm]

B33, assassination missions aren't easy, they aren't meant to be. You are usually told your target has been SEEN in a certain system, which implies they may or may NOT be in that system, it doesn't mean they will be in that system, you will have to HUNT your target down. I've run across my target in the same system I got the assassination mission in, which was 10LY from the system he was last seen in, interdicted him, killed him, got my reward, that quick. Other times, I've spent hours hunting the system last seen in, nothing, jumped to a system nearby, et viola, my target! USSs aren't where you go hunting for assassination targets, as your target will usually be found flying around in SC, maybe in the system last seen, maybe not, you'll need to go hunting.

Yep if you go to the named system and can't see your target in supercruise after a couple of minutes try checking the surrounding systems. If nothing there then go back to the named system and hang about in supercruise some more.

 

[Brujah]

He did not ask for help, he just starting complaining about something he did not understand, and claimed Elite did not test things.

This is Elite Dangerous, not Elite Let Me Do That For You.

You interdict them. They are easy to find in Hyperspace. Hell, sometimes they are transmitting.

You can also follow them around and drop in on their wake when they drop.

But randomly dropping in on Signals?

MADNESS!

OP: The whole premise of the thread is something is wrong with Elite. That, by definition, means it is broken.

P.S. I probably would have told you if the title was "Help with Assassination missions" and not "

Because one is asking for help, the other is complaining.

O
​

To be fair, I've occassionally had the Pirate Lords drop into my normal space when I've been fighting someone else and start blasting away at my ship. Given they're usually in a Python or Anaconda, those always turned into pretty hairy fights. Some of the most entertaining behaviour by NPCs I've seen in the game too.
So it's clearly possible to find these NPCs by dropping into USSs, even if it's not the most optimal way to do so.

Regardless, posting criticism with no constructive feedback just wastes everyone's time. Tell the guy what he was doing wrong, not just that he was doing it wrong. Which, in fairness to you, you did the second time around, so good on you.

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

OP, in regards to your general issue, I do tend to agree. They add complexity and hurdles without any sort of immersive reason for why. It's all well and good to say "I need to gain the Baron rank with the Empire so they'll give me access to the nice ships," but it would be more pleasing for there to be something else going on too. Even something akin to the reputation with the local station changing the Welcome Message would go some way to improving that feeling.

 

[GJ51]

Once you become eligible to progress to the next rank, that cannot be lost. You will continue to receive missions until you complete one and move up to the next rank. they will not all be assassination missions, and you can abandon the one you have without consequence.

If you would rather complete the current mission, just cruise around the system selecting various destinations within the system. Stop in at the Nav Beacon, if no target, then select a station or outpost destination and cruise there. Check signal sources if they present as the target is sometimes in one. If the mission states that the target is in a particular system, then it is there somewhere. If the mission lists more than one system, you may have to check out each one using the same techniques.

HTH

 

[steevaavoo]

Let me tell you a story, once I was carrying some weapons to fellow rebels in a small system. They were preparing to go against the tyranny of the corporate scum controlling their homeland. I was cruising happily, one eye on the sensors, one looking ahead, when suddenly alarms went off. What ever was interdicting me had to be quite close cause I couldn't get away easily so I submitted. No biggie, being in a Cobra fitted for max speed. I started boosting away as soon as we dropped out. Two ships they were, one python and one eagle. They were after my cargo. Apparently either my supplier was double crossing me or the rebel guys had a mole in their midst. I didn't care much, my girl, the ICCS Irata is way too fast for them. But then another pyton dropped in right in front of me. A sudden upwards thrust was all that saved me from crashing into it head on. Then another dropped and then another. I was frantically dodging ships dropping left and right until the FSD cooldown was done. When I finally jumped back into SC, my shields had took a bit of a beating but I had nothing a cold beer in the station couldn't fix. Last I heard the corporate tyrants had almost wiped my rebel pals out but I never get too attached to clients anyway.

I really enjoyed this - thank you!

You've given me some inspiration.

 

[SpitTheDog]

It just sounds like you wanted the target to appear quickly and stick around so you could kill them. Plenty of others have complained that sort of thing is too easy.

To complete this the first time around you would have needed a FSI, Wake Scanner, and patience. You only had one of them.

They say the missions will change so we get other types of assassination missions. I see your point, it could certainly be done better but the way you put it, you don't seem to want more depth or complexity, you just want to get it done quickly,

 

[TomP]

This is Elite Dangerous, not Elite Let Me Do That For You.

Bravo! This sentence could reasonably answer so very many threads on this forum.

 

[CMDR Byr Goefin]

Regardless, posting criticism with no constructive feedback just wastes everyone's time. Tell the guy what he was doing wrong, not just that he was doing it wrong. Which, in fairness to you, you did the second time around, so good on you.

No, that was me being weak and giving into to social pressure.

Had he ASKED instead of complained about something he did not fully understand, I would have gladly helped him.

I ask people for help, they help me. Someone asks for help, I help them.

I don't help complainers, it just encourages the behavior. Which I ended up doing anyway. Oh well.