Dump SC

[Han Zulu]

There was some sort of concept of an interdiction "net" - so the pirates would wait half-way between the nav beacon and the space station with a net, you'd jump between the two, get caught in the net, and drop out and have to fight.

You could also have the drop-out be further from the station than it currently is, so rather than supercruising, then dropping basically on top of the NFZ, you'd micro-jump to about 50km from the station and pirates would have time to intercept you on the way in

Interesting.

With the 50km distance, it does take a while to try to get to the station anyway, so supercruise for 5 minutes, or drop from a jump 5 min away from the station, I guess wouldn't really have changed the issue of this thread. The OP wants a direct jump to the station, so that solution wouldn't have worked either.

USSes would also have made more sense - you'd have done a system scan, the USSes would have been revealed, and then you could select one as a jump target and go to it.

Ah. Well, that would really have sped things up for sure.

Interesting that there were concepts and ideas where those things were solved as well. Didn't know. And I appreciate that you explained it to me because I couldn't think of how it could've been solved.

For the basic trade-pirate-hunt gameplay it would probably have been better than supercruise ... but for actually exploring the galaxy, and especially for planetary approach and landings, supercruise works far better.

True. Because, it does feel more like that you're part of the space that you're examining. Jumping around would feel like loading screens to mini games. The way it is now, however slow and boring the travel can be at times, it does bring you in to be part of the world itself somehow.

(Like every solution to the "space is big" problem it's a compromise. With multiplayer limiting the options already, supercruise is probably the best of the alternatives, but certainly not without its problems.)

Of course. But when I saw one of the star citizen beta test plays last year and he jumped from one point to another, I kind'a felt disappointed. Elite's supercruise most definitely feels more "real", if you know what I mean.

Another thing that's interesting with this thread is... how impatient are we today? Something takes 5 minutes to play, and we're upset because we're getting bored. Personally, time flies by so fast that I feel we just left 2016 behind us. That's more than a year ago. Doing something boring is okay. Life is so busy as it is.

 

[JetsonRING]

I am, sure FDev will get right on completely altering the entire game and create teleportation just because you want it. If you hold your breath it might happen faster.

 

[Ian Doncaster]

Interesting that there were concepts and ideas where those things were solved as well.

Looking back on it all, there's a lot of things that were in the game on release which seem to me to be planned to make sense with a microjump mechanic that were then patched-in to work with supercruise but which there wasn't time to reimplement in full.

Nav beacons (pre- the recentish change to let you scan them for system data)
USSes (especially in the earlier implementations)
Instances only populating on arrival (without supercruise, and if you dropped 50km from a station, this would barely be noticeable)

Which given how close to release it was when the decision to change from microjumps to supercruise was made, isn't surprising. That Frontier got it working at all in that short time without having the original release of the game slip noticeably was impressive.

Another thing that's interesting with this thread is... how impatient are we today? Something takes 5 minutes to play, and we're upset because we're getting bored. Personally, time flies by so fast that I feel we just left 2016 behind us. That's more than a year ago. Doing something boring is okay. Life is so busy as it is.

Obviously games are and should be different to real life, and in an action-based genre like Elite make some effort to skip and shorten the boring bits.

But it does amuse me when people claim stations 15 minutes travel from the primary star are in the middle of nowhere and it's not realistic that they'd be out there or paying similar prices to everywhere else for goods and services.

 

[Druid]

OK , I concede . Keep SC . Too many obviously want it and as I am democratic Ill go with that . Also, it stands out that it isn't perfect either . Can we get rid of this gravity well stuff or at least calm it down. Would it hurt to speed SC up (a lot lol).

There how very conciliatory of me lol

 

[Druid]

Han . You say I wouldn't be interested in dropping 50k from the station. Actually I would, because it makes more sense and in that area you will have action in real time actually flying the ship properly not this speed up nasty we have now.

 

[-VR- Max Factor]

OK , I concede . Keep SC . Too many obviously want it and as I am democratic Ill go with that . Also, it stands out that it isn't perfect either . Can we get rid of this gravity well stuff or at least calm it down. Would it hurt to speed SC up (a lot lol).

There how very conciliatory of me lol

Having the gravity well stuff is what makes it fun and interesting for me. Want to get somewhere fast, plan your route to avoid them, if you don't care, just go in a straight line. You are complaining that it's boring, then you want to take away something that can make it interesting and interactive.

 

[Kenneth McGrew]

Don't want it . Pointless waste of time . I do not want a speed up getting somewhere I just want to be there . OOO I need to slow down a bit and hit a button after 5 minutes of doing nothing. Let me click on where I want to be and let me be there . Ill happily fly to the actual station / ship content / planet or asteroid belt but I do not want to spend half my time messing about flying in a straight line keeping my speed at the right lvl. Intercept me if you like and stop me but after I have dealt with whatever that is let me carry on and just be there.

I know there are a few pilots who like making things "hard" for yourselves, you probably like to play flight sims in real time as well, but I don't . SC just puts me off the game completely . There is no skill and no enjoyment .

Elite was always about making credits and shooting stuff. Well not in frontier I couldn't hit anything in that. This hideous SC botch up is just terrible.

Therefore as you have finally managed to add a trade feature in the upcoming beta that should have actually been in the game from the beginning can we now add the feature where I can jump to a system click on where I want to be in that system , have a few whirly lights or something and be at the location 20k out or something . Sure knock me out if you like and get attacked , I don't care but come on gaming is supposed to be fun . Bounty hunting , track , they are in such and such a place, go there . Fight in the space station area, nav point, asteroid belt who cares just let us go there.

I shall await the go play another game comments . Well I am, planet coaster funnily enough and ghost recon . It is such a shame as Elite is one of my first loves but for me it is ruined by this stupid mechanic. I accept others may like it but I would imagine you are a minority. Why do I say this ? Because every one of my long term guild of 20 years who played ED from alpha have stopped , not only due to SC, but it is a major complaint.

As ever we wait for the game to evolve and I am sure it will but please do something about this ogre in the rough diamond.

PS. Tried ED while with guild mates while on a beer run with the guys at xmas on Oculas . Looks fantastic in VR but not in SC as it was still pointless, just wanted to get to the station to have a look around .

PPS I am 54 years old I have not got long let on this world and I cant afford to have 50% of my game time taken up with a pointless mechanic

Cheers with respect . Hope the new update works out let me know when SC has changed and we shall try again. [up]

someone else who sees sense, SC is just like flight sim in the sense of its as exciting as flying a route from London to sydney in real time!

i see your boggle with SC i too hate SC, but getting rid of it isnt the answer but it needs to significantly improve before we all turn into dribbling vegetables

 

[Maka Gucci]

Still tryna imagine interdictions without SC

 

[Tiny_Rick]

Don't want it . Pointless waste of time

I Disagree. I don't need a lengthy soliloquy ripe with nigh-ridiculous assumptions, I simply don't think you're correct.

 

[wstephenson]

Thank you Ian for your insight about PoIs and navy beacons. This feels plausible.

I wonder why, during Beta, the SC drop range was decreased from 20km to the 9km we have now? It only makes for a bit more time on approach, and this could have been used for more drama and confrontation. I used to enjoy sprinting for the NFZ with someone shooting at me. Nowadays I drop and the NPC hunter arrives and departs with a "They aren't paying me enough for this".

 

[Captain Jack Sparrow]

Please sell your game. one of the worst ideas ever.

 

[DARGAN]

translator

I add but it's really for fun and written and rewritten here, removing SC is impossible, the entire game should be rebuilt, a bad choice of games.

otherwise there is already in the game megaship that transports us over long distances, develop a transport network towards certain important points.

 

[space voyager]

You'll have to forgive me. I'm a little distance away from the Bubble so I can't just check for myself. Does this full travel distance information include assassination missions where you have to speak to a contact to find out where your target is? Brilliant if it does.

But I'd still prefer a bit of a reduction in the time idly watching stars whizzing past.

No. Also surface scan missions don't have this either since you're not supposed to know which planet will have the scan mission until you scan the nav beacon or use the advanced discovery scanner in the system. For those missions you're still gambling. Or you check the system data to see if there are far away destinations possibe...

 

[CMDR Karrde Sun]

Dump SC, sounds like you need to pick up SC (and would fit right in there ).

/spam

 

[MickyG1982]

Don't want it . Pointless waste of time . I do not want a speed up getting somewhere I just want to be there . OOO I need to slow down a bit and hit a button after 5 minutes of doing nothing. Let me click on where I want to be and let me be there . Ill happily fly to the actual station / ship content / planet or asteroid belt but I do not want to spend half my time messing about flying in a straight line keeping my speed at the right lvl. Intercept me if you like and stop me but after I have dealt with whatever that is let me carry on and just be there.

I know there are a few pilots who like making things "hard" for yourselves, you probably like to play flight sims in real time as well, but I don't . SC just puts me off the game completely . There is no skill and no enjoyment .

Elite was always about making credits and shooting stuff. Well not in frontier I couldn't hit anything in that. This hideous SC botch up is just terrible.

Therefore as you have finally managed to add a trade feature in the upcoming beta that should have actually been in the game from the beginning can we now add the feature where I can jump to a system click on where I want to be in that system , have a few whirly lights or something and be at the location 20k out or something . Sure knock me out if you like and get attacked , I don't care but come on gaming is supposed to be fun . Bounty hunting , track , they are in such and such a place, go there . Fight in the space station area, nav point, asteroid belt who cares just let us go there.

I shall await the go play another game comments . Well I am, planet coaster funnily enough and ghost recon . It is such a shame as Elite is one of my first loves but for me it is ruined by this stupid mechanic. I accept others may like it but I would imagine you are a minority. Why do I say this ? Because every one of my long term guild of 20 years who played ED from alpha have stopped , not only due to SC, but it is a major complaint.

As ever we wait for the game to evolve and I am sure it will but please do something about this ogre in the rough diamond.

PS. Tried ED while with guild mates while on a beer run with the guys at xmas on Oculas . Looks fantastic in VR but not in SC as it was still pointless, just wanted to get to the station to have a look around .

PPS I am 54 years old I have not got long let on this world and I cant afford to have 50% of my game time taken up with a pointless mechanic

Cheers with respect . Hope the new update works out let me know when SC has changed and we shall try again. [up]

You can "dump supercruise" already. Just travel under normal space. About 5 mins in you'll be begging for it back...

 

[Sysmon]

A space sim without space? Interesting concept.

S

 

[DocLooshkin]

There are three distinct modes of travel available to a ship. Depending on the scale of the journey, pilots may fly through “normal space” using conventional thrusters.

For longer journeys still limited to the same system, pilots engage the ship’s frame shift drive to compress space around their ship, giving the impression (and effectively the result) of travel at speeds faster than light.

For journeys between different star systems, the pilot once more uses the frame shift drive, operating it at maximum effect. This allows incredible distances to be covered in seconds. However, the imprecision of such travel requires special destination targeting.

The description in the manual accessible from the launcher describes the FSD operating in exactly the same manner as the Alcubierre Drive.

I'd say not. This is only correct if the phrase "compressing space around the ship" described something unique to Alcubierre, but it doesn't. If interpreted vaguely enough, it describes almost every conceivable interpretation of any hypothetical spacewarp drive that anyone, anywhere could possibly come up with. Alcubierre's version is certainly not excluded by the phrase, as such, but all the features most characteristic of an Alcubierre warp drive are neither described in the manual, nor shown in the game.

At mimimum, I'd expect to see substantial spatial lensing around a "jumping" ship, complete with highly destructive and propulsive effects on any objects in range, as space expands around and within those objects. An Alcubierre warp drive would enable ships to increase speed gradually, I wouldn't expect an instant jump to SuperCruise.

Once in SC, I'd expect to see highly-visible distortions, with everything in the centreline of travel seeming to be much nearer and approaching annoyingly slowly - and objects to the side stretching out and getting faster, the further they get from the centreline and towards the rear of the ship.

Instead, in SuperCruise, space quite visibly shrinks in uniform fashion in all directions, as though the ship were increasing in size, as we speed up - and this is also what the manual describes, when interpreted as an intelligent and complete statement.

Alcubierre's warp drive paper offers no hope of any ability to travel in hyperspace. Aside from briefly noting that wormholes and warp drives would both require hypothetical exotic matter to work, it doesn't contemplate it, lead to it, or suggest it in any way at all. Beyond the use of exotic materials to alter spacetime, something almost inherently universal to the idea of FTL travel, the two premises have virtually nothing in common.

ED's manual states that SuperCruise and Hyperspace jumps are the same thing, separated only by degree. To use a TV trope, that's the Word of God saying the FSD isn't Alcubierre-based, right there.

There's nothing to stop FD doing the work needed to adjust and retcon the FSD into an Alcubierre drive if they want to - or even adding it as a separate thing, if they think something that OP will be fun - but that's not what's shown in the game at present.

 

[Lucifera Danzig]

I'd say not. This is only correct if the phrase "compressing space around the ship" described something unique to Alcubierre, but it doesn't. If interpreted vaguely enough, it describes almost every conceivable interpretation of any hypothetical spacewarp drive that anyone, anywhere could possibly come up with. Alcubierre's version is certainly not excluded by the phrase, as such, but all the features most characteristic of an Alcubierre warp drive are neither described in the manual, nor shown in the game.

At mimimum, I'd expect to see substantial spatial lensing around a "jumping" ship, complete with highly destructive and propulsive effects on any objects in range, as space expands around and within those objects. An Alcubierre warp drive would enable ships to increase speed gradually, I wouldn't expect an instant jump to SuperCruise.

Once in SC, I'd expect to see highly-visible distortions, with everything in the centreline of travel seeming to be much nearer and approaching annoyingly slowly - and objects to the side stretching out and getting faster, the further they get from the centreline and towards the rear of the ship.

Instead, in SuperCruise, space quite visibly shrinks in uniform fashion in all directions, as though the ship were increasing in size, as we speed up - and this is also what the manual describes, when interpreted as an intelligent and complete statement.

Alcubierre's warp drive paper offers no hope of any ability to travel in hyperspace. Aside from briefly noting that wormholes and warp drives would both require hypothetical exotic matter to work, it doesn't contemplate it, lead to it, or suggest it in any way at all. Beyond the use of exotic materials to alter spacetime, something almost inherently universal to the idea of FTL travel, the two premises have virtually nothing in common.

ED's manual states that SuperCruise and Hyperspace jumps are the same thing, separated only by degree. To use a TV trope, that's the Word of God saying the FSD isn't Alcubierre-based, right there.

There's nothing to stop FD doing the work needed to adjust and retcon the FSD into an Alcubierre drive if they want to - or even adding it as a separate thing, if they think something that OP will be fun - but that's not what's shown in the game at present.

May not require exotic matter at all according to latest revisions of the theory, and in fact does have the possibility of involving hyperspace-like travel:

[video=youtube;94ed4v_T6YM]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=94ed4v_T6YM&ab_channel=PBSSpaceTime[/video]