First, when we are logged, you need to show us the thing already buy!!!!!!!
Second, prices are too big 1€ per paintjob it's hard, 10€ for ship kits...
1) We don't see very often the outside of our ship
2) Elite Dangerous it's not a free to play ....
If its too expensive for you may I suggest not buying them?
The key word is 'Store', a place that you purchase the items you would like and can afford.
go to your local store, ask to speak to the manager. Tell them you think they have priced things too highly and that they should reduce them to suit your finances, let us know how they respond.
First, when we are logged, you need to show us the thing already buy!!!!!!!
Second, prices are too big 1€ per paintjob it's hard, 10€ for ship kits...
1) We don't see very often the outside of our ship
2) Elite Dangerous it's not a free to play ....
First, when we are logged, you need to show us the thing already buy!!!!!!!
Second, prices are too big 1€ per paintjob it's hard, 10€ for ship kits...
1) We don't see very often the outside of our ship
2) Elite Dangerous it's not a free to play ....
Some things are a bit pricey, I agree. I buy selective myself.
But the store does generate revenue for Frontier and it is of the utmost importance, to me at least , that this unique huge Elite project gets completed the way it deserves. There is nothing like it in gaming. We have never seen a space sim of this scope and detail ever before. It has to be completed.
FD only sells cosmetics.
So you can skip all of it, or you can wait for a discount. There are discounts at times.
It is your choice.
1) We don't see very often the outside of our ship
But the store does generate revenue for Frontier and it is of the utmost importance, to me at least , that this unique huge Elite project gets completed the way it deserves. There is nothing like it in gaming. We have never seen a space sim of this scope and detail ever before. It has to be completed.
"Completed"? You must be kidding... a game like Elite will not, can not, and should not, ever, be completed. No matter how good they make it, there'll always be room for more improvements.
If its too expensive for you may I suggest not buying them?
The key word is 'Store', a place that you purchase the items you would like and can afford.
go to your local store, ask to speak to the manager. Tell them you think they have priced things too highly and that they should reduce them to suit your finances, let us know how they respond.
I'm not here for say "i can't pay that, i have no money"... I'm here to say "it is too expensive for what it is"
The things have normal price. For example actually : 1 gold bar it's 39 227 $ when you respect your customer you sell that near this price (39,4K max) when you're a scammer you try to sell that 45k / 50k.
And this exemple it's for a material thing.
The paintjobs it's a model create in 1 maybe 2 hours for the base + 5 minutes for have the 6 different colors and after when we buy it, it's just a "0" becoming "1" in the database...
Paintjobs, it's just "an immaterial electronic things" = no cost for replicate for each players/customers.
In addition to that, when we see our paintjobs?
- when we fit our ship
- when we go out with srv
- when we go out with fighters
- when we use debug cam for create wallpapers / YouTube videos (and not necessary for watch the ship)
That say :
2-3% of time play for player with Horizon
1-2% of time play for player without Horizon
So, for me 1€ / paintjobs and 10€ / ship kits and 1,25€ for decals it's TOO EXPENSIVE!!!
1,25€ for weapon color it seems good to me.
6€ for bobbleheads it's little too much but why not.
1€ to 1,5€ for a full cockpit paintjob, (my small example below) i will pay it!
Ps : Yes in some local store, i can negotiate, when they know they have a price too expensive, they reduce the price (I've already done this in a pharmacy). Indeed, it's impossible to do that in supermarket and on online traders like amazon, but in this case i wait or buy it on small market.
Ps2 : Don't forget also that in the case of paintjobs, FD are borderline with a monopoly ...
Personally I hate that they charge for simple palette swaps. You want to charge for an interesting paint job, like the pirate faction paint jobs or that medusa paint job, sure that would be worth spending money on, but charging money just to change the base color is kind of sad and pathetic. It leaves me even more worried that we will have to pay for every minor adjustment on character creation when that comes out, which might be enough for me to drop the game completely.... This isn't some F2P mobile trash, this is a game most of us payed $60 or more for.
Seriously, this is what I expect as part of the base game in something I pay $60 (actually paid like $75 for elite before there was an open beta, then another $20 for horizons.....): https://youtu.be/BwvT3TpCmGU
Imagine if every minor adjustment was $2-5 and thats what we got on elite. Selling cosmetics is fine, but this is just a giant kick in the balls.
-1 Disagree. Prices are quite reasonable.
Don't want it don't buy it. It's that simple.
Shop there is not so much for personal enrichment, but for basic containment project alive.
Given the big timing until the release of the new seasons (incoming large cash infusions), the store is the only source of funding for the project.
The funny thing about "free market" is... as a seller is totally free to decide at what prices he wants to offer his goods.. while the buyer has total freedom to buy at the requested price - or not. In your case, since youre expressiong your opinion that things look "too expensive" i also would suggest that you simply dont buy anything.
Concerning your "demand" that frontier has to "lower" prices for ALL customers, because YOU personally think it should be that way: I regret to inform you that this decision does not fall within your area of authority. This is not how free market works.
...
On a more general sidenote I think its funny that especially in game forums of all genres, theres a constant barrage of "demands" stating "game item X is too expensive, because I want it, but I want it cheaper"... On the other side, I couldnt stop laughing, because as soon theres a sale going on .. whine threads start to appear stating.. "mimimi.. just yesterday, I bought game item X for the sum of Y Euros. Today I find out that its on sale by 20%. I demand my money back because I have been cheated by game company".
Then theres that bunch of guys in every game that starts reasoning: "but its only a virtual item.. its a flag in the database and should basically be free, because it is not reasonable to assume that changing one single bit in a database from 0 to 1 is worth the sum of X Euros..."
Basically.. I could walk up to every Software Publisher (Microsoft, Adobe, SAP...) and demand their producty be free because.. "hey its only bits and bytes".. "you only had to code it once.. but producing another copy of the already existing piece of code could not posibly cost you thousands of euros, am I right?"
At the entrance of the cinema, after buying my movie ticket - I demand that ticket prices be lowered - because.. "this little piece of paper could not possibly have costed you 12€ to produce?"
Today I buy the newest graphics card for my computer for 1000€.... next year, price has dropped to 150€... .. I walk into the store and demand my money back. because "I have been cheated".
No sir! I think guys like the examples above.. and you suffer from a misconception of the word "free market".
If the price offered to you is not ok with you -> dont buy
If the price offered to you is ok with you -> buy
If the price offered to someone else is lowered AFTER you bought YOURS for a higher price -> not your problem. because it was YOUR decision that YOU were OK with the price that was asked from you at the time of purchase
if the price offered to someone else is raised AFTER you bought yours for a lower price -> (i guess youre not going to complain here), youre free to keep your stuf, or offer it for sale yourself ... and even make a profit thereby *
*
special note: selling used virtual goods in games to another players might be juristically difficult, because usually you dont acquire ownership rights with your purchase. but only a license for usage.... ownership usually stays with the publisher (in this case frontier developments)
Seriously, I explained it's a $60 game, the price of a AAA title, with the cash shop of a F2P mobile game.
$5 for
is good, it's a quality paint job.
$7 for
a simple color change, is a sleezy ripoff
If the game were F2P that would be different, but then I wouldn't touch it with a 10 ft pole, but it's a $60 game. The higher the base price the higher the standards and expectations.
If the game were F2P that would be different, but then I wouldn't touch it with a 10 ft pole, but it's a $60 game. The higher the base price the higher the standards and expectations.
If I understand your example, you're saying that $5 for a single paintjob is fine, but $7 for 6 paintjobs is a ripoff.
Have I got that right? If so, you might just want to check your maths.
Also, your comparison with F2P is off too. My experience of F2P is that you can't get very far into the game before you are pushed an advert. In fact, most F2P's push adverts every few minutes.
How many times have you seen an advert for a paintjob in-game? A paintjob that you will almost *never* see, by the way.
If I understand your example, you're saying that $5 for a single paintjob is fine, but $7 for 6 paintjobs is a ripoff.
Have I got that right? If so, you might just want to check your maths.
Also, your comparison with F2P is off too. My experience of F2P is that you can't get very far into the game before you are pushed an advert. In fact, most F2P's push adverts every few minutes.
How many times have you seen an advert for a paintjob in-game? A paintjob that you will almost *never* see, by the way.
And you want to call a different color a paintjob worth $5 lmao... What is in place is a joke and a rip off, especially for a game that revolves entirely around the vehicles.
Edit: Also, the worst part is now they are limited in what they can offer. Note that the 6 different colors isn't even a palette swap, there are 2 primary colors and only one of them changes, so you will never be able to change the black portion to silver or red for a wider variety of combinations and colors, can't do a red on green, will never have an orange on white unless they are sold individually. FD locked themselves in a corner because now they can't suddenly allow a more detailed and in depth customization as part of the game because of what they are already charging for.
And you want to call a different color a paintjob worth $5 lmao... What is in place is a joke and a rip off, especially for a game that revolves entirely around the vehicles.
Edit: Also, the worst part is now they are limited in what they can offer. Note that the 6 different colors isn't even a palette swap, there are 2 primary colors and only one of them changes, so you will never be able to change the black portion to silver or red for a wider variety of combinations and colors, can't do a red on green, will never have an orange on white unless they are sold individually. FD locked themselves in a corner because now they can't suddenly allow a more detailed and in depth customization as part of the game because of what they are already charging for.
I think you've misunderstood the purpose of the Frontier Store.
The optional cosmetics are sold to help fund continued development of the game, as well as maintain their existing servers. So, by buying them, you are funding the addition of new features and new packages over the next 5-10 years, and the ongoing upkeep of the game. If they were to included them in-game, then they would lose that funding source.
You could argue that special paintjobs should be enough, but even then they would have to fund graphic designers to come up with the designs in the first place, making the return on investment too low to be a viable source of income.
Those games in your examples were finished products at the point the game was released. There maybe sequels to them in future, but there is no ongoing active development of those titles, except for the odd patch here and there. Nor do they have ongoing servers to maintain (at least, not on the scale of Frontier's Elite servers). They were also developed by much larger development teams, with more resources than Frontier has got available for Elite.
Maybe when Elite has completed development (5-10 years from now), certain cosmetic features will be available in-game by default, but they would still need a source of revenue to maintain their servers.
The alternative is for them to charge you a mandatory monthly subscription.
So, what would you prefer? A mandatory monthly subscription (which sounds unaffordable if you're complaining about $7 paintjobs), or an optional series of cosmetic enhancements that you are not *required* to buy?
I think you've misunderstood the purpose of the Frontier Store.
The optional cosmetics are sold to help fund continued development of the game, as well as maintain their existing servers. So, by buying them, you are funding the addition of new features and new packages over the next 5-10 years, and the ongoing upkeep of the game. If they were to included them in-game, then they would lose that funding source.
You could argue that special paintjobs should be enough, but even then they would have to fund graphic designers to come up with the designs in the first place, making the return on investment too low to be a viable source of income.
Those games in your examples were finished products at the point the game was released. There maybe sequels to them in future, but there is no ongoing active development of those titles, except for the odd patch here and there. Nor do they have ongoing servers to maintain (at least, not on the scale of Frontier's Elite servers). They were also developed by much larger development teams, with more resources than Frontier has got available for Elite.
Maybe when Elite has completed development (5-10 years from now), certain cosmetic features will be available in-game by default, but they would still need a source of revenue to maintain their servers.
The alternative is for them to charge you a mandatory monthly subscription.
So, what would you prefer? A mandatory monthly subscription (which sounds unaffordable if you're complaining about $7 paintjobs), or an optional series of cosmetic enhancements that you are not *required* to buy?
Right, because FD is a charity.... Its a store selling merchandise, not a donation button. Also, I said it before and I'll say it again, the problem isn't that they are selling cosmetics.
As for the no sequel thing, if FD hadn't sold horizons as an expansion you could claim that, but as it stands that's . Also, FD is claiming the game is a finished product, and while I'd agree that is it also means you can't make the excuse that "Those games in your examples were finished products", because E : D was declared a finished product.
Edit: Also FFXV has a laundry list of content that couldn't be done in time for launch but is still planned to be released as part of the base game including custom characters, the ability to switch out party members, and making the last leg of the story non-linear.
As for subscriptions, I played Eve for several years with 2 accounts, although I believe the biggest problem with the subscription model is that games tried to stick to $15 a month instead of trying to make the pricing more competitive, like say $7/mo. I also lost all respect for Eve when they introduced a cash shop on top of account activation fees, on top of subscriptions. Also, plenty of MMO's have done buy once play forever. I'd take a subscription over a cash shop any day, but I won't do both. If E : D had a subscription model, I would probably leave it cancelled most of the time because too little content spread too thin and way too much grind. Pretty sure if you did the numbers you would find most people play in spurts, get into the game and then remember why they quit.
Ultimately there is no way to put a more in depth customization aspect to the ships in the game without causing a huge mess, largely because people bought products instead of making donations and suddenly having what people paid for become free never ends well. If they had kept it to good quality items to sell, paint jobs that were more than just a solid color, that wouldn't be a problem.
Also, theres another place I hear this "your not buying a product you're funding the games development", its all over that scam Star Citizen because people buying mid-end game ships for $100-1000 is totally done just to support development and no one buying them is doing it for the product. It's a lie fanboys tell themselves to justify egregious business practices in a desperation genre. Not saying FD is as bad as SC, only that the reasoning of its defense is the same.
Right, because FD is a charity.... Its a store selling merchandise, not a donation button. Also, I said it before and I'll say it again, the problem isn't that they are selling cosmetics.
As for the no sequel thing, if FD hadn't sold horizons as an expansion you could claim that, but as it stands that's . Also, FD is claiming the game is a finished product, and while I'd agree that is it also means you can't make the excuse that "Those games in your examples were finished products", because E : D was declared a finished product.
As for subscriptions, I played Eve for several years with 2 accounts, although I believe the biggest problem with the subscription model is that games tried to stick to $15 a month instead of trying to make the pricing more competitive, like say $7/mo. I also lost all respect for Eve when they introduced a cash shop on top of account activation fees, on top of subscriptions. Also, plenty of MMO's have done buy once play forever. I'd take a subscription over a cash shop any day, but I won't do both. If E : D had a subscription model, I would probably leave it cancelled most of the time because too little content spread too thin and way too much grind. Pretty sure if you did the numbers you would find most people play in spurts, get into the game and then remember why they quit.
Ultimately there is no way to put a more in depth customization aspect to the ships in the game without causing a huge mess, largely because people bought products instead of making donations and suddenly having what people paid for become free never ends well. If they had kept it to good quality items to sell, paint jobs that were more than just a solid color, that wouldn't be a problem.
Also, theres another place I hear this "your not buying a product you're funding the games development", its all over that scam Star Citizen because people buying mid-end game ships for $100-1000 is totally done just to support development and no one buying them is doing it for the product. It's a lie fanboys tell themselves to justify egregious business practices in a desperation genre. Not saying FD is as bad as SC, only that the reasoning of its defense is the same.
Nobody's forcing you to buy them. You have a fully playable game right now. You don't need them. They are optional. They are not required. They will not enhance or otherwise alter your ability to play the game. They will make not make you a better pilot.
If you think they're too expensive, vote with your wallet and don't buy them. You will still be able to play the game.
If your enjoyment of the game is so dependent on these colours, if they are so valuable to you, then pay for them. Otherwise, stop complaining.
If your whole argument basically boils down to "I think they're overpriced", then here's my counter-argument: "I think they're priced just right".
Nobody's forcing you to buy them. You have a fully playable game right now. You don't need them. They are optional. They are not required. They will not enhance or otherwise alter your ability to play the game. They will make not make you a better pilot.
If you think they're too expensive, vote with your wallet and don't buy them. You will still be able to play the game.
If your enjoyment of the game is so dependent on these colours, if they are so valuable to you, then pay for them. Otherwise, stop complaining.
If your whole argument basically boils down to "I think they're overpriced", then here's my counter-argument: "I think they're priced just right".
1: I don't buy them
Edit: There are things in the store I might have bought if it wasn't for how the store is being done.
2: My playing the game doesn't depend on them
3: You missed the entire point of the criticism.
The underlying issue is of trust. What is currently in place, I tolerate, but I disapprove and will not encourage it. It greatly lowers my opinion of the devs character and it causes considerable worry for the future. The lack of trust leaves me worrying that future updates to the game will be sold piecemeal like horizons further splitting up the game. It worries me that when we have the ability to create characters they will charge us for hair styles and hair dye, that we will all have the same outfit in the same color and if we want a different color, well that's extra. I'm not saying they will do that, I'm saying I don't trust them not to. It's about trust. Making money is important, but so is honorable business. I don't begrudge the devs wanting to make profit, but I don't find this practice kosher, especially when the game is supposedly fully funded. No one wants to do business with someone they don't trust, who over-reaches out of greed.
Edit: I don't think solid colors are overpriced, I'm saying they shouldn't have been micro-transactions in the first place, price is a separate issue. I'm saying a simple change of color should be in the base game on a $60 game.
Ok, imagine you go to a pizza joint and you order extra toppings for your pizza and a drink, it's no surprise that buying a drink or additional toppings is extra, and maybe the price is a bit steep but it's a damn good pizza. However, when they start charging you extra for the ice in your drink and the napkins it becomes an issue.
1€ per paintjob it's hard, 10€ for ship kits...
