Elite Minecraft

[Knuttin Atoll]

Sometimes an image says more than a thousand words:

(2nd image without super-sampling, but otherwise same Ultra settings)

So this is what the 'premium', sought-after Chrome/Gold skins look like outside curated store images. Thankfully I "only" spent 7k of 'free' Arx on this Chrome skin for my Cobra 3, as opposed to saving up another 1,600 or so to get it for my Cobra 5 (not discounted during the current sale so still sitting at still 10k Arx, because of course it's not part of the sale).

Even considered topping up my balance by buying the 5k Arx pack to avoid 'waiting' for another 4-5 weeks to get it for free.

Frontier, do you seriously believe this kind of quality justifies a price tag of seven Euros in real money (2x 5,000 Arx)? Rhetorical question obviously, and huge buyer's remorse bullet dodged thankfully.



PS - specs for those who care: i7 14700F / RTX4070S 12GB / 32GB RAM

 

[Vardaugas]

You are looking at a decal and not the ship paint. That decal is 70 Arx right now.

 

[Knuttin Atoll]

You are looking at a decal and not the ship paint. That decal is 70 Arx right now.

May I re-direct your focus towards the centre of the image, i.e. the reflection resolution of the skin. The general texture resolution of decals etc. is old news but as you say at least they're cheap.

 

[Vardaugas]

May I re-direct your focus towards the centre of the image, i.e. the reflection resolution of the skin. The general texture resolution of decals etc. is old news but as you say at least they're cheap.

I am pretty sure the reflection resolution is not defined by the skin. Reflectivity maps are generated separately. There may be a quality setting for them in the graphics settings.

 

[Stealthie]

May I re-direct your focus towards the centre of the image, i.e. the reflection resolution of the skin. The general texture resolution of decals etc. is old news but as you say at least they're cheap.

I think what you're looking at might be a "you" problem rather than an "ED" problem.

I've noticed that, after starting the game, if I send my Chrome iCourier up on the lift I get a spectacularly clear reflection of the station in it's hull.
If I play for a couple of hours, land at another station and stop to admire my shiny ship, the quality of the reflection might have degraded.

My assumption (because I don't really care enough to investigate further) is that video RAM has filled with stuff and, as a result, my card doesn't have sufficient remaining resources to fully render the reflection.

I have no idea if NVidia is to blame for this or whether it's an issue with ED's code but I know it's not an issue unique to ED so my guess would be it's some kind of "memory hole" issue with the gfx card.

 

[Knuttin Atoll]

I knew my settings would be questioned, thought of including them but assumed this wasn't necessary... anyways, I'm running the game with maxed out Ultra settings, at 1440p, with 1.5x super sampling.

That it's an issue with the game engine, yeah I would say so. The question is whether it's acceptable to sell Chrome (i.e. reflective) skins at that kind of price point and then be greeted with the image quality in the OP.

And fwiw, I play Cyberpunk 2077 with settings maxed there too, and ray-traced reflections look amazing in that game (not to say that I'm expecting RT in Elite, that'd be silly, but you get kind of spoiled in other games, at no extra cost even).

 

[Dillon Fallon]

First question I'd ask is how it looks without the super sampling.

 

[Knuttin Atoll]

First question I'd ask is how it looks without the super sampling.

Intriguing question, with predictable results. Updated the OP with a second image - not the same location and scenario, but comparable (sun is further away), but it ain't exactly prettier.

 

[sinkarma]

as someone that does a lot of rendering and 3d modelling...
MIRRORS ARE BAD M'KAY!
reflective surfaces are incredibly bad for processing power. Tis why shiny mirror like chrome paintjobs in various games will use simple reflection systems to imitate a feeling and make it look good.
Elite Dangerous's lighting system needs a big rework (not upgrade, rework, its good but it needs its bugs and quirks worked out).

But even a half baked and crappy reflection on a chrome paintjob still looks... just... SO GOOD!
tis why I 3d modelled a owl woman with metal claws and beak, with shiny metal finish, cause it looks COOOOL! Despite any render I make now taking 10mins instead of 30seconds.
I desperately wish I had the cash to splurge on several crome and cromeD skins in elite dangerous...

sorry rambling now.
final word: "Dats some A grade minecraft shaders there if its Elite:Minecraft!"

 

[Knuttin Atoll]

I just want to follow up on my CP2077 comparison above because I can already see the usual defensive bite reflex responses being drafted... I'm not expecting CP2077 quality in Elite, low(ish) res reflections are normal in most games. It was also to clarify that it's not a "me" i.e. hardware or settings issue. But the extremely low resolution along with the weird artifacts (it's worse when moving the camera) are incredibly disappointing, if not completely unexpected in this game, particularly at the price tag they sell at.

This is the problem when you introduce on-foot gameplay to your previously ship-flying-only game. It's now possible to inspect everything at a much closer distance, as part of regular gameplay as opposed to zooming in with the 3rd person camera suite. And in this particular case it's distracting, rather than offering visual pleasure.

I'll leave this thread here as a 'buyers beware' post (if it survives that is) as I struggled to find any 'review' images or videos for these skins given how popular they were and are, to make an informed purchase decision if nothing else.

 

[sinkarma]

This is the problem when you introduce on-foot gameplay to your previously ship-flying-only game. It's now possible to inspect everything at a much closer distance, as part of regular gameplay as opposed to zooming in with the 3rd person camera suite. And in this particular case it's distracting, rather than offering visual pleasure.

This. TBH.

I'll leave this thread here as a 'buyers beware' post (if it survives that is) as I struggled to find any 'review' images or videos for these skins given how popular they were and are, to make an informed purchase decision if nothing else.

This too. TBH.

the elite dangerous store really needs to have a preview "floor" that isn't just space station or arx shop void.
an extra one that loads an on surface spot.

I'd ask you to get some recording software and just with no commentary do a walk around your crome cobra on surface with a title "crome corba showcase" or something.
Then people who search can maybe stumble on it and then decide if they still want the crome paint or not.
But maybe your still dissapointed about the purchase.

 

[sinkarma]

oh! what if we started a thread?! "ship paintjob previews!" and leave it open for anyone to post videos of any skins they got stepping round the ship. No commentary. No fancy effects. just a list of PC specs and current graphics settings and looking at the paintjobs. I don't have much "crome" paints but I could help with some other paintjobs.

 

[Walter2]

I think what you're looking at might be a "you" problem rather than an "ED" problem.

I've noticed that, after starting the game, if I send my Chrome iCourier up on the lift I get a spectacularly clear reflection of the station in it's hull.
If I play for a couple of hours, land at another station and stop to admire my shiny ship, the quality of the reflection might have degraded.

My assumption (because I don't really care enough to investigate further) is that video RAM has filled with stuff and, as a result, my card doesn't have sufficient remaining resources to fully render the reflection.

I have no idea if NVidia is to blame for this or whether it's an issue with ED's code but I know it's not an issue unique to ED so my guess would be it's some kind of "memory hole" issue with the gfx card.

All paint jobs degrade over time (space is so abrasive) and are usually restored with a full ship repair. Try a before-and-after comparison.

 

[Therinfluffs]

as someone that does a lot of rendering and 3d modelling...
MIRRORS ARE BAD M'KAY!
reflective surfaces are incredibly bad for processing power. Tis why shiny mirror like chrome paintjobs in various games will use simple reflection systems to imitate a feeling and make it look good.
Elite Dangerous's lighting system needs a big rework (not upgrade, rework, its good but it needs its bugs and quirks worked out).

But even a half baked and crappy reflection on a chrome paintjob still looks... just... SO GOOD!
tis why I 3d modelled a owl woman with metal claws and beak, with shiny metal finish, cause it looks COOOOL! Despite any render I make now taking 10mins instead of 30seconds.
I desperately wish I had the cash to splurge on several crome and cromeD skins in elite dangerous...

sorry rambling now.
final word: "Dats some A grade minecraft shaders there if its Elite:Minecraft!"

It really feels like they could of achieved better by faking the reflections with some clever use of anisotropics if they wanted to save on machine resources imho. This just looks like bad anisotropics.

 

[aRJay]

This. TBH.


This too. TBH.

the elite dangerous store really needs to have a preview "floor" that isn't just space station or arx shop void.
an extra one that loads an on surface spot.

…

There are so many different colours and intensities of light in ED that I am not sure that a simple surface spot would help that much especially for chrome and gold with so little to reflect.

 

[Stealthie]

All paint jobs degrade over time (space is so abrasive) and are usually restored with a full ship repair. Try a before-and-after comparison.

That's only true if you're flying the ship.
I first noticed this with my chrome iEagle (which I just enjoy looking at) so, for my completely un-scientific and anecdotal test, I looked at my iCourier right after starting playing, went and did some mining in my T10 then had another look at the iCourier after I got back.

Pretty sure either ED or the gfx card is reducing texture quality for some reason, which I'd speculate is something to do with graphic memory usage.
I have a 3080ti card and it's not like the textures are ever terrible so it's not something I really worry about too much.

 

[Dillon Fallon]

Intriguing question, with predictable results. Updated the OP with a second image - not the same location and scenario, but comparable (sun is further away), but it ain't exactly prettier.

Just thought it was worth checking since by nature it messes with the graphics. Suppose its not ideal, but there's probably only so much you can polish in this 10 year old game.

MIRRORS ARE BAD M'KAY!

Suppose it's worth remembering something Cyberpunk did. No rear view mirrors in cars and bathroom mirrors are all electronic, so you had to select them to see a reflection.

 

[Stealthie]

the elite dangerous store really needs to have a preview "floor" that isn't just space station or arx shop void.
an extra one that loads an on surface spot.

Definitely, this.

When we're paying cash-money for stuff it shouldn't be too much to ask that we can get a proper preview of what we're buying.

The lighting in the hangar (where you can modify a ship's livery) absolutely sucks.
Most chrome paintjobs, for example, simply look black.
And then you press the "preview" button and all it does is remove the menu panel.

Surely it wouldn't be too much to ask to put your ship in a virtual space, with all the livery options at the side (as they currently are), let you apply ship-kit parts and paint and then view your ship using the camera suite controls and adjust the lighting before you decide whether or not to buy stuff?

When it comes to big ships, you often can't even see ship-kit parts attached to the ship in the hangar.
You have to just buy the kit sight-unseen, apply parts and then send the ship up on the lift so you can finally see what it looks like.
... after you've spent the money.

 

[Knuttin Atoll]

Definitely, this.

When we're paying cash-money for stuff it shouldn't be too much to ask that we can get a proper preview of what we're buying.

The lighting in the hangar (where you can modify a ship's livery) absolutely sucks.
Most chrome paintjobs, for example, simply look black.
And then you press the "preview" button and all it does is remove the menu panel.

Surely it wouldn't be too much to ask to put your ship in a virtual space, with all the livery options at the side (as they currently are), let you apply ship-kit parts and paint and then view your ship using the camera suite controls and adjust the lighting before you decide whether or not to buy stuff?

When it comes to big ships, you often can't even see ship-kit parts attached to the ship in the hangar.
You have to just buy the kit sight-unseen, apply parts and then send the ship up on the lift so you can finally see what it looks like.
... after you've spent the money.

It's all very frustrating alright.

Just to give one example that most people probably never notice - when you apply the Chromed (i.e. not Chrome) skin to the Phantom, and then also apply the ship kit, you will notice a 'material' difference between the kit parts and the body. The body has the expected brushed metal texture, but the kit is more akin to the Chrome skin (very reflective indeed, albeit with the same super-low reflection texture). This also applies to other paints (and other kits/ships but not all of them) and looks really bad and inconsistent.

Again, if it was all part of the base game I could excuse it to some extent (even though a visual artist who takes pride in their work would not let this escape into the live game and sit there for literal years - it's been a problem since the 4.0 client released)... but the combined cost of kit plus paint(s) is significant. Seems like nobody else - developer nor customers - seem to notice or care though so here we are.

 

[Knuttin Atoll]

Just thought it was worth checking since by nature it messes with the graphics. Suppose its not ideal, but there's probably only so much you can polish in this 10 year old game.

I thought it was a fair request, and had me intrigued. I could also accept the age of the game as an excuse, but only if the prices involved took that into account also.

Suppose it's worth remembering something Cyberpunk did. No rear view mirrors in cars and bathroom mirrors are all electronic, so you had to select them to see a reflection.

It does alright - more elegant than just shove a 160p resolution mirror image in my face when I run the game at 1440p. On the other hand, reflective surfaces like puddles on the ground, or car windows (in 3rd person view) are breathtaking and look like literal mirror images. Nothing that I would expect in Elite though as I said earlier.