Eve Online rant

I put about 400hrs into Eve starting last month. Probably half of that sitting in a station. I completed the career missions and sisters of eve arc. Joined a poopy player corp, left them for a scammy player corp. The best thing I can say about this game is I provided content for some PvP interaction in which I was owned every time.

Eve is a mile deep and 10 miles wide. The learning curve never ends. It feels like a pay to play scheme with plex and monthly sub. I already paid more real money than I care to admit. Its hard to compare ED to Eve, uhhh.. they're both space games?

Does anyone around here like Eve? Tell me what I'm missing.
 
Former Eve vet here. Played six years and thousands of hours. I quit during the jira riots when the monocle and ridiculously priced vanity items dropped and the CSM misrepresented the player riots to CCP resulting in their version of space legs being canceled indefinitely.

The big difference between Eve and Elite comes from the fact that Eve by policy has never allowed name changes, has always been a single shard server with no instancing and the CCP does not interfere with player interactions. So what you do in the game has two kinds of consequences, social and mechanical. You are free to do whatever you want within the game rules without fear of bans etc.

The above combined with a real player driven economy means reputation matters in EVE and social engineering is part of the gameplay loop.

The truth about Eve is you need friends you can trust or an analytical mind and willingness to delegate and trust and run a group. If you are going to get the most of Eve it’s going to be in a group. Unfortunately though the advent of skill injectors in Eve makes the social engineering process easier making newer players automatically more suspect than they were when I played and Eve isn’t exactly friendly to new players.

the funny thing I remember about starting to play elite was how much harsher the elite galaxy is. Unlike Eve where they have concord that literally guarantees you are going to lose your ship for ganking, elites police are just as ineffective as the rest of the npc’s in the game. I always found it hilarious when original backers back then shot down any suggestions Eve inspired because they didn’t want ganking. Lol
 
As a noob, I can see I've been very unlucky in finding players I can trust and are willing to hold my hand until things start to click. Everyone says, the big ISK is in null space, i.e. mining or ratting. I'm just messing around wasting time in hisec compared to the riches just waiting to be harvested in null. So I go to null, this is null space supposedly owned and guarded by my corp. Oh well, you can imagine how that went. In Elite I know how to build a ship and escape from any ganker attempt, knowing full well the cops are a joke. I suspect its possible to build a ratting ship that is also capable of dealing competently with PvP surprises, but that's probably months down the road for me.
 
As a noob, I can see I've been very unlucky in finding players I can trust and are willing to hold my hand until things start to click. Everyone says, the big ISK is in null space, i.e. mining or ratting. I'm just messing around wasting time in hisec compared to the riches just waiting to be harvested in null. So I go to null, this is null space supposedly owned and guarded by my corp. Oh well, you can imagine how that went. In Elite I know how to build a ship and escape from any ganker attempt, knowing full well the cops are a joke. I suspect its possible to build a ratting ship that is also capable of dealing competently with PvP surprises, but that's probably months down the road for me.
Yeah, you are either going to sink a ton of real cash into skill injectors or just slowly train skills up over time.Either way it doesn't feel rewarding.

For me (and I have no idea if this is still the case) but Null Sec was out as a solo player due to always instantly showing up in the local chat list of players. Once wormhole space was introduced with delayed local so you didn't show up in it unless you spoke and people didn't see you unless they were in the system and online when you did speak. This instant free intel basically screws solo players because without having to monitor the gates and wormholes a single person can monitor an entire star system and call in a hunting party the moment they notice some random solo.

In my entire six years I spent an entire month in nullsec, as a miner. Instant local chat here was also a frustration because it meant that enemies could just camp AFK and had a banner on the whole time that they were there. So many mining ops got canceled because one random unknown cloaky was just sitting somewhere in system and everyone was too scared of a cyno'd in gank fleet to do anytthing. Pure silliness.

I was fortunate in that instance not to get into a scamming corp, but it was a terrible corp all the same and part of a meh alliance. Yes they had territory but it was a meh experience over all and wasn't helped by the fact that while cool, the mechanics of the game create political landscapes, territorial control and it results in actual political structures rising within the player base and along with it player rulers in the form of dictators and such. Amazing game mechanic but the games mechanical discouragement of solo play in these regions of space really killed it for me.

I actually spent the majority of my time in EVE doing high sec mining for... funsies? I'm not even sure what I got out of that... and being part of a high sec war-dec corp of ~10 members who would dec larger groups and engage them in guerilla warfare in high security space (AKA lawfully ganking miners, mission runners etc) until our CEO ransomed the corp/alliance to get us to stop and split the ransom between the crew. This typically involved a spy placed in the target organization. Most fights were decided by outfitting before the battle even occurred and our size and lack of open recruitment and real life connections to each other meant we were spy-proof. As such every major battle we ever went into included full intel on what everyone would be equipped with. We'd use it to determine our tactics to great success.

The fact of the matter is EVE Online is less about spaceships and more about the complex interactions between people and organizations that can only be offered by the zero-instancing, single shard nature of EVE. Without that, EVE isn't a very compelling game outside of PVP, imo.

My greatest wish for Elite has always been to have that single shard, no instancing approach in open play combined with separate saves. One for open, one for pg/solo. Combined with an inability to change ones commander name Elite would instantly become a towering leader over all space games.

Since I'm on the topic, my biggest complaint about Elite has always been that gankers do not need to suffer the consequences of their actions. Not by mechanical design and not by player reaction. Why? Because most of them just log into solo/pg when they do their grind and only show their faces in open when they are ready for pvp. As an open play purist I've always found that to be extremely discouraging and constantly see it push people into solo/pg because people don't want to get jacked with if the attacker can't be retaliated against and to be frank, if you are half decent in Elite; you are not going to die unless you make a really stupid mistake or are flying something poorly equipped, neither of which really happen often in the case of pvp'ers. The problem was excaberated when bounties were detached from the player and assigned to the ships in order to give criminals the ability to "play the game normally" when not committing crime.
 
Awesome response! I appreciate your insights. I'm considering the option to just give up on Eve now since I'm not a good team player and Eve really looks more and more like a money/time pit that will not be worth it.
 
I played EVE from day one way back in the mists of time until about 6 years ago. During that time I played just about every role possible. Miner, pirate, industrialist, explorer and much more. I loved almost every minute of it.
The Learning curve in EVE is brutal, incredibly deep and very broad. Some people really appreciate that others less so.

The best tip I ever gave anyone playing is to keep hopping corps until you find one that suits the player you are, nothing is holding people into staying with a corp that's a bad fit. I'd always suggest something smaller to start with, the massive mega corps are great with the intrigue and resources but very overwhelming to newer players.
 
Awesome response! I appreciate your insights. I'm considering the option to just give up on Eve now since I'm not a good team player and Eve really looks more and more like a money/time pit that will not be worth it.
If you like the concept of Eve but not the social aspect, you might like X4. I'm loving it.

Regarding Eve, is it true that it's all 3rd person view only? As in, no cockpit view or actual "flying" of your ship? One of the reasons I like X4 so much is that I can fly my ships just like in Elite (including FA-off).
 
I played from the start, and then gave up about 12 years later. It was still an exclusively subscription service then.

@Arsen Cross is right - social engineering is the key. If you want to get anywhere, you need to talk the talk as well as walk the walk (which as a new player, you have absolutely zero chance of doing btw, due to the way skills work). When I subscribed, I was looking for an online version of Elite, and this was the nearest thing. Elite is a solo game, so the mistake I made with it was I kinda tried to play EVE solo. And that's not the way to play if you want to have any fun... it's multiplayer to the corps (pun intended). CCP put active roadblocks in your way once you get past a certain point.

Some folks take it very seriously. I wasn't ready for that (still not), so I quit. 🤷‍♀️
 
Aye Juniper the reason you got into Eve is more or less same as mine.

It's a fantastic game, there are so many facets to it and how brilliantly they've developed and maintained what they have made is a tribute I'd give to a very small list indeed.

I remember all the major milestones like they were yesterday, the brutal losses, the shame of being trounced out of our null space home for the first time...then the feeling of taking it back. The intrigue, the politics, the battles.

Just an amazing game.

The best time I had though was when I got into moon mining and exploring properly towards the end of my time in the game. Had a really strong group of corps that carved out a little niche in null space with a much larger alliance.

It's really not everyone's cup of tea but it at least demands that people try it and give it a good go, like you say....its not a solo game. It is best enjoyed working together with lots of people.
 
I agree with Krash on his thoughts about Elite here also. If they had followed a similar over arching theme as how EVE is modelled it would probably have pulled a huge amount of players from that game. I get it though it wouldnt have been "Elite" then in its core I guess.

But still it's a thing I feel maybe Frontier could look at with a different space game. Or any other developer really, I dont think Star Citizen is ever going to hit that spot either in its posterior about face development process.
 
I put about 400hrs into Eve starting last month. Probably half of that sitting in a station. I completed the career missions and sisters of eve arc. Joined a poopy player corp, left them for a scammy player corp. The best thing I can say about this game is I provided content for some PvP interaction in which I was owned every time.

Eve is a mile deep and 10 miles wide. The learning curve never ends. It feels like a pay to play scheme with plex and monthly sub. I already paid more real money than I care to admit. Its hard to compare ED to Eve, uhhh.. they're both space games?

Does anyone around here like Eve? Tell me what I'm missing.
I played Eve-online for about 3 years, I had 3 accounts, as at the time it was the only way to fast track the various roles I wanted to fulfill. Fought in the alcohol wars as cannon fodder https://www.eveonline.com/news/view...nglomerate-weathers-mercenary-coalition-storm. In the end IAC lost their player build station and were all but destroyed. After that I retired to High sec to lick my wounds (I had a lot of stuff trapped at that station I was no longer welcome at including my clone), generate some cash to replace ships by mining etc and decide what to do next. In the end I spent the next few years being a PVE player in a PvP game.

I am not sure what the current state of the game is but at that time it was possible to make some good money by doing PVE missions for the factions and if you were careful about your rotation with agents you could keep good standing with all 4 factions. At this stage I was multi boxing heavily, running two to three accounts at the same time in these missions. It take a while to work your way up to the top level missions but is well worth it as the payout are very good. The missions however are repetitive and some should even not be attempted unless you had tier 2 ships. When I stopped playing I had over a billion credits in cash spread between the 3 accounts, ships of all sort spread over the galaxy.

I am not sure if this is still possible but at the time it was the main way to make good money to replace your losses especially if you were currently excluded from null space where all the high paying minerals are located. Many players had alt account engaged in this activity.

Eve-online is a much deeper game that Elite Dangerous as far a player agency goes in my opinion. You have genuine market forces at work in the trading system both at the local system and global system level. Mineral prices vary by location, you can make money by hauling to major trade hubs like Jita and you can loose your shirt as well. Finacial manipulation is possible and does occur. It is possible to manufacture items, trade in research points, make and trade blue prints. I used to make good money out of salvage from the ships destroyed in the PVE missions as they are a crafting component.

PS possible eve careers - https://wiki.eveuniversity.org/EVE_Careers_101
 
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If you like the concept of Eve but not the social aspect, you might like X4. I'm loving it.

Regarding Eve, is it true that it's all 3rd person view only? As in, no cockpit view or actual "flying" of your ship? One of the reasons I like X4 so much is that I can fly my ships just like in Elite (including FA-off).
No man's sky is more of a spaceship flying game than Eve. There are no flight controls in Eve ships. There's a cockpit view but its kind of useless, better off in 3rd person AFAIK. Ship scale is hard to grasp and the impression I get when flying around is that these ships are like toy models that could fit in the palm of my hand. Thanks for the X4 suggestion, I'll take a look.
 
No man's sky is more of a spaceship flying game than Eve. There are no flight controls in Eve ships. There's a cockpit view but its kind of useless, better off in 3rd person AFAIK. Ship scale is hard to grasp and the impression I get when flying around is that these ships are like toy models that could fit in the palm of my hand. Thanks for the X4 suggestion, I'll take a look.

NMS is a great game, but one thing it isn't is a "spaceship flying game". That's not where it shines - which is the planetary side, and where most of your time is spent. The in-space stuff in NMS is little more than a loading screen to get to the next bit of gameplay.

X4 is pure (1st person) space flight & fleet management (in a similar style to EVE).
 
NMS is a great game, but one thing it isn't is a "spaceship flying game". That's not where it shines - which is the planetary side, and where most of your time is spent. The in-space stuff in NMS is little more than a loading screen to get to the next bit of gameplay.

X4 is pure (1st person) space flight & fleet management (in a similar style to EVE).
My point is you get more of a sense of flying your ship in NMS compared to Eve ships. Thrust / pitch control, turning / boosting; cockpit view of the flight controls. Eve is just point and click. Its not about piloting ships in Eve.
 
My point is you get more of a sense of flying your ship in NMS compared to Eve ships. Thrust / pitch control, turning / boosting; cockpit view of the flight controls. Eve is just point and click. Its not about piloting ships in Eve.
Flying a ship from cockpit view is what I'm doing 95% of the time I'm playing X4. Granted, I'm not trying to build an empire (though I do have a proper fleet now), and for those who prefer to play the game top-down like Stellaris, it definitely allows for that, albeit a bit clunky.

I think going to X4 fresh, not having previous X Universe experience, may actually have worked in my favor. I was never able to get into X3, but X4 sucked me right in. In some ways it is a better Elite than Elite is!
 
My point is you get more of a sense of flying your ship in NMS compared to Eve ships. Thrust / pitch control, turning / boosting; cockpit view of the flight controls. Eve is just point and click. Its not about piloting ships in Eve.

EVE isn't a spaceship flying game - period. It was designed and released at a time when those who were lucky enough to have internet access did so over a dialup 9600 baud modem. Any 1st person "twitch" type gameplay wouldn't have worked back then, and they've just never changed it.

There's a 1st person spaceship shooter they released for VR called EVE: Valkyrie, but I've never played it.
 
Think Valkyrie bombed somewhat and they stopped supporting it in short order.
Havent heard anything about it in years as to ongoing development.
 
Think Valkyrie bombed somewhat and they stopped supporting it in short order.
Havent heard anything about it in years as to ongoing development.

Yep, I heard that too.

Just checked my VR library, and I actually own it. o_O Must have bought it years ago and forgotten. Never played it.
 
Flying a ship from cockpit view is what I'm doing 95% of the time I'm playing X4. Granted, I'm not trying to build an empire (though I do have a proper fleet now), and for those who prefer to play the game top-down like Stellaris, it definitely allows for that, albeit a bit clunky.

I think going to X4 fresh, not having previous X Universe experience, may actually have worked in my favor. I was never able to get into X3, but X4 sucked me right in. In some ways it is a better Elite than Elite is!
Sometimes I let my pilot fly while I just look out the window or look from the docking bay at the scenery.
 
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