Exploration - how would YOU fix it?

You are the product managed for ED: 2.5 (or 3.0, whatever). The name of the update is (just for the purposes of this thread): The Explorers.

How are you going to 'fix' exploration, to make it fun and exciting and interesting and deep ?

My limited ideas:

  • Fix the 'beige-ification'. This is goddam priority #1. I want worlds that look as close to visually indistinguishable from the real world as possible. Yes, even the airless worlds can be made more exciting.
  • Unify the shaders for landfall and non-landfall worlds. Backwards compatibility be damned. You sometimes see really cool looking worlds, but they are cool because they are not landfall planets (they have atmospheres). Make these planets land-able
  • Extend the range of landfall planets as much as practical. Worlds with atmospheres, water worlds, non-life bearing worlds, lava worlds. As much as can be done.
  • Completely re-write the shaders for gas giants. They are far too repetitive and unrealistic at the moment. I want Jupiters, Saturns, Uranuses
  • While you're at it, rewrite the ring shaders too. The are too solid-looking at the moment.
  • Hell, while you're at it, work on the star shaders too - stop the textures jumping, make them look better at close range. Slow down the comically fast surface animation...etc.
  • Oh - please also fix the really bad texture smearing you see when orbiting close to a non-landfall planet. That's been a bug for the longest time.


Whoa - thats' mostly just graphical fixes....

  • Add game mechanics to allow close surface scans to be worthwhile. Revisit the broken POI system that forces you to fly > 2km
  • Add surface sampling missions.
  • Add survey drones (space and surface).
  • Add point of interest geography - huge mountains, valleys, etc, for us to discover.
  • Add surface waypoints, and proper surface navigation.
  • Add space and surface base creation
  • Add more kinds of SRV, and pivotable skimmers.
  • Add sub-surface geology - ie. caves, lava tubes, sinkholes, pits.
  • Beef up active surface geology.
  • Fix dark-side lighting to make it actually dark. Add game elements to mitigate this (night vision, surface lighting.


There's loads more - what would you do?

(oops - messed up the thread title, but you get the idea)
 
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One idea I'd like to see explored (drum roll) is tangential to exploration but something that would encourage more people to give it a go: The ability to easily swap between your ships.

The main thing that discourages long-range exploration for me is that once you are far from the bubble your game options severely decrease. You can't take part in CGs, see new Thargoid content, you can't bounty hunt or trade. You basically have to sacrifice everything to exploration - which may be cool with hardcore explorers, but for people who enjoy a variety of stuff it makes it way less appealing, especially as it can take literally dozens of (rather tedious) hours to get back to civilisation.

So I'd like to be able to - at login - choose which of my ships in my fleet I start from. If I have two ships - say a Vulture near Sol or an Asp Explorer near Colonia - then I can choose which one to start in. That way I can dedicate one ship to exploration but still participate in all the other aspects of the game by swapping to my Vulture. It would probably need the game slightly changing so that exploration data (maybe materials?) is locked to the ship that discovers it, but I don't see any issue with that.
 
I'm going to go a different way from the regular gfx improvements and say that Exploration needs to be meaningful in the game of Elite.

Right now, exploration is purely for individual gratification and fixing/adding graphics would certainly make that experience better and there's no reason not to do that. But what does Exploration really do for the Elite universe? What changes come about in this "living" universe because of all the vast amounts, trillions of credits being handed out to explorers bringing back data?> (what do trading and combat really do for that matter but that's another topic.)

I'd do the following:

1. Have an in-game encyclopedia of discoveries, all the stats available from scans available in game, or at least in a browser somewhere. Some 3rd party efforts have been made in this area but they have to depend on the API, not direct status on the database. In-universe exploration exploits and discoveries should be announced and tracked in Galmap like top bounties. It's be cool to see who are the top explorers, see the records for the largest diameter rocky body, highest landable gravity body, hottest temperature, etc. All that information is gathered and then locked away.

2. Factions should do something with all this data, so the only goal isn't to get back and get paid. Exploration data should have been factored into PowerPlay, for example. You want to help a power right now, you have to haul widgets back and forth or shoot stuff. If you're an explorer, tough cookies. Not that this would fix PowerPlay (also a different discussion) but all of the key data about resources and habitable planets should be valuable to the Big 3 and the sub factions. They should try to woo returning explorers to get the data. They should want to hire the best explorers and reward them for their efforts It should be a competition.

3. Toward #2, exploration missions should be a thing beyond the Tourist missions. "Go to XYZ sector and scan 100 systems." "Go to ABC sector and plot out the location of all the companion stars." "Spectroscopic analyss shows System JKL might potentially have an earthlike. Take a DSS out there and find out, and return the location of any others you find. We'll pay handsomely for up to 10." Just something to give explorers a solid goal beyond wandering, and provide faction influence and reputation bonuses. These could spawn follow on missions if they are successful.

4. Also toward #2, make exploration data key for who gets new stations built and where. Again it would require more work on the base game for the mechanics, but in a "living" galaxy the purchasers would do something with the data they purchase, deciding the location of future expansion, where mega ships might be sent, or even just some flavor text saying "Thanks to the efforts of these CMDRs, the Federation/Alliance/Empire is funding an expedition to the following locations:"...

5. Seed the galaxy with things to find like the loot system in Diablo. Randomized alien artifacts from long gone civilizations, dormant space probes, something more than explorer data caches. Have a different table for unique system objects, so you can find super rare items like giant asteroids of pure palladium or a once-earthlike world destroyed by nuclear war or a giant volcano... There's a finite variety you could put into such random drops of course, but it would make scanning systems more interesting and in depth than opening the system map and looking for ELW/WW/terraformables.

6. The genie is out of the bottle on this one but they never should have given the Advanced Discovery Scanner infinite range. It might be too late to nerf that, but it takes away actually having to scan and discover. Maybe it could have been made to be infinite only for stellar bodies, so you know there's something 150,000ls out but not what's around it - you'd have to get closer to spot it. Or, maybe it should be infinite, but in a cone rather than a sphere, so while zooming around you spot a dot in the distance moving, you can blast it with the ADS and it lights up what's in an arc. Or maybe add a parallax scanner that lets you take multiple shots while traveling in a line and the player could analyze it to look for differences. Just something to make the process of discovery actually involve discovery.

I think any or all of these would help.

Plus bring back the glory and beauty of the 1.x graphics. :p
 
I'd say, you need to incentivize more explorers, weren't too many early on because of the low payout, they increased the payout, now more are venturing out. The next step is to post the top 100 explorers with the most first discoveries, maybe on GalNet or something. Give those wanting to go out a goal to shoot for, and it also recognizes those that have gone out when exploring was drab and boring and have accumulated a large pool of first discoveries. I kinda started the exploring business a little late and didn't get to spend too much time on it, but have over 42k, which may be in the top 100, I dunno.
 
See my signature for how I would improve exploration.

Eh, I'll just post it all here:

Pretty much every commander agrees that exploration in Elite could use some development, this appears to be an almost universal opinion among the players. Lot's of commanders currently ignore exploration due to it's lack of development, they find it boring and not very engaging. I’ve done my fair share of exploring since 1.0, spending 90% of my time (maybe more) out in deep space. Hundreds of hours utilizing the game’s existing mechanics for exploration. That’s afforded me a lot of time to ponder how I wish exploration was better in the game.

So, as a veteran of exploration in Elite, how would I like to see it improved in the future?

Exploration needs two areas of improvement: mechanics, and content. Frontier has added some content since 1.0 in the form of geysers, fumeroles, and fungal life, but explorers have no tools at all to find them, so they need to search entire planets by eye, which is not very feasible nor interactive in any way at all. They added content potential with landable worlds but as of yet haven't utilized this potential for explorers in any engaging ways. This is why improved exploration mechanics are so sorely needed. First Discovery Tags and Neutron Jumps are the only meaningful mechanics to be added to exploration since 1.0 that directly improved the game play of exploration, but one is a passive improvement and the other is a specialized mode of travel. Exploration desperately needs more interactive and engaging mechanics to add diversity and player initiated actions to the role, it also needs more risk and some aspect of survival, the fact that so many explorers currently watch Netflix while they explore says it all!!!

So here are some ideas on how exploration could be improved using the 2.3 version as a starting point, and I’ll do mechanics first followed by content which then uses those mechanics. With most of these ideas I've attempted to not suggest anything incredibly outlandish, but rather use Elite's current mechanics as a basis to build upon. In fact a lot of my ideas just modify existing current mechanics and applies them as new exploration improvements. Afterwards I'll go into the far future of Elite exploration with ideas for new planet types and such.


CHANGES TO THE EXPLORATION GAME LOOP: Here are some changes and tweaks to the main core game loop of exploration, dividing it into four main stages. The goal here is to add levels of actions, decisions, and discovery to the core exploration loop, while also providing opportunity for some new mechanics AND reducing the time it would take to complete scan a normal system. It also implements a mechanic for multicrew exploration to utilize too:


  • First Stage - The Discovery Scanner Honk. This reveals gravitational data on objects, giving you an Orrery map with "black" stellar bodies (no graphics), their orbital paths, and their gravity data. With that Orrery map you can see if the system structure looks interesting or not, how many bodies it has, etc. Infinite range on all three scanners (BDS, IDS, and ADS).
  • Second Stage - Visual Scan. Next would be the visual scan. A secondary function of all Discovery Scanners would be a turret style sensor with a full range of motion, like a vision canon / telescope. Simply flying within range of a planet or star quickly scans the object visually, discovering the Orrery map graphic (NOT the surface map!) along with planet/star type. Note you do not need to point the ship at the object, just fly within range of it. The range of the visual scanner would vary among the three scanner types. For example, the BDS might require you to fly to within 2000ls of an object to unlock it's graphical view, the IDS maybe 10,000ls, and the ADS something like 30,000ls, but not an infinite range. Seeing the Orrery graphics for very far out bodies in a system would require the decision to actually fly out there.

    Another function of the visual (targeted) scanner would be the spectrograph. Targeting any body on the Orrery map (at any range) would produce a sensor waterfall display (also visible from the cockpit too), much like a vertical version of the SRV wave scanner. Every different planet type would produce a unique sensor echo which could be used to approximate the planet type at range without a closeup detail scan. The waterfalls often contain noise data too which can obfuscate the reading somewhat, yet still give a good indication that an Earth like or Ammonia world just might be there. This way a knowledgeable commander could identify very far off worlds that they might want to explore without any hard scan evidence determining the planet type. This turreted visual scanner could also be utilized during multicrew sessions, allowing crew to point the scanners at objects and analyze their spectrographs, thereby giving an exploration multicrew a job to do.
  • Third Stage - Detail Surface Scan. Here is where you can fly within a certain distance of a stellar body (say 3K or so for large planets, like 3X the range of live currently) and perform a detail scan to get all of the body data like age, orbital info, materials, surface maps, etc. You do not need to point the ship at the object, simply target it within range. This also provides you with the Surface Heat Map which highlights large potential search areas on the planet where things can be found like geysers/fumeroles, unknown structures, life forms, high material concentrations, etc. Note that this scan would should be very fast, almost instant, to reduce time sink (the time to fly "close" to the planet should be time sink enough for the scan). This could also be used in multicrew by allowing the crew to do the targeting for the pilot, maybe even boosting the range somewhat for a crewed ship.
  • Fourth Stage - Surface Exploration. The surface heat map now in hand, the commander can choose to fly down into search zones to look for POI's. Upon entering the zone a search indicator pops up (like surface salvage missions currently use, only more intensive) to guide the player incrementally, gradually narrowing down the search area to a more localized zone where the commander would need to land and use the SRV scanners to finally pinpoint the POI.

The total time to completely scan an entire system should be equal or less than it currently takes in game due to the much increased scan distances, much reduced scan times, along with the removal of the need to fly right up to the smaller planets. The turreted DSS means a ship can sit just off the perimeter of a gas giant with a dozen moons and quickly detail scan them all without even needing to move the ship at all, but the commander needs to manually point the DSS turret at them all to do so. It is quick and active, not passive.

Each level would pay incrementally. A basic honk (stage 1) would give some credits. Visually scanning objects (stage 2) would give more on top of that, detail scanning objects (stage 3) would pay large amounts of credits, especially for ELW, AW, and TF worlds, and then landing on the surface to scan POIs or take core samples (stage 4) would pay huge amounts of credits. Reward explorers for actually exploring, but much less for just jump and honking.

NEW & IMPROVED EXPLORATION MECHANICS: There are three goals to these new and improved mechanics: to give explorers more information to prompt decision making, to give explorers more to do, and to make exploring more risky.


  • Planet Surface Heat Maps – A new feature of DSS scans, surface maps now highlight areas of interest, or search zones which can identify large areas to find things like man made unidentified objects (unregistered bases or outposts), alien unidentified objects (alien ruins, alien ship crash sites), geysers and fumeroles, fungal life, basically any unidentified procedurally or hand placed fixed POI on the surface.

    Upon flying down into a heatmap zone and entering glide, a bouncing search designator routine begins just like what is currently used for surface salvage missions, only requiring many more “iterations” to narrow down. Once the commander finalizes the search routine they then must land and use the SRV scanners to exactly locate where the POI is. Once these POI’s are found by the commander they then become “known” to them and from then on are no longer marked with heatmaps but instead with the normal surface designator icon, like bubble surface content currently is.

    The idea is not to make things super easy nor fast for explorers to find, but to add some layers of interactivity into the process via several mechanics working together. Finding things should require a hunting process and not be magically "detected" by a passive radar function.
  • Solar Flares – Fuel scooping is now more dangerous! Occasionally there can be solar flares and star corona ejections while fuel scooping, which have to be avoided or the ship could experience sudden drastic heat increases, and even take shield damage, and if the shields drop then hull and module damage. Adds some interactivity and danger to a common but mundane task of exploring.
  • Natural Signal Sources – New version of a procedurally placed fixed USS but all naturally occurring stuff, like comets, very large landable asteroids, wandering asteroid fields, and even rogue planets (more below). Some NSS’s contain things which can be scanned for data (gets more valuable with distance from SOL), others can be mined for materials. NSS can spawn anywhere, even in the bubble too, but they get much more valuable with distance from the bubble.
  • Module Wear & Tear - Modules would very gradually degrade over time with use. For bubble players this would be a non issue, simply hit the repair button every dozen docks or so and it's cheaply fixed, but for deep space explorers this would make the AFMU necessary equipment, adding some survival management to exploration. During long trips explorers would have to restock the AFMU, which would eventually force them down to planet surfaces to hunt for materials in order to keep flying. The idea here is to break up the rythym of exploring with other tasks, and to prevent ships from flying forever without some effort required towards maintaining the ship in working order.
  • Exploration Missions - Add a new section to the Cartography page at bases where explorers can browse for exploration missions. This would require the mission generator to work in tandem with the Stellar Forge in order to create mission targets that actually exist but are undiscovered yet. These could entail tasks like:
    • Fly to a specific system and perform a full scan of all stellar bodies.
    • Search a specified sector for a specific star or planet type, matching certain criteria. Scan it and return.
    • Search a specified sector for a certain type of volcanism, scan it and return.
    • Full scan some random amount of planet types.


NEW EXPLORATION CONTENT: These suggestions are intended to give explorers more things to search for in tandem with the above mechanics, plus additional tools using existing mechanics.


  • Rework Geysers / Fumeroles / Fungal Life – Simply update these to work with the new DSS heatmaps, and add scan points to the sites which marks their location as "known" and makes it sellable data. Once a pilot finds one of these sites they will forever be marked in their nav panel and easily navigated to again if desired.
  • New Natural Surface POI’s – These are not fixed POI’s like geysers, but a new category of randomly generated instanced POI’s (like cargo dumps and mat nodes) which are located via the SRV scanners. Gives explorers things to find while driving around on planet surfaces in deep space which can be scanned for valuable data. Things like geologic formations, meteor impact sites, more kinds of fungal life, and surface core samples (more on this below), all in varying degrees of value and quality. These data scans become more valuable with distance from SOL, this encourages explorers to get out into deep space while rewarding the time and effort to get there.
  • SRV MkII (The Rhino) – This is a new, slower but slightly larger version of the Scarab, with a weaker main turret but much more cargo space. The MkII also carries a surface drill rig which can be used for various things, like surface ore mining, and collecting surface core samples!
  • Surface Core Samples – These are rare random locations found in conjunction with the SRV scanner and heatmaps which allow the commander to use the drill rig on the SRV MkII to drill through the surface and collect a planet core sample, which takes 1T of cargo rack space and can be flown back to civilization and sold for large credit values. Again the cores increase in value with distance from SOL. The new DSS heatmaps can be used to locate areas on planets with the best chances of finding surface core spots, but much SRV searching will still be required to find them. In general though they will procedurally spawn around areas of increased surface terrain geometry, like large canyon or mountain networks or inside craters.
  • Caves - Implement caves as random procedurally fixed terrain features. Accessible by both sinkholes (surface holes like on Earth's Moon) or by sloped entrances in craters/mountainsides/canyon walls. Large enough to drive the SRV in, some might even be large enough to fly the ship into, and with a high probability of finding materials, fungal life, surface ores, scannable geologic formations, etc within. Also prime locations for surface core collection points!
  • Rogue Planets - Fully landable but very rare planets found in the new Natural Signal Sources, with potentially everything that can be found on normal planets, but with much more robust terrain geometry. These planets have gone through hell, so they can potentially have very extreme terrain features and crazy POI clusters. Extremely valuable surface core samples, as long as you can locate them!
  • Exploration Internal Slots – Certain ships get additional internals that can be used for exploration related modules; like both scanners, fuel scoops, and the AFMU.
  • Neutron Battery – New utility slot module, can store one charge of a neutron jump for the FSD. This could allow explorers to potentially use neutron stars to jump into very remote systems which would normally strand the ship with no way to return. Filling the battery takes longer than normal FSD charging though, thus more time spent fighting the jets and much greater damage done to the ship. Plus activating a neutron battery can potentially overload systems and cause additional random module damage.


All of the above is meant to add some interactivity to exploration making it more engaging while also giving explorers more to do, more options of what to explore for, and also adding more risk to exploration too. It's a foundation of interactive mechanics enabling additional future content to be utilized for gameplay purposes, not just eye candy.

Here are a few more additional ideas for exploration to improve it even further:


EXPLORATION ODDS & ENDS: Quality of life improvements, just nice to have stuff that really effects everyone, but more so explorers.


  • Greater Diversity in Planet Coloring - Get rid of the galactic beige plague that has infected 97% of landable high metal content and metal rich worlds! It's fine to have some monotone planets, but there needs to be interesting looking planets with color diversity too. Exploring planets with interesting and varied terrain is much more fun than monochrome worlds. You only need look to our own solar system to see plenty of real life examples. (Frontier has already stated they want to improve this eventually, as of March 2017)
  • Black Hole Accretion Discs - Make large black holes look more scenic, more like the physicist Kip Thorne predicts they do. Like the movie Interstellar's black hole!
  • Planetary Ring Shadows - Yeah it's probably not an easy one to implement into the Cobra Engine, but it would be so much more scenic and immersive if planet rings cast shadows on the planets, especially down at the surface level.


ADDITIONAL PLANET TYPES: As more planet types are enabled for landings even more content can be added to exploration, bringing greater depth to the role while also bringing much greater dangers too.


  • Volcanic Worlds - Explore planets with magma flows, lava oceans, superheated geysers, and volcanos of many sizes. Magma and lava can inflict great damage to SRV's but surface core samples from these worlds can be incredibly lucrative, so pilots must take care when driving around searching for them. Also flying the ship through superheated geysers or volcanic eruptions can ruin a day real quick, but the interiors of volcanos can be exceptional locations for scans or core samples. It's wiser to find caves and enter volcanos in the SRV that way, but great care must be taken when doing so.
  • Gas Giants - Flying down inside beautiful gas giant atmospheres can be dangerous, but profitable. Fuel scoops can be used to collect valuable atmospheric samples which take up 1T of cargo space by locating "pockets" on the radar and flying into them, this is time consuming though. Terribly strong winds can buffet the ship making controlling flight difficult, and huge storms with lightning strikes can cause great damage quickly, even causing module malfunctions. Some worlds also have very acidic atmospheres as well which can damage the ship over time. However, some rare gas giants also have life forms flying inside of them, and these can be scanned for incredibly valuable data.
  • Atmospheric Worlds - These planets are rich in resources and very scenic to explore, some even have life, but atmospheres can cause problems too. Some worlds are plagued with very strong storms of various types: electrical, gale force winds, acidic, and particulate. Lightning can cause terrible ship damage, winds can throw ships around like paper planes making landing or flying low dangerous, acid rains can eat hull away. Heatmaps from the DSS can show weather systems on the planet, so the pilot can fly to elude them and be safe, but weather is often unpredictable, so diligence while exploring is necessary, and a hasty retreat back into "safe" outer space may sometimes be prudent. Despite the dangers though, everything on these worlds are valuable: materials, data scans, surface core samples, ores to mine, etc.
  • Dark Systems - These are planets or planetary systems out in space that do not have main stars, thus no light in them at all nor any huge mass sources other than planets. They would not show in the galaxy map due to not being indexed, Stellar Cartography doesn't know they exist due to no light sources so they aren't in the computer nav banks. The only way to find them would be to search the nav panel on the ship's left console while traveling through space and look for any systems labeled as "UNKNOWN", as the ship's sensors would detect a mass jump point but wouldn't recognize it. (Possibly have a message pop up on the HUD when the ship detects an unknown mass source out in deep space?)


IN-GAME STELLAR CARTOGRAPHY GALACTIC RECORDS LEADERBOARD:: This would be a new competitive (non-combat) multiplayer feature for explorers where the game keeps track of discovery records for things like "oldest M type star", "youngest black hole", "largest ammonia world", and so on for dozens of categories. Each record would list the system and object name, the CMDR who discovered it and the date. The current record holder list could be accessed from anywhere via a Stellar Cartography button on the ship's GalNet menu under the cockpit's left UI panel. Whenever a CMDR scans a planet or star which broke a record they would be notified via a pop up after scanning, but in order to actually log the record and get credit for it the pilot would need to hand in the exploration data and sell it.



There, those are just some ideas I've thought about for improving exploration over the past two and a half years. In summary, I'd just like to see exploration made more engaging and interactive overall, and less passive and "instant scan" like. More gameplay in the role, less tedium.
 
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Oh god, not again.
Sorry, I'm new to this forum so haven't seen any previous threads discussing this, if that is what you are implying? It would be more constructive to point me to such a thread, or summarise the objections, rather than making an unproductive comment. Thanks.
 
Sorry, I'm new to this forum so haven't seen any previous threads discussing this, if that is what you are implying? It would be more constructive to point me to such a thread, or summarise the objections, rather than making an unproductive comment. Thanks.

Don't worry, there's always one or two people who don't really understand the point of a discussion forum, and/or think the game is perfect in it's current form. They also tend to have no interest in anything that doesn't involve shooting at each other.

I won't go over my own ideas again, because Mengy tends to do that for me :p Suffice to say, Exploration should be a big thing in Elite.. and currently it's just a sideline for nice screenshots.

Let's hope the 'core' updates include exploration improvements.
 
Mengy summarized everything I could think of about this in his post, rep to you commander as usual. But to be honest we are pretty far in, entire season has ended and we still have barren plain rocks with tiny fire crackers/geysers that are so hard to find its not worth it. Unless FD is planning entire DLC just for explorers I dont think anything will change any time soon. Honestly why would it? Pew pew aliens sells the game, who cares what redit/forum pools says right?
 
You are the product managed for ED: 2.5 (or 3.0, whatever). The name of the update is (just for the purposes of this thread): The Explorers.

How are you going to 'fix' exploration, to make it fun and exciting and interesting and deep ?

My limited ideas:

  • Fix the 'beige-ification'. This is goddam priority #1. I want worlds that look as close to visually indistinguishable from the real world as possible. Yes, even the airless worlds can be made more exciting.
  • Unify the shaders for landfall and non-landfall worlds. Backwards compatibility be damned. You sometimes see really cool looking worlds, but they are cool because they are not landfall planets (they have atmospheres). Make these planets land-able
  • Extend the range of landfall planets as much as practical. Worlds with atmospheres, water worlds, non-life bearing worlds, lava worlds. As much as can be done.
  • Completely re-write the shaders for gas giants. They are far too repetitive and unrealistic at the moment. I want Jupiters, Saturns, Uranuses
  • While you're at it, rewrite the ring shaders too. The are too solid-looking at the moment.
  • Hell, while you're at it, work on the star shaders too - stop the textures jumping, make them look better at close range. Slow down the comically fast surface animation...etc.
  • Oh - please also fix the really bad texture smearing you see when orbiting close to a non-landfall planet. That's been a bug for the longest time.


Whoa - thats' mostly just graphical fixes....

  • Add game mechanics to allow close surface scans to be worthwhile. Revisit the broken POI system that forces you to fly > 2km
  • Add surface sampling missions.
  • Add survey drones (space and surface).
  • Add point of interest geography - huge mountains, valleys, etc, for us to discover.
  • Add surface waypoints, and proper surface navigation.
  • Add space and surface base creation
  • Add more kinds of SRV, and pivotable skimmers.
  • Add sub-surface geology - ie. caves, lava tubes, sinkholes, pits.
  • Beef up active surface geology.
  • Fix dark-side lighting to make it actually dark. Add game elements to mitigate this (night vision, surface lighting.


There's loads more - what would you do?

(oops - messed up the thread title, but you get the idea)

I would love skimmer escorts with my SRV's since their is no point to have 2.

But for me more random events and everything you listed.
 
You are the product managed for ED: 2.5 (or 3.0, whatever). The name of the update is (just for the purposes of this thread): The Explorers.

How are you going to 'fix' exploration, to make it fun and exciting and interesting and deep ?

My limited ideas:

  • Fix the 'beige-ification'. This is goddam priority #1. I want worlds that look as close to visually indistinguishable from the real world as possible. Yes, even the airless worlds can be made more exciting.
  • Unify the shaders for landfall and non-landfall worlds. Backwards compatibility be damned. You sometimes see really cool looking worlds, but they are cool because they are not landfall planets (they have atmospheres). Make these planets land-able
  • Extend the range of landfall planets as much as practical. Worlds with atmospheres, water worlds, non-life bearing worlds, lava worlds. As much as can be done.
  • Completely re-write the shaders for gas giants. They are far too repetitive and unrealistic at the moment. I want Jupiters, Saturns, Uranuses
  • While you're at it, rewrite the ring shaders too. The are too solid-looking at the moment.
  • Hell, while you're at it, work on the star shaders too - stop the textures jumping, make them look better at close range. Slow down the comically fast surface animation...etc.
  • Oh - please also fix the really bad texture smearing you see when orbiting close to a non-landfall planet. That's been a bug for the longest time.


Whoa - thats' mostly just graphical fixes....

  • Add game mechanics to allow close surface scans to be worthwhile. Revisit the broken POI system that forces you to fly > 2km
  • Add surface sampling missions.
  • Add survey drones (space and surface).
  • Add point of interest geography - huge mountains, valleys, etc, for us to discover.
  • Add surface waypoints, and proper surface navigation.
  • Add space and surface base creation
  • Add more kinds of SRV, and pivotable skimmers.
  • Add sub-surface geology - ie. caves, lava tubes, sinkholes, pits.
  • Beef up active surface geology.
  • Fix dark-side lighting to make it actually dark. Add game elements to mitigate this (night vision, surface lighting.


There's loads more - what would you do?

(oops - messed up the thread title, but you get the idea)

Also to add mobile refuel/restock/repair stations or camps for big systems with tons of planets.

Also I think the SRVs (even if a different type) should be able to repair your hull and modules when landed. For emergency landings. That will take the fear out of leaving civilized space.
 
One idea I'd like to see explored (drum roll) is tangential to exploration but something that would encourage more people to give it a go: The ability to easily swap between your ships.

The main thing that discourages long-range exploration for me is that once you are far from the bubble your game options severely decrease. You can't take part in CGs, see new Thargoid content, you can't bounty hunt or trade. You basically have to sacrifice everything to exploration - which may be cool with hardcore explorers, but for people who enjoy a variety of stuff it makes it way less appealing, especially as it can take literally dozens of (rather tedious) hours to get back to civilisation.

So I'd like to be able to - at login - choose which of my ships in my fleet I start from. If I have two ships - say a Vulture near Sol or an Asp Explorer near Colonia - then I can choose which one to start in. That way I can dedicate one ship to exploration but still participate in all the other aspects of the game by swapping to my Vulture. It would probably need the game slightly changing so that exploration data (maybe materials?) is locked to the ship that discovers it, but I don't see any issue with that.

This is not a QoL based on exploration, this is a QoL based on player/commander. Something that has been addressed with dual accounts. When you're out of the bubble, you're out to do that job: Explore.

Not to, "oh I'm bored, I want to do the CG now."
 
Agreed BEtter BETTER scanners surface details wrecks to replace the the hideous poi system bring it.:)
 
1. Have an in-game encyclopedia of discoveries, all the stats available from scans available in game, or at least in a browser somewhere. Some 3rd party efforts have been made in this area but they have to depend on the API, not direct status on the database. In-universe exploration exploits and discoveries should be announced and tracked in Galmap like top bounties. It's be cool to see who are the top explorers, see the records for the largest diameter rocky body, highest landable gravity body, hottest temperature, etc. All that information is gathered and then locked away.

I'm completely and utterly AGAINST having any of this data being something provided in a browser access anything. This didn't work out at all with Destiny with its lore, and there's no reason why this should be applied here. Currently this data is available in EDDi if you had loaded it up since the time you started this game; with one major caveat... It wouldn't go into the servers to find this data instead pulling from the local files. If you did a format and/or upgrade of your equipment at any time and didn't restore the files, you were SOL on that information gathering.

I might go for something in game for this, especially for something that one can access from the Galactic Map. But barring third party apps I do not want this available for browser access as this can be a potential security breach issue. And if you haven't learned this from Equifax's debacle, you might want to brush up on it.

2. Factions should do something with all this data, so the only goal isn't to get back and get paid. Exploration data should have been factored into PowerPlay, for example. You want to help a power right now, you have to haul widgets back and forth or shoot stuff. If you're an explorer, tough cookies. Not that this would fix PowerPlay (also a different discussion) but all of the key data about resources and habitable planets should be valuable to the Big 3 and the sub factions. They should try to woo returning explorers to get the data. They should want to hire the best explorers and reward them for their efforts It should be a competition.

Hmmm... What more are you proposing? This scan data automatically raises your reputation with the local faction; as I frequently dump my explorer data and get friendly reputation with the local faction. This often opens up many missions I didn't have when I was there before: And I'm only just a Broker in trade now.

This data is also useful for BGS.

You're also wanting more money for data dumping based on a CG? It's been asked for and ignored from what I've seen.

It's also been asked for a fragment of that reputation being applied to the big three faction in the area as Civilian Surveyors in real time get better reputation (and more work) from the country's military based on GSA-like work in real time.. I asked for this. It's also been ignored.

3. Toward #2, exploration missions should be a thing beyond the Tourist missions. "Go to XYZ sector and scan 100 systems." "Go to ABC sector and plot out the location of all the companion stars." "Spectroscopic analyss shows System JKL might potentially have an earthlike. Take a DSS out there and find out, and return the location of any others you find. We'll pay handsomely for up to 10." Just something to give explorers a solid goal beyond wandering, and provide faction influence and reputation bonuses. These could spawn follow on missions if they are successful.

All right, I have to ask this.. What are you on about? I've never done tourist missions. I always do ADS and DSS and the payouts have been significantly increased since 2.3. I think you're trying to ask for more money for doing smaller missions. Am I reading this correctly?

If that's the case, I can guarantee you more explorers will come out of the woodwork giving you a hearty "Disagreement" right down to a "Request Denied".

If you really want to make money -- do ADS and DSS scans in the Bubble for all systems there. You'll get tons of money hand over fist, your Elite Ranking and never once having to get space madness when you're outside the bubble. Win-win.

4. Also toward #2, make exploration data key for who gets new stations built and where. Again it would require more work on the base game for the mechanics, but in a "living" galaxy the purchasers would do something with the data they purchase, deciding the location of future expansion, where mega ships might be sent, or even just some flavor text saying "Thanks to the efforts of these CMDRs, the Federation/Alliance/Empire is funding an expedition to the following locations:"...

Finally... A point I can get behind... Well sort of. While it doesn't take much to create a colony or a station somewhere, the problem is that the devs move slower than glaciers about creating new colonies and locations. Actually I think we're more likely to see a change in epochs before the kind of expansion goes on based on what you're implying here.

Stars! (Empire Interactive) used to have this but in order for this to happen, you need to have more realistic population growth models coupled with elapsed time. This game tends to run in something akin to real time. This is good when you warp into a system with a black hole and realize that it's only 5,000 LS entry point. Even with that closeness you're looking at centuries before the black hole completely destroys the star and any planets located there. Bad when it comes to population growth an expansion as you're looking at 20+ years a sufficient population complete with viable working force created within a system to be used for colonization purposes.

I rather like the fact that it's minutes, hours and days according to my minutes, hours and days. Because I'd hate to start seeing this game trying to work out time dilation and relativity. The player base will either have their heads imploding, or the salt six times more toxic than what I'm producing here. The few that can work this out will probably be keeping it to themselves (lord knows I would).

5. Seed the galaxy with things to find like the loot system in Diablo. Randomized alien artifacts from long gone civilizations, dormant space probes, something more than explorer data caches. Have a different table for unique system objects, so you can find super rare items like giant asteroids of pure palladium or a once-earthlike world destroyed by nuclear war or a giant volcano... There's a finite variety you could put into such random drops of course, but it would make scanning systems more interesting and in depth than opening the system map and looking for ELW/WW/terraformables.

This.... this... this... this is going against both the Fermi Paradox and Clarke's Rule on civilizations forming simultaneously. You already have the Guardians and the Thargoids. You want more? What do you think this is, Star Trek? Battlestar Galactica (the original series, not the Moore remake)? Red Dwarf? Even McDevitt was pushing the envelope and did so based on numerous complaints for his Academy Series, hence the reason why he made humans into demons on almost all the planets that humans went to visit.

Going with humans only being capable of interstellar flight... as it stands, I've seen USS 2,000 LY out from the bubble that are completely unbelievable (and immersion breaking) to me when the system I just got done scanning suddenly shows a gun/drug/whatever runner on the surface, or a satellite probe from one of the big three crashed to collect. I suspect I'll be seeing more of this as I head to Eta Carinae this journey. While I normally ignore them and know that this is being done for the sake of the game for impatient players, I'm willing to think that 10 LY from the bubble means no humanity. Do the maths for this -- you'll see even that from me is extremely giving.

6. The genie is out of the bottle on this one but they never should have given the Advanced Discovery Scanner infinite range. It might be too late to nerf that, but it takes away actually having to scan and discover. Maybe it could have been made to be infinite only for stellar bodies, so you know there's something 150,000ls out but not what's around it - you'd have to get closer to spot it. Or, maybe it should be infinite, but in a cone rather than a sphere, so while zooming around you spot a dot in the distance moving, you can blast it with the ADS and it lights up what's in an arc. Or maybe add a parallax scanner that lets you take multiple shots while traveling in a line and the player could analyze it to look for differences. Just something to make the process of discovery actually involve discovery.

Strange.. Honking into the system (ADS) is only giving you basic planetary locations with orbital moons, rings, stars and asteroid clusters based on planetary reflective light from the stars and in some cases multiple stars and multiple systems in a cluster along perhaps the theory surrounding gravitational variations in a system (which is admittedly a theory now, but who knows in 1200+ years). You then need to use a DSS in order to get all the other details of the system... And yet you call this letting the genie out of the bottle...? You want to thereby break rules and laws from hard sci-fi used to create this game and think you're not going to be letting the Ifrit out instead?

Overall, I think this is a hot mess sane developers should avoid.
 
Sorry, I'm new to this forum so haven't seen any previous threads discussing this, if that is what you are implying? It would be more constructive to point me to such a thread, or summarise the objections, rather than making an unproductive comment. Thanks.

There were quite of lot of threads about it in the early years. They are probably all archived by now.
But ED is a different game now. Exploration has taken a hit with passenger missions so I don't think that telepresence would be out of the question in the futuew.
 
I missing a proper "star selector" from inside my cockpit, something simple that i can "look at", select and get information about that star and if i want, jump to it. The same as for the planets, but to select visible stars from the Cockpit.


A proper navigation system to introduce data in the ship for tracking things on the planets.


Detailed surface scanner revealing important data, artefacts, organics, structures, visible later on the surface maps.


Remote drones for exploring the surface.


legs.


emotions.
 
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