Fined for buying freely available goods from a station

[calistan]

So I decide to do some trading for the first time in a few months.

The best profit I can find is in imperial slaves - 'an important part of imperial society' - so I find somewhere selling low, a few hops away from somewhere buying high. Both in Empire space, obviously.

I make a few uneventful trips, until I'm scanned while leaving the selling station and slapped with a huge fine of over 956,000 credits.

How is that even possible? They're selling imperial slaves on the open market, it's an Empire system. Surely they can't sell me a cargo bay full of their own goods, then fine me as I leave the premises.

I have no intention of paying those blatant racketeers, and would gladly leave Empire space forever if need be, so my question is:
What will happen if I don't pay the fine? And is there any other way to get rid of it?

 

[CMDR Beltane]

Which system / station? And if you don't pay your fine, it will turn into a bounty on your head.

 

[calistan]

It was Tau-2 Gruis A, Thomas Station. Seems bizarre that they would sell something to traders, then fine them for buying it.

Is the bounty galaxy-wide, even in non-Empire space? Could I just buy a sidewinder, wreck it, and get reincarnated a free man?

 

[CMDR Beltane]

It was Tau-2 Gruis A, Thomas Station. Seems bizarre that they would sell something to traders, then fine them for buying it.

Is the bounty galaxy-wide, even in non-Empire space? Could I just buy a sidewinder, wreck it, and get reincarnated a free man?

Thomas Station is an independent Station where Imperial Slaves are prohibited, thats why you got the fine. Under certain conditions stations sell even prohibited stuff.

 

[cluelessforumuser65578]

i liberated a couple of thousand tonnes slaves from that exact station a few nights ago in a my t9, the first run like you i didnt realise they were illicit cargo and almost got scanned but jumped away before it completed. when i went back, before buying them i turned everything of cept thrusters to chill right down on the pad, then casually flew out the front door with nobody the wiser multiple times

 

[calistan]

Thomas Station is an independent Station where Imperial Slaves are prohibited, thats why you got the fine. Under certain conditions stations sell even prohibited stuff.

It makes no sense at all within the game's fiction. Imperial slaves are legal throughout the Empire, this system is under Empire jurisdiction.

I'm going to see what happens when I refuse to pay the fine.

 

[CMDR Beltane]

It makes no sense at all within the game's fiction. Imperial slaves are legal throughout the Empire, this system is under Empire jurisdiction.

I'm going to see what happens when I refuse to pay the fine.

Okay, then best to learn quick that it doesn't matter under which jurisdiction a systems runs. The stations decide for themselves if a ware is prohibited or not. So, to cut it short - always check if a ware you'd like to trade is prohobited or not, unless you want to collect more fines that is.

 

[calistan]

Okay, then best to learn quick that it doesn't matter under which jurisdiction a systems runs. The stations decide for themselves if a ware is prohibited or not. So, to cut it short - always check if a ware you'd like to trade is prohobited or not, unless you want to collect more fines that is.

Will do, yes. I don't remember it working that way last time I traded. Seems like there's no point in having all these governing powers.

And I still dont understand how a station can prohibit imperial slaves while maintaining a vast slave market within its own walls. They have tens of thousands of slaves available for purchase, but you're not allowed to buy them. Kind of breaks the immersion a little.

 

[Sgt Pepper]

Personally I'd bug it and put in a ticket, this really doesn't sound right.

If black markets were like the commodity market, where one can buy as well as sell, fair enough but it makes no sense if legitimately obtained items are illicit/prohibited in the very same station they're sold at.

 

[W4rSkuLL]

Will do, yes. I don't remember it working that way last time I traded. Seems like there's no point in having all these governing powers.

And I still dont understand how a station can prohibit imperial slaves while maintaining a vast slave market within its own walls. They have tens of thousands of slaves available for purchase, but you're not allowed to buy them. Kind of breaks the immersion a little.

Yes, its strange behavior. I think the Imperials are schizophrenic. Its a big scam, they lure you in and sell you imperial slaves for millions and then scan and fine you when you leave. Its double "payday" for the imperial station. Or maybe its a bug. A station shouldn´t sell what itself has deemed illegal.

 

[SpectralHeretic]

It was Tau-2 Gruis A, Thomas Station. Seems bizarre that they would sell something to traders, then fine them for buying it.

Is the bounty galaxy-wide, even in non-Empire space? Could I just buy a sidewinder, wreck it, and get reincarnated a free man?

Only just seen the thread but almost could have predicted Thomas Station. Have seen several people get caught there. Tbf I was caught there too. Didn't even get a scan.
I think they should have goods the station has made illegal, available from the black market rather than the commodities market.

 

[calistan]

Only just seen the thread but almost could have predicted Thomas Station. Have seen several people get caught there. Tbf I was caught there too. Didn't even get a scan.
I think they should have goods the station has made illegal, available from the black market rather than the commodities market.

The logistics of it are just so implausible. I could understand if it was possible to buy one or two illegal slaves that an unscrupulous trader had declared were his staff or something, but there must be more slaves on Thomas Station than there are regular citizens. It's just nonsense, shouldn't be possible in the game.

Anyway, as an experiment I stored my Type 7 and bought a basic sidewinder. Crashed it into the outside of the station, rebought it for a few hundred, and sure enough the 956k fine was erased.

It was a stupid way to get a fine, so it's kind of appropriate that the way to get rid of the fine is almost equally lame.

edit: Actually, I might as well just keep working this route from Thomas Station. Every time I get a fine, I can get rid of it for 800 bucks.

 

[Lord_Crazy]

It was Tau-2 Gruis A, Thomas Station. Seems bizarre that they would sell something to traders, then fine them for buying it.

It actually has a name: the Congress/Parliament/Legislator.

 

[Luponator]

It's all over the place. Happens to me too in a different station in a different part of the Empire. The issue is not with a system/station blacklisting goods. The issue is with a station selling goods in an open market they deem illegal. It's flawed, and while not a bug per see, it's poor design.

 

[SirAdelaide]

If it's illegal, they should put it on the black market screen.

 

[Hey Mickey]

Seems like a power play bug. I was getting it in a few of Antal's exploited systems. Slaves and imperial slaves illegal on the system map but freely sold in commodities. One of them was a fed station, selling imperial slaves.

Hopefully it'll get fixed, though it's probably a low priority on the bug list.

 

[calistan]

Well, I'm back at Thomas Station doing it all over again. They have over 178,000 slaves here. Amazing that the local authorities haven't noticed, really.

Just hauled another full load in a Type 7 and earned 797,000 profit. I'm so rich, I might jettison a couple of slaves into a star on the way back, just for the hell of it.

When I've amassed about 20 million in fines, I'll crash a sidewinder and make it all go away for a few hundred. I think they need to patch this!

 

[CMDR Saari]

Be careful about destroying your ship as it only causes your fine to become dormant and could be reactivated if you are scanned by the issuing authorities. From the manual:

If you have unclaimed bounties and fines issued against you by factions
that do not control the starport then you have a stay of execution: those bounties and fines will
become dormant as those factions believe you dead.

Dormant bounties and fines are invisible to Commanders. Dormant fines do not tick up towards
becoming a bounty. However, if you are scanned by authorities of the faction that issued the
bounty or fine, or detected committing a crime in their jurisdiction, the dormant bounty and
fine will reactivate

So if I understand that correctly, every time you crash your ship your fine seems to disappear but it is really getting stacked together for if you get caught again...

 

[Rafe Zetter]

So I decide to do some trading for the first time in a few months.

The best profit I can find is in imperial slaves - 'an important part of imperial society' - so I find somewhere selling low, a few hops away from somewhere buying high. Both in Empire space, obviously.

I make a few uneventful trips, until I'm scanned while leaving the selling station and slapped with a huge fine of over 956,000 credits.

How is that even possible? They're selling imperial slaves on the open market, it's an Empire system. Surely they can't sell me a cargo bay full of their own goods, then fine me as I leave the premises.

I have no intention of paying those blatant racketeers, and would gladly leave Empire space forever if need be, so my question is:
What will happen if I don't pay the fine? And is there any other way to get rid of it?

This is a sideways effect of something I brought up the other day - saying how it made no sense, only to be told less than politely I was being an idiot....

Basically FDev have designed it so that a station within a system can be owned by a different sovereignty / faction with different laws than the police who are patrolling outside.

As you have now seen you can buy something legally within a station because it adheres to different laws - think Country A's Embassy located in Country B - but as soon as you step outside, boom you're committing an offense, pay up or die.

If FDev are going to continue with this situation - at least make the patrols surrounding the station and local space the SAME faction as that station - which is totally logical, and happens all the time - USA embassies in countries hostile to them are guarded by USA troops NOT troops or police of the parent (hostile) country. Once further away (a bit outside the stations mass lock for example so ppl can jump without being scanned) then fair enough, have the ruling faction police.

I'll bet though someone will still think I'm being an idiot and wrong.

- - - Updated - - -

Thomas Station is an independent Station where Imperial Slaves are prohibited, thats why you got the fine. Under certain conditions stations sell even prohibited stuff.

Right.... so an independent station will sell you "illegal" stuff knowing there are police outside ready to grab you for a fine - there's a word for that in RL "Entrapment" which is something police try now and again but is illegal and any person arrested under it will be released without charge.

 

[DaveB]

Some history for those of you scratching their heads at this:

Initially it was all about the system jurisdiction, the cops enforced "system" law no matter where they were.

We had several instances of (for example) the local security ships around an imperial station issuing fines for carrying imperial slaves simply because the systems "ruling faction" was not imperial and banned them.

So FD changed it, if you're in deep space, at a RES, a USS or a nav beacon you're under "system law" - same rules for whats illegal to carry as apply at the station run by the systems ruling faction. In a stations local space, however, stations dominant faction sets the law. This means that (again for example) carrying imperial slaves to an imperial station (where they are legal) in alliance space (where they are not) is fine so long as you weren't intercepted by the cops before dropping out of SC at the station. This is the logical way to handle it and why Thomas station's cops fined the OP when they scanned him leaving.

What is happening here looks like a very similar market bug where a local ban on a commodity doesn't take it off the open market.

I would urge everyone caught like that to note the station, the allegiances of the systems dominant minor faction and the minor faction running the station and report it to FD as a bug that a station is openly trading in goods that are illegal at that station. Include screenshots of the system map showing the goods are prohibited at that station and the commodity market screen showing them being openly traded. The goods on the market are already set on a station by station basis because different stations have different economy types, this is clearly a bug in that mechanism, similar to the one FD have already fixed for local law enforcement. Report it every station you see it at and FD will fix it.