FIV/FeLV disease for cats.
- Thread starter Kiwolf
- Start date
The trouble with FIV is that it's a lifelong condition, rather than a cureable illness. If you get a cat with FIV, it will always have FIV. There's no way to get rid of it, the way there is for most illnesses in the game.
FELV/FIV is a reality in the feline world.. it doesn't matter if it is something that is curable.. Fip is deadly, so what is the difference.. Fip is in the list.. is not curable, but what your telling me is that it's ok to bring in a disease that is deadly over a condition that can be managed?
FYI, I am a Siamese and Balinese breeder.... All my cats are actually tested for FIV/FeLV.. I am pretty sure wild cats are tested too.. Can ask my vet as he works for the Buffalo zoo..
Oh and here is some proof that tiger's get the disease.. https://www.tigers.org.za/illnesses-in-tigers.html
Woah... No need to be agressive, but I do understand where you;re coming from. To be fair, I don't know much about most of the illnesses on the list. Always good to learn more, so thanks.
not being aggressive.. being assertive, which is different.. i have been breeding a long time. and i have experience with FIP.. and i test all my cats for FIV/FeLV.. it i s a real problem
I don't think anyone is saying it's not a real problem. We had a scare with some rescue kittens that we adopted from a friend's parents who feed feral cats. Fortunately our kitties are fine and healthy. I think the other commentor was talking about how the disease would work mechanically with the game. Life long chronic conditions could actually add to the management but players would need to be informed so they can make choices about how to house infected animals and maybe be given a choice to pay for testing when a feline is brought in?
Jamie,
We just had a 14 month old cat die from FIP.. FIP is already on the list if diseases looked at, but yet the cure for FIP is in the 1000's and is not available in the USA without getting it on the black market. At least FIV/FeLV is something a cat can live with and is not something that will instantly kill a cat (no there is no cure for FIV/FeLV either).. Let me tell you, my experience with FIP was something I never want to see again, but in the breeding world, FIP is not something we can not run from. With that being said, FIV/FeLV is something we can keep our animals from having.. but even if we end up with a feline with it, it is a disease that can be handled with on board meds. FIV/FeLV is something that the cat will have for the rest of it's life.
This is the thing.. There are a lot of diseases that we don't talk about.. and that are not listed for the animals we keep zoo wise.. FIV/FeLV is one of them..
I also think that management for this is a real life situation. The idea of the game is conservation of endangered animals.. All the real diseases should be a major factor. When I bring up FIP vs FIV/FeLV.. People need to realize exactly what the difference is between these two diseases. And FIP is already in the game. Mechanics may not be what they should be, but the problem is.. these are still diseases that are real issues in the real world..
Link about FIP:
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catfriendly.com
Link about FIV/FeLV:
FIV - https://catfriendly.com/feline-diseases/fiv/
FeLV- https://catfriendly.com/feline-diseases/felv/
I'm not against the idea. But it sounds a bit complicated to introduce so many real life illnesses, etc.
I'd rather stick with the current in game diseases.
I don't think the game needs that much "realism".
The Game they started is based on a lot of complicated problems.. When you look at animals, you see family structures, dominance, ect.. right now half of those are not mechanically sound.. when you talk Conservation, you need to look at everything that befalls that animals.. Conservation is not a slide into home base type of game.. it is complicated and it takes a team of vets as well as people willing to help donate time and effort to save these animals.. So virals and disease come with this...
I totally understand that. It's just not something I am looking for in a game like this.
Then maybe Frontier needs to hear that because from what i have seen so far of the game.. that is the way they are headed..
I dont know for tigers, but although lions have a very high prevalence of FIV in free ranging animals (some populations reports +90% of incidence) they do not seem to affect mortality rates or present symptoms. Felv is yet undocumented in lions as far as I know. Its interesting enough for me as a veterinarian and you inspired me to sit and research for cases of FIV and FelV in wild felines populations, I can report it back if people are interested
From a realistic point of view I get your point and I also get the educational point.
Problem with the game mechanics is, that every illness we have in game can be cured. So I don't know if it is possible to add illnesses that can not be cured, from a gaming point of view.
On a personal note, I know people who lost their beloved cats to FIP. Not everyone wants to be triggered with that in a game. And while illnesses can be turned off in sandbox, it would still effect the other play modes.
By the way: I'm not a breeder, but have a pretty good knowledge of cats, as I was an administraor of a cat-breed specialized forum for a few years. There are a lot of illnesses people should be better educated. HCM is a problem in a lot of breeds (I know it's pretty rare with oriental cats, luckily) and almost no breeder in europe does ultrasounds to their breeding cats.
And most cats in zoos die of kidney failure not old age. You see. adding FIP and FIV would open up a huuuge range of other illnesses that should be added on a realistic POV. But I think we have to draw a line somewhere and PZ is drawing it at non-cureable illnesses, it seems.
EDIT: Okay, I just found out that FIP IS in game. Well, then... consider my post pointless for some parts.
Problem with the game mechanics is, that every illness we have in game can be cured. So I don't know if it is possible to add illnesses that can not be cured, from a gaming point of view.
On a personal note, I know people who lost their beloved cats to FIP. Not everyone wants to be triggered with that in a game. And while illnesses can be turned off in sandbox, it would still effect the other play modes.
By the way: I'm not a breeder, but have a pretty good knowledge of cats, as I was an administraor of a cat-breed specialized forum for a few years. There are a lot of illnesses people should be better educated. HCM is a problem in a lot of breeds (I know it's pretty rare with oriental cats, luckily) and almost no breeder in europe does ultrasounds to their breeding cats.
And most cats in zoos die of kidney failure not old age. You see. adding FIP and FIV would open up a huuuge range of other illnesses that should be added on a realistic POV. But I think we have to draw a line somewhere and PZ is drawing it at non-cureable illnesses, it seems.
EDIT: Okay, I just found out that FIP IS in game. Well, then... consider my post pointless for some parts.
The FIP has a current "cure" but it is a black market cure for those of us that live in the USA.. With that being said, If an animal gets this type of disease, the mechanics in the game should produce an effect like what you would see in RL. FIP is basically the mutation of the coronavirus. 95% of all cats have coronavirus. You can't just throw a virus into a game without the proper mechanics..
With FIV/FeLV, the animal can live with said illness but it is highly contagious. So the animal would have to be separated so that others of it's type don't get it.. it is more simple then even FIP.
I actually know all that 
Still, the game would need core mechanics to implement that. I believe that would be a lot of work. And given the kind of unrealistic implementation of contraception for every animal without any negative effects whatsoever, I don't think it will ever be implemented.
And in all honesty, zoos do not work like pet owners. I am pretty sure a lion that is FIV positive would be killed. Simply because it couldn't ever be used for breeding and as far as I know we have a overpopulation problem with lions in zoos.
It's again one of those things wihichs realism calls for more realism in the long run and would show in the end, that not everything in Zoos is perfect. And the planet franchise doesn't really go there, I'm afraid.
Still, the game would need core mechanics to implement that. I believe that would be a lot of work. And given the kind of unrealistic implementation of contraception for every animal without any negative effects whatsoever, I don't think it will ever be implemented.And in all honesty, zoos do not work like pet owners. I am pretty sure a lion that is FIV positive would be killed. Simply because it couldn't ever be used for breeding and as far as I know we have a overpopulation problem with lions in zoos.
It's again one of those things wihichs realism calls for more realism in the long run and would show in the end, that not everything in Zoos is perfect. And the planet franchise doesn't really go there, I'm afraid.
I actually know all that
And in all honesty, zoos do not work like pet owners. I am pretty sure a lion that is FIV positive would be killed. Simply because it couldn't ever be used for breeding and as far as I know we have a overpopulation problem with lions in zoos.
It's again one of those things whichs realism calls for more realism in the long run and would show in the end, that not everything in Zoos is perfect. And the planet franchise doesn't really go there, I'm afraid.
If they can do core mechanics for the other diseases, this is not different.. The only difference with this would be making it a permanent thing that if the cat effected gets into a fight, then the other animal will catch it. And then you also have to add in a permanent loop for the infected animal to have symptoms from time to time.. It isn't that difficult to do. Hell the mechanics for each species is different, even with some of their similarities.. So point is, adding different diseases or illnesses is the same trick.. and some of these illnesses are challenging.. If the world was a "simple place", you would think life was easier, but it wasn't..
Respectfully, there are hundreds of illnesses that can affect each species of animal, so it would be impossible for PZ to add every illness out there. I think they added enough diseases to make it interesting, but not too much that it makes the game less fun.