I recently stuck a G5 long range beam on my python and very nice it is too. However I've noticed that the Focussed mod seems to do pretty much the same as far as increasing the range, but also throws in a load of armour piercing too. Additionally, it has better downsides : a smaller DPS drop and no power or distributer penalties? So what am I missing here? It seems that Focused beats Long Range hands down.
Engineers Focused vs Long Range
- Thread starter DocPossible
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Long range gets rid of damage falloff, do you do your maximum damage all the way up to your maximum range. A focused laser with 6km of range will do full damage up to about 1km, and then decrease linearly with additional distance until it's doing about 10% max damage at 6km. With in mind, focused is the better choice for mid-range fighting, and long range is the best choice for, well, long range fighting.
It's a pain that Inara hasn't updated with the new blueprints yet 
I didn't pay much attention to focussed when I was at the engineer so didn't twig that it had changed. So Focussed still has a range increase, but the same damage falloff as normal. Hmm.
I didn't pay much attention to focussed when I was at the engineer so didn't twig that it had changed. So Focussed still has a range increase, but the same damage falloff as normal. Hmm.
so focused 5 adds 500m until damage falloff starts?
It just scales the falloff start range up equally. So range gets doubled 3km -> 6km, and falloff start gets doubled 500m -> 1000m.
Would be nice if this would show up in game. Currently it shows "damage falloff start 500" if i exchanged long range for focused.
Edit: Just noticed it shows in the weapon stats in outfitting, after the mod has been applied.
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After reading this I did a Grade 5 Long Range Large Beam (with regen sequence for friends)... Gotta say, Its pretty amazing being able to splat things with just that beam at 6km (or 5,915m to be precise).
As I run a Beam only FGS, being able to apply that damage on approach to target is fantastic... Once close enough, I let my other 6 guns let rip...
Looking forward to taking it out more.
Might grab a bunch of Focused Pulses out (instead of efficient beams). Being a slow fella, ships often zing away from me after all.....
As I run a Beam only FGS, being able to apply that damage on approach to target is fantastic... Once close enough, I let my other 6 guns let rip...
Looking forward to taking it out more.
Might grab a bunch of Focused Pulses out (instead of efficient beams). Being a slow fella, ships often zing away from me after all.....
the added armour penetration of focussed also only helps much with small/medium wepons.
a huge laser does all (or nearby all) its damage against all ships.
a large laser will win against the federal ships, the huge ships, python and FDL.
a medium laser will win nicely against anything bigger than an eagle/courier.
a huge laser does all (or nearby all) its damage against all ships.
a large laser will win against the federal ships, the huge ships, python and FDL.
a medium laser will win nicely against anything bigger than an eagle/courier.
Awww thats a shame... Focused bursts though... surely difference between them and beams with a grade 5 focused upgrade means with armour pen, a greater range and falloff your overall DPS should increase?
I guess I just like the idea of doing as much damage to my target before they can get to me
I guess I just like the idea of doing as much damage to my target before they can get to me
Awww thats a shame... Focused bursts though... surely difference between them and beams with a grade 5 focused upgrade means with armour pen, a greater range and falloff your overall DPS should increase?
I guess I just like the idea of doing as much damage to my target before they can get to me
If that's your objective, then long range (instead of focused) is your friend. The armour piercing only matters against hull, and most of the "opening damage" inflicted while your target is closing on you is going to be vs. shields. With that in mind, the full-damage-at-all-ranges offered by the long range mod will be the more effective choice.
I personally haven't rolled any of either lately, but I like Long Range conceptually for ships that want or needs to be able to deal damage from distance.
The Cutter is an example of a ship wants help dealing damage from distance because of the drift. I expect that a full Long Range (or low-falloff) array of weapons will make killing ships feel better, as in that ship it often feels like you're permanently 1.5-3km from your targets.
The iEagle would be an example of a ship that needs to be able to deal damage from distance in situations where it runs into ships bigger than it. It's a trivial matter to run away from a medium or large ship. But with Long Range, you can put 3km of distance between you and them and pelt them with impunity. Sure your small and medium hardpoints won't hurt much, but depending on the medium ship (Fed ships have very poor shields) you could certainly win a fight without ever being threatened. And being in something like an Eagle, it's very easy to feel threatened in this age of Engineers. That's pretty cool in concept.
Outside of those kinds of examples, however, I don't see much application for Long Range. Being that far away simply means it's easy for enemy ships to simply leave. You can't mass lock someone from 3km+ away, you know? And they certainly won't feel obligated to stay and waste their time. You get to be obnoxious, but that's really about it. Could be cute for RES farming and making sure you get a hit in on that target that the police are about to kill 5km away.
Focused seems good to me, especially since most ships have a bunch of small or medium hardpoints on them. More armor pen = punching above their class level. That's always good to have, especially if you're flying an all-laser (or mostly) configuration because you're otherwise losing a lot of damage to the hull.
The Cutter is an example of a ship wants help dealing damage from distance because of the drift. I expect that a full Long Range (or low-falloff) array of weapons will make killing ships feel better, as in that ship it often feels like you're permanently 1.5-3km from your targets.
The iEagle would be an example of a ship that needs to be able to deal damage from distance in situations where it runs into ships bigger than it. It's a trivial matter to run away from a medium or large ship. But with Long Range, you can put 3km of distance between you and them and pelt them with impunity. Sure your small and medium hardpoints won't hurt much, but depending on the medium ship (Fed ships have very poor shields) you could certainly win a fight without ever being threatened. And being in something like an Eagle, it's very easy to feel threatened in this age of Engineers. That's pretty cool in concept.
Outside of those kinds of examples, however, I don't see much application for Long Range. Being that far away simply means it's easy for enemy ships to simply leave. You can't mass lock someone from 3km+ away, you know? And they certainly won't feel obligated to stay and waste their time. You get to be obnoxious, but that's really about it. Could be cute for RES farming and making sure you get a hit in on that target that the police are about to kill 5km away.
Focused seems good to me, especially since most ships have a bunch of small or medium hardpoints on them. More armor pen = punching above their class level. That's always good to have, especially if you're flying an all-laser (or mostly) configuration because you're otherwise losing a lot of damage to the hull.
I personally haven't rolled any of either lately, but I like Long Range conceptually for ships that want or needs to be able to deal damage from distance.
The Cutter is an example of a ship wants help dealing damage from distance because of the drift. I expect that a full Long Range (or low-falloff) array of weapons will make killing ships feel better, as in that ship it often feels like you're permanently 1.5-3km from your targets.
The iEagle would be an example of a ship that needs to be able to deal damage from distance in situations where it runs into ships bigger than it. It's a trivial matter to run away from a medium or large ship. But with Long Range, you can put 3km of distance between you and them and pelt them with impunity. Sure your small and medium hardpoints won't hurt much, but depending on the medium ship (Fed ships have very poor shields) you could certainly win a fight without ever being threatened. And being in something like an Eagle, it's very easy to feel threatened in this age of Engineers. That's pretty cool in concept.
Outside of those kinds of examples, however, I don't see much application for Long Range. Being that far away simply means it's easy for enemy ships to simply leave. You can't mass lock someone from 3km+ away, you know? And they certainly won't feel obligated to stay and waste their time. You get to be obnoxious, but that's really about it. Could be cute for RES farming and making sure you get a hit in on that target that the police are about to kill 5km away.
Focused seems good to me, especially since most ships have a bunch of small or medium hardpoints on them. More armor pen = punching above their class level. That's always good to have, especially if you're flying an all-laser (or mostly) configuration because you're otherwise losing a lot of damage to the hull.
Too many targets lose lock for me to use Long Range. with my smaller ships and weapons, Focused seems the better choice for my ships. If you have a large craft, Long Range is probably the choice.
Yea maybe, but I haven't felt a need to have Long Range weapons on any of my big ships other than the Cutter. It's the only big ship that has trouble maneuvering. The Corvette and Conda turn on a dime, allowing them to stay relatively close to a target unless said target wants to get separation.
Long range hurts small ships due to increased mass since almost all of them have undersized thrusters compared to their mass except for the Vulture. Hence it mitigates their main advantage which is speed and agility.
The only small ship I use a long range mod on is the Courier and that's only a G1 on a PA to match projectile speed with the two medium fixed cannons I use on it.
G5 long range is great on a G5 long range laser/rail FAS I use as its thrusters can take the weight whilst it's still able to kite even with A grade sensors.
I also use G1 long range lasers/rails on the Cutter. Don't really see a use for focused at any grade on any ship, but that's probably only due to my personal preferences considering weapons.
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Hang on, so Grade 1 Long Range removes all damage dropoff from range? That makes it quite powerful compared to other low level modes.
Personally I think that's a bit overpowered. Should only extend the dropoff proportionally, doing 100% damage with hitscan lasers at 6km with fixed weapon perfect one degree gimbaling is a bit silly.
Personally I think that's a bit overpowered. Should only extend the dropoff proportionally, doing 100% damage with hitscan lasers at 6km with fixed weapon perfect one degree gimbaling is a bit silly.
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Yes it does - compared to massive heat increase without any penetration bonus for focused at grade one.
I agree, allthough it's 0.5° gimballing afaik. Still too much.
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For the longest time I tried to make a Fed Eagle build that would work by experimenting with heavy armor and short range weapons. The maneuverability, even while over loaded, is good enough to keep me on the butt of whatever I want, but fighting wings and CZs becomes problematic. It's starting to seem that a long range rails and light weight build with enhanced drives might be the best answer despite having 1/20th of the potential health pool.