Some folks have commented that my original post was a bit flowery. So I'm just editing it to add this section first to briefly cover the existing problems with the hired crew system. I'm keeping the original text below it.
1) NPC crew permadeath is a HUGE problem. Currently, there is absolutely no incentive to level up hired NPCs due to the fact that it not only takes a good deal of time, but all that progress is *instantly* lost, with no means of recovery, if your ship gets destroyed. This includes accidental deaths from getting cooked by stars, boosting inside a station, or accidentally clipping a security ship in a RES. This is the ONLY aspect of character or ship improvement in the game that can be permanently lost. Even passengers get escape pods, but crew do not. This is clearly broken. This makes it very dangerous to bring up highly trained pilots into RES sites, and flat out impossible for PVP as the chances of ship destruction are always quite high there.
2) Hired NPCs take a strong cut of your profits, regardless of whether it is trade, combat, or exploration ... *even when in port*. This makes no sense. At all. Contractors in our world don't currently get paid for not doing work, and it seems highly unlikely they would over a thousand years in the future.
Both of these issues means there is currently only one *viable* way of dealing with hired NPC pilots currently: Hire the top NPC you can find in port (typically Expert or Master), do some bounty hunting, and then immediately fire them before cashing in your bounties. There is absolutely no reason to keep crew on your roster, which is pretty much contrary to the intended spirit of the system. Forget getting attached to your crew as they WILL eventually die if you keep them on your ship. Or they could just sit in port taking an unreasonably large cut of your profits for nothing.
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Hi Frontier Devs,
I know you're very busy right now trying to get 2.2 ready in time for it's October release, which is why we haven't heard much from you as of late. But given this is an issue covering 2.2 and future major updates to come, this particular concern is a fairly grave one. And that is the idea that your hired NPC crew dies with your ship. Please allow me to explain.
Think of the Keelback and Federal Gunship as your proverbial 'pet classes'. I'm sure you're familiar with these in MMOs. We've all played them, including most of you. These are builds, whether in the form of ship or character class, that are balanced with the idea that they are supported by an NPC character/animal/demon/etc that compliment them, and are generally weak without them. Let's use World of Warcraft as an obvious example. In that game, there is a class called the Hunter. This class is designed to go out and find themselves a 'pet' that will fight alongside them, but that will also be raised and leveled by them, becoming increasingly strong over time. Players who play a Hunter become very proud of their pets. Some even get to talking to their pet and become very attached to them.
Now imagine playing a Hunter in World of Warcraft, at level 60 (vanilla WoW), and using a black lion you found when you were level 25 or so, having played him non stop for many months. And then you get killed when your party wipes from a bad instance pull. You come back to life. Your black lion does not.
Could you imagine the sheer overwhelming amount of rage involved? Several months of progression and shared game play ... lost in an instant.
Now imagine you're a Keelback pilot. You found an NPC pilot, let's call her Sarah, several months ago and she has been with you through thick and thin for all that time. She's Elite now, an excellent pilot. She has helped you take down many many ships and you love playing her and showing her off to your friends. And then one day, you accidentally hit boost inside a station instead of your landing gear, your Keelback plows into a wall and explodes.
You come back. Sarah does not. This NPC you trained since she was Mostly Harmless ... poof ... lost in an instant.
Rest assured ... many if not most players WILL grow very attached to their crew. And not just fighter pilots. I imagine with future expansions, more crew members may hit the Crew Lounge than merely rocket jockeys. Yet you're implying that in a massive ship, there is only a single escape pod, reserved for her captain, abandoning his or crew to the void. I'm all about immersion, guys ... even setting aside attachments or progress, the idea of leaving crewmen to die is ... cold. So cold.
At this point, knowing how easily this sense of progression would be lost, why would anyone take a chance at flying a 'pet class' at all? Those who do use fighter pilots will play *ultra cautiously*. Combat logging will increase *dramatically* when players get interdicted by a stronger ship that could wipe out their crew in an instant.
I know you're aware that players get extraordinarily miffed when their progression is lost. This is why we don't lose collected materials when we die. This is why we have insurance so that while there is a penalty for having your ship blow up, it's very small and you get to keep your ship afterwards instead of losing it and starting from scratch.
So why would your crew be any different? Why risk considerable rank progression with said crew members if you know that that progression can be wiped so so easily? Please, Frontier ... don't kill our crew! Absolutely impose some sort of penalties on them if your ship gets blown up. Perhaps they are held up in a station infirmary for a day or two so that you have to use your 'backup' pilots while they recuperate. Or maybe it adds to the ship insurance as they are upset and demand 'stress pay'. I'd even encourage slowing down their progression in combat rank. But that black lion deserved better than perma-death. And so does Sarah the elite pilot.
Regards,
Kaybe
1) NPC crew permadeath is a HUGE problem. Currently, there is absolutely no incentive to level up hired NPCs due to the fact that it not only takes a good deal of time, but all that progress is *instantly* lost, with no means of recovery, if your ship gets destroyed. This includes accidental deaths from getting cooked by stars, boosting inside a station, or accidentally clipping a security ship in a RES. This is the ONLY aspect of character or ship improvement in the game that can be permanently lost. Even passengers get escape pods, but crew do not. This is clearly broken. This makes it very dangerous to bring up highly trained pilots into RES sites, and flat out impossible for PVP as the chances of ship destruction are always quite high there.
2) Hired NPCs take a strong cut of your profits, regardless of whether it is trade, combat, or exploration ... *even when in port*. This makes no sense. At all. Contractors in our world don't currently get paid for not doing work, and it seems highly unlikely they would over a thousand years in the future.
Both of these issues means there is currently only one *viable* way of dealing with hired NPC pilots currently: Hire the top NPC you can find in port (typically Expert or Master), do some bounty hunting, and then immediately fire them before cashing in your bounties. There is absolutely no reason to keep crew on your roster, which is pretty much contrary to the intended spirit of the system. Forget getting attached to your crew as they WILL eventually die if you keep them on your ship. Or they could just sit in port taking an unreasonably large cut of your profits for nothing.
-----------------------------------------
Hi Frontier Devs,
I know you're very busy right now trying to get 2.2 ready in time for it's October release, which is why we haven't heard much from you as of late. But given this is an issue covering 2.2 and future major updates to come, this particular concern is a fairly grave one. And that is the idea that your hired NPC crew dies with your ship. Please allow me to explain.
Think of the Keelback and Federal Gunship as your proverbial 'pet classes'. I'm sure you're familiar with these in MMOs. We've all played them, including most of you. These are builds, whether in the form of ship or character class, that are balanced with the idea that they are supported by an NPC character/animal/demon/etc that compliment them, and are generally weak without them. Let's use World of Warcraft as an obvious example. In that game, there is a class called the Hunter. This class is designed to go out and find themselves a 'pet' that will fight alongside them, but that will also be raised and leveled by them, becoming increasingly strong over time. Players who play a Hunter become very proud of their pets. Some even get to talking to their pet and become very attached to them.
Now imagine playing a Hunter in World of Warcraft, at level 60 (vanilla WoW), and using a black lion you found when you were level 25 or so, having played him non stop for many months. And then you get killed when your party wipes from a bad instance pull. You come back to life. Your black lion does not.
Could you imagine the sheer overwhelming amount of rage involved? Several months of progression and shared game play ... lost in an instant.
Now imagine you're a Keelback pilot. You found an NPC pilot, let's call her Sarah, several months ago and she has been with you through thick and thin for all that time. She's Elite now, an excellent pilot. She has helped you take down many many ships and you love playing her and showing her off to your friends. And then one day, you accidentally hit boost inside a station instead of your landing gear, your Keelback plows into a wall and explodes.
You come back. Sarah does not. This NPC you trained since she was Mostly Harmless ... poof ... lost in an instant.
Rest assured ... many if not most players WILL grow very attached to their crew. And not just fighter pilots. I imagine with future expansions, more crew members may hit the Crew Lounge than merely rocket jockeys. Yet you're implying that in a massive ship, there is only a single escape pod, reserved for her captain, abandoning his or crew to the void. I'm all about immersion, guys ... even setting aside attachments or progress, the idea of leaving crewmen to die is ... cold. So cold.
At this point, knowing how easily this sense of progression would be lost, why would anyone take a chance at flying a 'pet class' at all? Those who do use fighter pilots will play *ultra cautiously*. Combat logging will increase *dramatically* when players get interdicted by a stronger ship that could wipe out their crew in an instant.
I know you're aware that players get extraordinarily miffed when their progression is lost. This is why we don't lose collected materials when we die. This is why we have insurance so that while there is a penalty for having your ship blow up, it's very small and you get to keep your ship afterwards instead of losing it and starting from scratch.
So why would your crew be any different? Why risk considerable rank progression with said crew members if you know that that progression can be wiped so so easily? Please, Frontier ... don't kill our crew! Absolutely impose some sort of penalties on them if your ship gets blown up. Perhaps they are held up in a station infirmary for a day or two so that you have to use your 'backup' pilots while they recuperate. Or maybe it adds to the ship insurance as they are upset and demand 'stress pay'. I'd even encourage slowing down their progression in combat rank. But that black lion deserved better than perma-death. And so does Sarah the elite pilot.
Regards,
Kaybe
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So we need to actually do some legwork to hunt them down again, if we get blown up. Sort of, "We're getting the band back together...", if we care enough to do so. If you never really liked them anyway, just hire some new NPC crew to shout at!
