G1 vs G5 Long-range Gimbal Lasers?

[sb413197]

I'm doing a special build in which I think having some long range gimbal lasers might be good. Does the jitter render a long range gimbal laser useless beyond the 3500 range, or can they reliably hit bigger ships still? I've never done a long range gimbal.

If so, when building long-range laser gimbals, it seems it would be better to visit Broo with 500 sulphur and crank that G1 mod for a good roll, rather than trying for G5s, since 3500 might be the edge of what works for long-range anyway if using a gimbal. I ask because I see gimbals missing a lot at 3000 against small ships due to their inherent jitter, and I have to think it would be even worse at 3500 - although I do seem to be able to hit the biggest ships.

 

[NascentChemist]

I would stick with G1 Long Range. The real benefit of the mod is removing damage falloff. Going for G1 leaves you with fewer downsides. It's also cheaper to keep rolling for a nice secondary, like decreased thermal load.

 

[Aashenfox]

I agree. Gimbals are of limited use beyond 2.5km anyway. You'll be hitting very big ships out to 3.5k, but that's about it.

 

[Frenotx]

If it's a medium or small laser and your ship can take some extra heat, you may want to also consider G5 focussed for gimballed lasers. The damage falloff gets pushed out to 1km, which means you'll still be doing close to full damage at the ranges a gimballed weapon will actually hit at. Once the shield is down, the elevated armour piercing stat will make a significant difference is how much damage you do to larger hulls.

 

[Threeofseven]

Anything over g2 is almost useless for a laser mod because of the jitter unless it's against a very large ship. Go fixed if at all possible as you get full damage up to 6km with G5 mod.

I tried G5 LR gimbled on my Clipper. Practically useless.

 

[aardappelianen]

i think G5 rolls are good for beam laser because they fire continuesly and so they wil hit the target at 5k+ with most "swings" whereas bursts and pulse might repeatedly place the shots next to a target.

i use 5 beam turrets in a CZ set to fire at will so that when i get that powerball rolling i get the bounties for more kills than if i where hunting them down 0ne by one with all weapons focused on 1 target

 

[Han_Zen]

I'm doing a special build in which I think having some long range gimbal lasers might be good. Does the jitter render a long range gimbal laser useless beyond the 3500 range, or can they reliably hit bigger ships still? I've never done a long range gimbal.

If so, when building long-range laser gimbals, it seems it would be better to visit Broo with 500 sulphur and crank that G1 mod for a good roll, rather than trying for G5s, since 3500 might be the edge of what works for long-range anyway if using a gimbal. I ask because I see gimbals missing a lot at 3000 against small ships due to their inherent jitter, and I have to think it would be even worse at 3500 - although I do seem to be able to hit the biggest ships.

If you want to fight at very long range (4500-5500m), my experience is that you should have one of the lasers(smalest) with Emissive effect. It will improve tracking.

You could also consider fixed. The micro-gimbal gets quite significant at long ranges and helps a lot. This is a very safe setup for CZ farming. You can pick of enemies all day, without even getting shot at. Feels almost like an exploit.

 

[Aashenfox]

i think G5 rolls are good for beam laser because they fire continuesly and so they wil hit the target at 5k+ with most "swings" whereas bursts and pulse might repeatedly place the shots next to a target.

i use 5 beam turrets in a CZ set to fire at will so that when i get that powerball rolling i get the bounties for more kills than if i where hunting them down 0ne by one with all weapons focused on 1 target

Well...

Yes, G5 is a better mod, obviously, HOWEVER...

1) You really aren't hitting much with gimbals after 3km, honestly. And G1 gives you 3.5km in 5 rolls max.
2) The negatives of G5 are MUCH heavier than the negatives of G1 (increased mass and power draw), for very little extra benefit. G1 long range has NO bad side effects if you're lucky.
3) If you need a particular bonus for your build, you might need to make a lot more rolls to get it (e.g. heat reduction), and the mats for G5 include a 'mission only' material AND cracked industrial firmware (something that you should save for Dirty Drive rolls and long range PAs), so making 50 rolls for an epic heat reduction bonus really isn't feasible, but G1 costs only 1 sulphur, something you can farm 100 of in half an hour, and still get a good heat bonus from G1 roll.

As a general rule, for gimballed lasers (and railguns) you want G1 long range rolled as many times as you need to get the bonus of your choice. For fixed weapons, use any grade that suits your aiming ability, but still probably not G5, cos there ain't NO WAY you're hitting even a cutter 'reliably' at 6k with a fixed beam and you still have those negatives for little tangible benefit. Then there's all the Projectiles (MCs, cannons, PAs, but not railguns or frag cannons) which change the dynamic, because long range increases the projectile speed dramatically, which especially in the case of PAs, allows you to hit your target MUCH more reliably. This is of limited value to MCs as they already have fast projectiles.

So basically, save your G5 long range rolls for PAs and roll everything else G1 for cheaper mats, easier bonuses and less side effects.

 

[M. Grey]

Agreed!
Had same thoughts some time ago. Using G3 on long range weapons (cannons, rail and lasers).
For lasers and PAs focused G5 is very good, as some mentioned.

 

[aardappelianen]

Yeh that's al true aashenfox, however the power draw can be negated with secondaries otherwise i wouldn't be able to run those 5 beams also all my beams have reduced thermal load as a secondary
And while you not be hitting "much" after 3.5k being able to tag that viper before it pops or simply drawing its agro is a great benefit to those who are in a CZ for the money

 

[Aashenfox]

Agreed!
Had same thoughts some time ago. Using G3 on long range weapons (cannons, rail and lasers).
For lasers and PAs focused G5 is very good, as some mentioned.

Focused PAs are a cheap man's long range, as they reduce rate of fire, increase heat and mass for only the benefit of projectile velocity. Because PAs already have an armor pen value which exceeds the armor rating of any ship in the game with any kind of armor, the increased armor pen rating is literally worthless, an oversight by FD probably.

It IS a good alternative to long range for experimenting though, so you don't waste those very rare mats, jus tto get a feeling of how the muzzle velocity changes, but, if you like it, you should go and roll long range later, less drawbacks, same benefits.

 

[Aashenfox]

Yeh that's al true aashenfox, however the power draw can be negated with secondaries otherwise i wouldn't be able to run those 5 beams also all my beams have reduced thermal load as a secondary
And while you not be hitting "much" after 3.5k being able to tag that viper before it pops or simply drawing its agro is great benefit to those who are in a CZ for the money

Yep, I do the same thing with my 2 G5 long range small beams on my gunship, and I have them long range in the SMALL slots for exactly that reason (the power draw and heat are negligible in a medium ship and they are GREAT for tagging stuff), BUT, in a medium or large slot though, no way. Too many drawbacks, too many rare materials just for that one benefit, there will always be another wave in the CZ.

 

[StiTch]

In essence, G1 will allow you to roll a satisfactory falloff blitzing modification. As you mention, because of the practically nonexistent roll cost, you can play casino to your heart's desire until you get what you want.

G5 is the better modification if you can handle the offsets: not only are you removing falloff but gaining reasonable range as well. This is only really valid on fixed weapons to start with; if you're hitting something with gimbals from 6k, you...aren't actually hitting them.

But the other crowning point of G5 long ranged is the secondary effects. Higher grade mod, stronger secondary effects. You can roll G1 all day but if your desired secondary effect is lower distributor draw, you will only get around a -18% draw without harming the DPS too. Grade 5, people have mentioned around -50% draw on a disgustingly lucky roll. Of course, this becomes redundant if you can roll only a couple of times, as you won't be getting the secondary you want anyway unless you've been brown nosing RNGesus recently.

TL;DR if you're basically trying to mitigate a laser's godawful falloff start, reroll G1 long ranged until you have the mod you want (or take Frenotx's advice and use focused to mix up falloff mitigation with big ship slayability). If you actually want to fight at long range with fixed weaponry, or you're leaking relevant materials out of every crevice and want to tailor a high stat weapon, use G5 long range.