Griefing is a valid way to play

Dr Roly · Jan 23, 2015

... but if you want to play the role of a sociopathic killer, the in-game authorities should treat you as such. For example:
- A 'kill on sight' order issued to all stations
- More prolific serial killers get increasingly heavy hostile NPC "kill teams" interdicting them or jumping to their location
- The most prolific of all get a mention in Galnet news
- Anarchy systems are the only places that offer refuge

I'm not taking about a meta-game hatred of griefers, or introducing gameplay mechanics to artificially stop griefing. I'm saying give grief play some validity. Let them play how they want, but beware the consequences. Some grief players may even like getting some in-game notoriety.

Quineloe · Jan 23, 2015

[h=2]Griefing is a valid way to play

[/h]
Doesn't it strike you as odd that you have to repeat this over, and over again? When does this become Dogma instead of just an opinion?

AlexRyder · Jan 23, 2015

Dr Roly said:
... but if you want to play the role of a sociopathic killer, the in-game authorities should treat you as such. For example:
- A 'kill on sight' order issued to all stations
- More prolific serial killers get increasingly heavy hostile NPC "kill teams" interdicting them or jumping to their location
- The most prolific of all get a mention in Galnet new
- Anarchy systems are the only places that offer refuge

I'm not taking about a meta-game hatred of griefers, or introducing gameplay mechanics to artificially stop griefing. I'm saying give grief play some validity. Let them play how they want, but beware the consequences. Some grief players may even like getting some in-game notoriety.

If you are truly "griefing" it can't be valid play because it would already be a mechanic people have agreed to by logging in.

paxx · Jan 23, 2015

That's why I play solo/friend groups.

{SAS}Stalker · Jan 23, 2015

It depends entirely on how you define griefing but there is NO place in a game for exploting game mechanics to ruin the experience of others, none! If you accept that "anything goes" then you have also got to accept that "victims" can disco, one is no more valid than the other.

Andovar · Jan 23, 2015

I agree with the OP except for one thing, stop calling killing griefing.
Really wish you would have left the G-word out of your post. You've kinda hamstringed your argument.

Frenotx · Jan 23, 2015

While I don't necessarily agree with you that griefing is a "valid" way to play, I will certainly assert that it is an inevitability. Having the game set up to deal with griefers and incorporate them into the game world (as you suggested) is probably a good idea.

Lanatir · Jan 23, 2015

Murderers need to have insurance removed or set to 100%. Griefing will never happen again.

WalterHWhite · Jan 23, 2015

It's just a word that seemingly has lost its meaning in a wider gaming community.

For some griefing = "doing something I don't like"

That is where half the grief comes from

N6MAA10816 · Jan 23, 2015

Dr Roly said:
... but if you want to play the role of a sociopathic killer, the in-game authorities should treat you as such. For example:
- A 'kill on sight' order issued to all stations
- More prolific serial killers get increasingly heavy hostile NPC "kill teams" interdicting them or jumping to their location
- The most prolific of all get a mention in Galnet news
- Anarchy systems are the only places that offer refuge

I'm not taking about a meta-game hatred of griefers, or introducing gameplay mechanics to artificially stop griefing. I'm saying give grief play some validity. Let them play how they want, but beware the consequences. Some grief players may even like getting some in-game notoriety.

Might you not want to d/l 'Elite:Hannibal V1.1 ?

Rivka · Jan 23, 2015

I'm really iffy about the definitions some people use for "griefing". I've always defined it as the unintended use of gameplay mechanics and/or exploits used solely to annoy another person. Getting shot up in an open PvP world isn't griefing, as it's intended play by the developers.

Now, using the "logoffski", I'd see that as a form of griefing. Getting you and your buddies to intentionally use up all the docking spots in a busy station, griefing. Figuring out a way to block the mailslot without getting blown up...yeah, that's griefing. Following someone around to spew insults....yah, that's the "G" word again.

Getting shot for "no reason" in Open, that's not griefing. Frontier has said quite a few times, there's space for psychopaths who just want to see the world burn here. If Frontier wanted to implement a consensual PVP only system, they have PLENTY of different models to pick and choose from. They decided on a generally open PvP world, tho.

Frenotx · Jan 23, 2015

Lanatir said:
Murderers need to have insurance removed or set to 100%. Griefing will never happen again.

That would dramatically increase the risk involved with perfectly legitimate PvE assassination missions. Occasionally your target will be clean, in lawful space. If you attack and kill the target (the only way to complete the mission), you will have a murder bounty placed on your head.

Dr Roly · Jan 23, 2015

Andovar said:
I agree with the OP except for one thing, stop calling killing griefing.
Really wish you would have left the G-word out of your post. You've kinda hamstringed your argument.

OK, I see your point. Maybe I should have said "senseless killing" instead of griefing.

Protoplasmic traveler · Jan 23, 2015

I love Griefers and have no problem with them at all. They can come looking for me and I am not even bothered that I carry no weapons or no shields because I love them and they do not concern me in the slightest

... dedicated solo player with a VERY healthy credit balance

xslam · Jan 23, 2015

How about ingame terrorists organisation with terrorists wich earn money from them?

pdizzle · Jan 23, 2015

Lanatir said:
Murderers need to have insurance removed or set to 100%. Griefing will never happen again.

Sadly, that's wishful thinking. No reason PvP will always be a part of games. When you know no one is actually harmed, it makes shooting at strangers a lot easier.

Commander Edison · Jan 23, 2015

Harsher consequences for naughtiness are a must.

In Elite, if you managed to upset the five-oh enough you were kippered, unless you were already milspecced up to the nines.

I'd like to see the police in hot pursuit, and maybe some way of flagging known criminals in system while you're in SC. Maybe not for the lesser crimes, but once you've started popping haulers left right and centre, you should expect to get hounded out of the system.

Then you can start to make anarchy systems the hives of scum and villany that they should be.

Britannkic · Jan 23, 2015

What is 'Griefing' in E: D terms other than a description of another type of gameplay?

i know it is term used across all games, but as far as I care, Griefing is just another so called profession, up there with Explorer, Pirate, Smuggler. Trader, Bounty Hunter and Miner

Any number of threads, rants and over emotive opinion isnt going to change the fact that should a player choose, they can be a Griefer.

i say this as a victim of the Griefer but not yet have I put on the grubby leather gloves of the psychopathic murderous Griefer

Andovar · Jan 23, 2015

Dr Roly said:
OK, I see your point. Maybe I should have said "senseless killing" instead of griefing.

Yeah, because that's basically what it is, and FD has said they support that playstyle.
But your ideas make a lot of sense. Especially from a lore/story standpoint (being a murderer should have some serious consequences). Yes, it would make that style of play much more difficult, but I'd imagine many of those that play that way would probably welcome the additional challenge.

On the flip side, using the G-word in your title will likely generate a lot more hits here on the forum!

TerrorTrooper · Jan 23, 2015

Lanatir said:
Murderers need to have insurance removed or set to 100%. Griefing will never happen again.

What a load of rubbish!

Although I am a firm believer that murder penalties need to be higher.

Apart from the rare occasions that people abuse game mechanics. (Like the point defence in a station method of getting someone killed.) I am yet to see any "griefing" at all in elite.
People need to get their definitions of what griefing actually is correct.

People like the idea of jumping into an open, free to do what you will type sandbox, but don't like it when someone else does something they don't like.