General Here's how to fix Fleet Carriers....

You probably didn't even realise that they were broken but, having owned one for almost 48 hours, I'm here to tell you what needs changing.

First, let's talk about SLF pilots.
Why don't I just hire an SLF pilot prior to a combat mission and then fire their butt immediately afterwards?
Well, there's two reasons.

Firstly, on an objective level, the newbie SLF pilots suck.
I hire one, train them up and they become more useful than the "rentals" so they're worth keeping.

Secondly, more subjectively, video game players develop something of a sentimental bond with useful NPC characters.
Emmalina and I have been through a lot together and she's got me out of some tough situations. She's worth keeping around.


Now let's talk about ships.
Why don't I just buy a Cutter, use it to complete a bunch of missions and then get rid of it?
Oddly enough, it's for the same two reasons.

Firstly, standard ships suck.
We can't train them like we train an SLF pilot but we do have engineering, which allows us to improve a ship and tailor it to our requirements.

Secondly, there's the sentimental bond we create with ships that we've made the effort to modify, which serve us especially well, and we don't want to get rid of them because we know they get the job done.
Also, kind of related to both the above points, we logically know that if we get rid of a useful ship, we're going to have to make the effort to build something similar the next time we need it so we might as well keep what we've got.


So, what's this got to do with FC's?

I seems, to me, that FC's don't do a lot to tick either of those boxes.
There's nothing uniquely useful about any FC that you buy and there's nothing especially unique about them which might provoke that sentimental bond.
And they're going to cost you a heap of credits, each week, to hang onto.

Going back to SLF pilots for a minute, I guess it's worth noting that they do cost you credits too.
The difference is, they do provide an elevated level of usefulness in return for a player being willing to pay the required price.
A player gets to decide whether it's worth paying 10% of their earnings to keep an Elite SLF pilot available instead of hiring a muppet.

That's the problem with FC's, IMO.
I buy one, it costs me Cr10m per week (or whatever) to keep hold of it and it offers no benefit over an FC that I might buy tomorrow.
So, what's my motivation to keep it rather than selling it and then buying another one when I need to?

There needs to be something to motivate me to hang onto an FC, despite the fact that it's a continual financial burden.

So, here's a couple of suggestions, of increasing levels of outrageousness. :eek:

Firstly, the FC crew need to get better at their jobs the longer you hold onto them.
Veteran bridge crew should be able to squeeze more mileage out of a tank of fuel so, for example, fuel usage drops by up to 20% and/or an FC gains a longer jump range.
Maybe the guy running your Commodity market can only handle basic items until he's suitably experienced, at which time the range of available Commodities increases.
Similar thing for the Shipyard and Repair personnel; they start off only being able to handle basic stuff but as they improve they can do more and do it cheaper.
How about a Navigator who can reduce FSD spool-up and cool-down times as he gains experience or an Astronomer who pays more for Explo' data?

And now for a couple of big ones.

There are occupied escape pods floating around in Wreckage POIs, as well as other places.
How about if there was, say, a 1% chance that those escape pods carry a Mat' Trader who, if you own an FC, will be willing to set up shop aboard your FC?
At best, maybe you could find an escape pod with (gasp!) a trainee engineer in it who, again, would be willing to come and work for you, applying mod's and experimental effects, if you own an FC?

Maybe there could be other ways to find especially useful crewmembers too?
You do stuff (run missions, win wars, blow poop up, become allied with factions etc) and, as a result, there's the chance to hire more qualified personnel for your FC.
You might get a mechanic who can improve the way your FC runs, a Gunner who can improve the effectiveness of the weapons or more useful replacements for your existing crew.

Basically, you'd start off with your crew of deadbeats and muppets.
They'd gradually improve or you could swap them for more experienced personnel you find along the way.
And, as well as that, there'd be the unique characters (mat traders and apprentice engineers etc) who you might pick up too.

As a result of this you'd end up with a uniquely effective FC and you'd be deterred from simply selling it and then buying another one when you need it.
Now there's a good REASON to keep paying that CR10m per week.
 
There are occupied escape pods floating around in Wreckage POIs, as well as other places.
How about if there was, say, a 1% chance that those escape pods carry a Mat' Trader who, if you own an FC, will be willing to set up shop aboard your FC?
At best, maybe you could find an escape pod with (gasp!) a trainee engineer in it who, again, would be willing to come and work for you, applying mod's and experimental effects, if you own an FC?

Maybe there could be other ways to find especially useful crewmembers too?
You do stuff (run missions, win wars, blow poop up, become allied with factions etc) and, as a result, there's the chance to hire more qualified personnel for your FC.
You might get a mechanic who can improve the way your FC runs, a Gunner who can improve the effectiveness of the weapons or more useful replacements for your existing crew.

Basically, you'd start off with your crew of deadbeats and muppets.
They'd gradually improve or you could swap them for more experienced personnel you find along the way.
And, as well as that, there'd be the unique characters (mat traders and apprentice engineers etc) who you might pick up too.

As a result of this you'd end up with a uniquely effective FC and you'd be deterred from simply selling it and then buying another one when you need it.
Now there's a good REASON to keep paying that CR10m per week.
Personally, I'd prefer most of those suggestions exist for the rest of the game first.

Rescue an escape pod, x% chance of it being someone who can modify your ship or a module in addition to engineering effects.

Or rescue a trader who rewards you with 20 G5s of your choice.

Getting allied with factions should result in access to tier 2 and 3 NPCs whose interactions with you give a damn about, kinda like governors (and their daughters) in Pirates!

There's no reason these sorts of interactions should exist exclusively for FCs, and why I've been a broken record about FCs and now Odyssey, saying "flesh out the game before bothering with these 'features'". The introduction of legs or FCs simply cannot fix these fundamental shortfalls with the game, and will always suffer for it.
 
Personally, I'd prefer most of those suggestions exist for the rest of the game first.

Rescue an escape pod, x% chance of it being someone who can modify your ship or a module in addition to engineering effects.

Or rescue a trader who rewards you with 20 G5s of your choice.

Getting allied with factions should result in access to tier 2 and 3 NPCs whose interactions with you give a damn about, kinda like governors (and their daughters) in Pirates!

There's no reason these sorts of interactions should exist exclusively for FCs, and why I've been a broken record about FCs and now Odyssey, saying "flesh out the game before bothering with these 'features'". The introduction of legs or FCs simply cannot fix these fundamental shortfalls with the game, and will always suffer for it.

Fair comment.

I have already suggested most of this stuff before, for other aspects of the game.
It just occured to me that it'd be especially useful with regard to FC's cos I can't see anything about them to encourage a player to retain one.

Baby step, and all that. ;)
 
You probably didn't even realise that they were broken but, having owned one for almost 48 hours, I'm here to tell you what needs changing.

First, let's talk about SLF pilots.
Why don't I just hire an SLF pilot prior to a combat mission and then fire their butt immediately afterwards?
Well, there's two reasons.

Firstly, on an objective level, the newbie SLF pilots suck.
I hire one, train them up and they become more useful than the "rentals" so they're worth keeping.

Secondly, more subjectively, video game players develop something of a sentimental bond with useful NPC characters.
Emmalina and I have been through a lot together and she's got me out of some tough situations. She's worth keeping around.


Now let's talk about ships.
Why don't I just buy a Cutter, use it to complete a bunch of missions and then get rid of it?
Oddly enough, it's for the same two reasons.

Firstly, standard ships suck.
We can't train them like we train an SLF pilot but we do have engineering, which allows us to improve a ship and tailor it to our requirements.

Secondly, there's the sentimental bond we create with ships that we've made the effort to modify, which serve us especially well, and we don't want to get rid of them because we know they get the job done.
Also, kind of related to both the above points, we logically know that if we get rid of a useful ship, we're going to have to make the effort to build something similar the next time we need it so we might as well keep what we've got.


So, what's this got to do with FC's?

I seems, to me, that FC's don't do a lot to tick either of those boxes.
There's nothing uniquely useful about any FC that you buy and there's nothing especially unique about them which might provoke that sentimental bond.
And they're going to cost you a heap of credits, each week, to hang onto.

Going back to SLF pilots for a minute, I guess it's worth noting that they do cost you credits too.
The difference is, they do provide an elevated level of usefulness in return for a player being willing to pay the required price.
A player gets to decide whether it's worth paying 10% of their earnings to keep an Elite SLF pilot available instead of hiring a muppet.

That's the problem with FC's, IMO.
I buy one, it costs me Cr10m per week (or whatever) to keep hold of it and it offers no benefit over an FC that I might buy tomorrow.
So, what's my motivation to keep it rather than selling it and then buying another one when I need to?

There needs to be something to motivate me to hang onto an FC, despite the fact that it's a continual financial burden.

So, here's a couple of suggestions, of increasing levels of outrageousness. :eek:

Firstly, the FC crew need to get better at their jobs the longer you hold onto them.
Veteran bridge crew should be able to squeeze more mileage out of a tank of fuel so, for example, fuel usage drops by up to 20% and/or an FC gains a longer jump range.
Maybe the guy running your Commodity market can only handle basic items until he's suitably experienced, at which time the range of available Commodities increases.
Similar thing for the Shipyard and Repair personnel; they start off only being able to handle basic stuff but as they improve they can do more and do it cheaper.
How about a Navigator who can reduce FSD spool-up and cool-down times as he gains experience or an Astronomer who pays more for Explo' data?

And now for a couple of big ones.

There are occupied escape pods floating around in Wreckage POIs, as well as other places.
How about if there was, say, a 1% chance that those escape pods carry a Mat' Trader who, if you own an FC, will be willing to set up shop aboard your FC?
At best, maybe you could find an escape pod with (gasp!) a trainee engineer in it who, again, would be willing to come and work for you, applying mod's and experimental effects, if you own an FC?

Maybe there could be other ways to find especially useful crewmembers too?
You do stuff (run missions, win wars, blow poop up, become allied with factions etc) and, as a result, there's the chance to hire more qualified personnel for your FC.
You might get a mechanic who can improve the way your FC runs, a Gunner who can improve the effectiveness of the weapons or more useful replacements for your existing crew.

Basically, you'd start off with your crew of deadbeats and muppets.
They'd gradually improve or you could swap them for more experienced personnel you find along the way.
And, as well as that, there'd be the unique characters (mat traders and apprentice engineers etc) who you might pick up too.

As a result of this you'd end up with a uniquely effective FC and you'd be deterred from simply selling it and then buying another one when you need it.
Now there's a good REASON to keep paying that CR10m per week.

yeah, either that or ignore them.

i can say that ignoring them works quite well, no issues whatsoever (except a slight overall increase in network failures)
 
Basically, you'd start off with your crew of deadbeats and muppets.
They'd gradually improve or you could swap them for more experienced personnel you find along the way.
And, as well as that, there'd be the unique characters (mat traders and apprentice engineers etc) who you might pick up too.

As a result of this you'd end up with a uniquely effective FC and you'd be deterred from simply selling it and then buying another one when you need it.
Now there's a good REASON to keep paying that CR10m per week.

Agree 200% 👌

firefly-cast-reuniting-for-firefly-online-heres-what-they-look-like-now-0-jpeg.png
 
Yeah, sorry. Gotta spend more time making empty multiplayer mechanics first. If it wasn't for people like me the FC would still be a squad asset.
 

Deleted member 38366

D
I think what you're asking for is fairly close to.... Carrier Engineering ;)

(more realistic, since the mechanics already exist - I wouldn't mind leveling up the Crew though, that could compliment an Engineered Carrier just fine)
 
There are issues with new stuff in ED such as Fleet Carriers.

1. How do they work and what can I do with them in my game play style.
2. How did Frontier Devs nerf my ability to use them in my game play styl
3. What do I need to do to change my game play style to make them profitable?

Fleet Carriers are not about trading in a Cutter from A-B-C then back to A making a profit. They require interaction with other players providing their needs at the right moment in the right system to make profits. This is advanced trading with live players and I suspect that the Devs designed it this way. Many players have already figured this out. Your turn.

Worse case I load up Meta Alloys and Thargoid heats in the bubble with ridiculous prices and some player will eventually buy them. Best case providing what live players need at the moment at a decent price will make millions. NPCs don't care. You do the advanced game play flying a carrier if you want to make a profit. Simple Cutter profits is easy. Carriers take more work.

But if you are not into profits hauling all your engineered ships across the galaxy that works as well. To each their own play style.

Segue

Yes, I'll never forgive Josh Weldon for killing the Wash and Shepherd Book characters in the movie 'Serenity". Back then I could send an email to Josh and he got it. I guess he decided per Hollywood end the TV series Firefly and move on. I haven't seen anything he made since then.

Regards
 
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