Hip 98621: a story of betrayal, perseverance, and standing up for what is right.

[RobWolves]

They did steal the system and all BGS is role play to an extent.

No they didn't. You said 13th failed to expand in there. So they never had a presence there, never owned an asset there and never controlled there. I fail to see any facts in there that give 13th any right to the system for it to have been stolen from them.

If you are claiming roleplay, then all the minor faction in the disputed system may have something to say about a non-present factions claim the system was stolen from them. Don't be selective with your roleplay to suit your needs. NPC's have feelings too!

However, BGS is only roleplay if those playing it choose to roleplay. Not everyone does.

 

[Darty]

Actually, Justinian Octavius said the same above: "13th Legion's leadership were asked if Ghost Legion could take the HIP 98621 system and said yes."
This occurred sometime back, before ThePaveHawker's own effort to manipulate the BGS mechanics. As he noted, "They then changed their minds. It is not Ghost Legion's fault 13th Legion didn't bother to look up who the faction was."
The Ghost Legion's efforts were already well underway when ThePaveHawker made his group's push for a spot in the system. It seems too obvious that it was because of his intent to get the 13th into the system that the 13th's leadership reneged on its earlier agreement with Ghost Legion.
You can't arbitrarily call "bull" on something that comes from multiple sources nor simply because it's the first you've heard of it. As I noted above, I frequent ThePaveHawker's stream. I did not during any of those many instances note any awareness on his part about other PMF's operating in the system. Yet, the leadership of multiple groups with Imperial affiliation (including 13th Legion) signed off on the effort of Ghost Legion to hold away in the system.
As Justinian noted, 13th leadership removed their support for Ghost Legion's effort at some point. This suggests they were aware of ThePaveHawker's efforts and elected to support him. That they evidently failed to notify him of Ghost Legion's efforts in the system is on their shoulders. Now, I don't know with any surety that 13th leadership made their intentions apparent to Ghost Legion leadership. If they did, they did so poorly as they didnt dissuade Ghost Legion from continuing their efforts. If they didn't, then, again, the outcome and the current situation is on them.

The 13th opened the spot in the first place so by definition we were working on it longer.

 

[Darty]

No they didn't. You said 13th failed to expand in there. So they never had a presence there, never owned an asset there and never controlled there. I fail to see any facts in there that give 13th any right to the system for it to have been stolen from them.

If you are claiming roleplay, then all the minor faction in the disputed system may have something to say about a non-present factions claim the system was stolen from them. Don't be selective with your roleplay to suit your needs. NPC's have feelings too!

However, BGS is only roleplay if those playing it choose to roleplay. Not everyone does.

We. Opened. The. System.

 

[Martind Forlon]

... for deletion

 

[Diettinger]

The 13th opened the spot in the first place so by definition we were working on it longer.

With a pop over 8 billion it is highly unlikely that ThePaveHawker and his group could have moved the numbers in the short amount of time that transpired between his taking an active part in manipulating the BGS and the NPC faction getting expelled. It would have required a much larger effort from a larger group of players than he had working with him.

If you have direct access to the hard data that can prove, beyond a shadow of a doubt, that ThePaveHawker's efforts were the brunt of the push and ultimately the reason for the NPC faction's expulsion, then you can make a valid claim to "stealing" the system. Until then, it is a matter of conjecture and a fruitless one at that.

In the big scheme of things, especially from a "roleplaying" standpoint, it was a competitive bid for access to the system. ThePaveHawker is angry because: a) he was unaware of Ghost Legion's interest in the system, b) when querying other player group representatives, he was given vague, misleading, or speculative rationales for his failure, and c) he simply "feels" he is owed the system due to his efforts. As others have noted previously, many player groups have worked the BGS only to see their efforts dashed, failed, or otherwise seemingly ignored by the BGS mechanics. Everytime FDev has put out an update those groups that focus almost exclusively on the BGS have collectively held their breath to see what type of guano they are going to have to slog through to reestablish their previous systems' status and BGS efforts. Because of that I completely empathize with his frustration. I believe, however, that he is going about rectifying it in a wholly unhealthy and ultimately destructive fashion.

 

[RobWolves]

We. Opened. The. System.

Yes, you keep saying. However, you failed to expand in by your own words and the 13th never had any presence in the system. Nothing in this system was the 13th's to be stolen to begin with, so you can keep saying it was stolen us much as like you, but you can't argue the facts.

 

[Rebel Yell]

Wow... I look at the wars in my backyard and they seem so tiny compared to this one!!!

 

[Ozric]

I think this has gone as far as it needs to. Please remember that we encourage rp on the forums, but was clearly not the intent nor the outcome.