HOTAS and Joystick Curves Question / Problem

[Camisade]

I've been flying with HOTAS (Thrustmaster Warthog) for a few months and have been having a hard time advancing from gimbaled to fixed weapons. Yesterday I heard about Joystick Curves and can see how it would make a huge difference in smoothing out the joystick inputs enough to improve ToT. "Eureka!" I cried, envisioning my first Thargoid solo kill (sadly, I'm 0-9 at this point).

But, weirdly, while the "roll" axis configures just fine (using the virtual test loop to make sure Elite Dangerous picks up the vJoy driver, not the physical stick input), when I bind the vJoy pitch, my in-game pitch is NOT inverted, even though the game config screen indicates it is. In the Joystick Curves application, the virtual stick input mirrors the physical stick as it should, but seems to be getting reversed inside Elite Dangerous.

Has anyone else experienced this, and gotten it to work normally? I'd think a quick work-around would be to just set the pitch to regular instead of inverted, but even though I "apply" that change, it keeps reverting to inverted, like it won't save the change to the .bind file...

 

[Deep Thought 42]

You should have a look at this thread https://forums.frontier.co.uk/showt...Warthog-Script?highlight=Thrustmaster+Warthog
i think it has some nice Curves

 

[Camisade]

Bah! Disregard -- I was doing my joystick testing in the "training" area. Once I went into live play, everything worked as it should. I think I saw a bug report about that somewhere. So, disregard. (Or, moderators, you can delete this thread).

EDIT: Disregard delete request -- this thread may have some value left in it!

 

[GunnerBill]

That's pretty odd. I've used vJoy on both the HOTAS-X and the T16000 equipment with no problems.

At the moment I only have vJoy active on the twist yaw, just to dampen it a little.

I was going to say that as far as fixed weapons goes I have always found it to be the YAW that's the biggest problem (too twitchy on smaller ships)... but you don't have yaw on the stick!

I'm guessing you've simply tried restarting the game etc?

You may also have to wipe your binds (BACKUP FIRST) and let the game rebuild it??? I'm also remembering a similar issue (persistent binding error) but cannot remember the reason/fix yet!

----------------------

Also not related to your vJoy issue but you may be better off practicing fixed on Long Range weapons first and using the built in "snap-to" of the weapon when it's targeting a module to help you.

 

[Camisade]

I was going to say that as far as fixed weapons goes I have always found it to be the YAW that's the biggest problem (too twitchy on smaller ships)... but you don't have yaw on the stick!

Actually, as I continue my tweaking, I'm finding I *love* the roll/pitch curves. But I can't seem to get Joystick Curves to pick up the inputs from my rudder pedals so i can dampen those a bit, too. :sigh:

Back to fiddling to try to figure out why not.

 

[Camisade]

You should have a look at this thread https://forums.frontier.co.uk/showt...Warthog-Script?highlight=Thrustmaster+Warthog
i think it has some nice Curves

Wow -- the amount of effort and customization in that setup is amazing. ...but after six months of Elite Dangerous HOTAS muscle-memory training, I don't know if I want to have to learn completely new button layouts at this point! Thanks for the pointer, though!

 

[Arguendo]

Actually, as I continue my tweaking, I'm finding I *love* the roll/pitch curves. But I can't seem to get Joystick Curves to pick up the inputs from my rudder pedals so i can dampen those a bit, too. :sigh:

Back to fiddling to try to figure out why not.

Does Joystick Curves see your pedals? I am guessing they should show up as a separate controller, and you have to make sure that is selected in Source (Physical Device) for the Yaw axis.

Spoiler

Like this, only for Yaw instead of Throttle and your pedals instead of CH Pro Pedals USB:

 

[the100thmonkey]

Actually, as I continue my tweaking, I'm finding I *love* the roll/pitch curves. But I can't seem to get Joystick Curves to pick up the inputs from my rudder pedals so i can dampen those a bit, too. :sigh:

Back to fiddling to try to figure out why not.

It's a different device, soI don't think you'll be able to combine them into one vJoy device with Joystick Curves - you should add a new vJoy device and map to that.

Of course, since it's a Warthog, I would recommend actually using the TARGET application instead - it's more configurable, as you've seen, and will allow you to combine axes into a single virtual device.

If you want to persist in using vJoy, I'd recommend Jostick Gremlin instead. It's (a lot!) more complex than Joystick Curves, but (a lot!) more powerful. It will allow you to combine separate physical axes into one virtual device

 

[Camisade]

Thanks, all, for your volunteered assistance! Much appreciated.

Does Joystick Curves see your pedals? I am guessing they should show up as a separate controller, and you have to make sure that is selected in Source (Physical Device) for the Yaw axis.

Spoiler

Like this, only for Yaw instead of Throttle and your pedals instead of CH Pro Pedals USB:
https://theairtacticalassaultgroup.com/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=8277&d=1394988627

Figured this out just before I saw your post. You're right, I had to choose "Throttle" for that device, not "Yaw," in order for the physical device input to be recognized. But I was able to integrate it into vJoy device #1, "Yaw." So I get the scaling and it reflects my input. And I'm rocking -- my first trial vs a Thargoid resulted in me taking down a couple hearts in record time (for me) ...although I didn't win that fight, either, I'm getting closer!

Of course, since it's a Warthog, I would recommend actually using the TARGET application instead - it's more configurable, as you've seen, and will allow you to combine axes into a single virtual device.

If you want to persist in using vJoy, I'd recommend Jostick Gremlin instead. It's (a lot!) more complex than Joystick Curves, but (a lot!) more powerful. It will allow you to combine separate physical axes into one virtual device

Thanks for the input. When I was having trouble getting vJoy and Joystick Curves to work, I did install TARGET (and Joystick Gremlin), but those clearly have steeper learning curves (and as I mentioned earlier in the thread, I wasn't quite ready to abandon my setup and learn a new and more complex set of bindings, no matter how awesome Aussiedroid's Warthog scripts look! (File that one under, "You can lead a horse to water...")

 

[the100thmonkey]

Thanks, all, for your volunteered assistance! Much appreciated.



Figured this out just before I saw your post. You're right, I had to choose "Throttle" for that device, not "Yaw," in order for the physical device input to be recognized. But I was able to integrate it into vJoy device #1, "Yaw." So I get the scaling and it reflects my input. And I'm rocking -- my first trial vs a Thargoid resulted in me taking down a couple hearts in record time (for me) ...although I didn't win that fight, either, I'm getting closer!



Thanks for the input. When I was having trouble getting vJoy and Joystick Curves to work, I did install TARGET (and Joystick Gremlin), but those clearly have steeper learning curves (and as I mentioned earlier in the thread, I wasn't quite ready to abandon my setup and learn a new and more complex set of bindings, no matter how awesome Aussiedroid's Warthog scripts look! (File that one under, "You can lead a horse to water...")

Glad you got it working.

One thing to store in the back of your head for future reference is that Joystick Curves can be a bit heavy on the CPU, so if your processor is marginal (I have a laptop with a ULV ultrabook CPU, for instance), you might find that you get moments when the program doesn't "catch" the joystick input. Which can be... crashy, as in you crash into things.

As for TARGET, the GUI is pretty simple, and it's a lot lighter on resources.

 

[Arguendo]

Figured this out just before I saw your post. You're right, I had to choose "Throttle" for that device, not "Yaw," in order for the physical device input to be recognized. But I was able to integrate it into vJoy device #1, "Yaw." So I get the scaling and it reflects my input. And I'm rocking -- my first trial vs a Thargoid resulted in me taking down a couple hearts in record time (for me) ...although I didn't win that fight, either, I'm getting closer!

Cool to hear you got it working.
Just keep in mind that the curves will need to be tweaked as you go, to suit your flying style. I think I've adjusted mine atleast 10 times over the last year or so. I've gone from a J-shape to a ~-shape and back again. And I will probably tweak it again soon [where is it]

 

[CMDR X]

This is all such a pain in the arx! Why don't they add in-game axis curve settings like every other flight sim in the world has?
I have this same problem with joystick+fixed aiming. No way am I going to waste more of my life with vJoys, Gremlins and
the rest of this crap. Bad enough I have to use GlovePie and PPjoy just to combine my stupid clutch and gas pedals for a rudder.

This should all be part of the game FDev!

 

[Aashenfox]

I can get you set up with vjoy and JG in 5 minutes flat. I have video and am willing to talk you through it, send me a dm if you want a guest tag on our discord so we can talk some time on voice.

You DO want to do this, it will improve your aim by at least 100%.

 

[CMDR X]

I can get you set up with vjoy and JG in 5 minutes flat. I have video and am willing to talk you through it, send me a dm if you want a guest tag on our discord so we can talk some time on voice.

You DO want to do this, it will improve your aim by at least 100%.

Thanks Ash, I know I want to do this and I have tried, it works, that's not the problem.
vJoy, which all of the above need, conflicts with PPjoy and FreePie that all my racing
games require for other reasons. Head tracking, look-to-apex, etc. These are things
those looser developers left out of their games too, leaving us with PITA 3rd party tools to fix.

I'm just tired of it. 80% of my time is wasted dorking around with garbage like this instead
of playing my games. This after 9 hours of IT work.

X.

 

[CMDR X]

I can get you set up with vjoy and JG in 5 minutes flat.

Ash, I see on the JoystickCurves site that it works with an alternate VJoy driver by Headsoft.
I'm gonna try it out with that and see if it conflicts with PPjoy or not.
Can you post a picture of your curves?

Thx.
X.