Newcomer / Intro How "dangerous" is Open Play?

Charming Fawn · May 13, 2020

Hey there!

Sorry if that's a question that gets asked alot, but I'm fairly insecure about it and I did not want to jump into some old thread.

I just recently started playing Elite and really enjoyed it so far, but it feels like everytime I encounter another play (or I notice that there is another player) it has been a situation where I died. I've read about it and saw that there are pirates that actually try to roleplay, but I never noticed any kind of chat message while I got attacked, so I don't think that it's about them.
I know this is most likely a very selective perception since the "non hostile" players just fly by and I don't notice them at all, but I just feel pretty insecure about joining Open Play now that I have a ship that's actually fairly expensive for me to rebuy. Since it did cost a lot the last two times I died to someone.

So how "common" is this whole attacking thing and is there anything that I could really do against it? I tried avoiding this interdiction thingy, but that's pretty much impossible for me.

Thank you for reading that and I hope questions like this are not too annoying o/

Northpin · May 13, 2020

In hotspots and player hubs it can be quite "common" - so you need a well outfitted ship and the skills required to evade attacks - which won't happen if you meet pro gankers.
Otherwise it would be rare occurrence
And no, they are not Pirates - they are gankers preying on easy targets.
A pirate will demand some of your cargo. A BGS player defending his turf will send you a message and they will let you know you are not wanted in that area.
A ganker will simply blow you up, no question asked.

The most important thing is to have fun since this is a game and is supposed to be entertainment - so if you cannot cope with it, just play in solo (no shame in that) or in PG with some friends or, if you join a squadron, with your squadron mates.
This way you can hone your skills, you can unlock engineers and gather materials without having to look over the shoulder, and when you feel confident enough you can return to Open.

Point is, you don't have to play in open. There are Commanders out there that play exclusively in Solo - since for them other commanders do not bring anything to their gameplay.

Ca$hback · May 13, 2020

Charming Fawn said:
Hey there!

Sorry if that's a question that gets asked alot, but I'm fairly insecure about it and I did not want to jump into some old thread.

I just recently started playing Elite and really enjoyed it so far, but it feels like everytime I encounter another play (or I notice that there is another player) it has been a situation where I died. I've read about it and saw that there are pirates that actually try to roleplay, but I never noticed any kind of chat message while I got attacked, so I don't think that it's about them.
I know this is most likely a very selective perception since the "non hostile" players just fly by and I don't notice them at all, but I just feel pretty insecure about joining Open Play now that I have a ship that's actually fairly expensive for me to rebuy. Since it did cost a lot the last two times I died to someone.

So how "common" is this whole attacking thing and is there anything that I could really do against it? I tried avoiding this interdiction thingy, but that's pretty much impossible for me.

Thank you for reading that and I hope questions like this are not too annoying o/

Hollow squares are hard to miss. Assume they are all hostile and learn to read how they approach you in supercruise (trust comes later, within the no-fire zone of a station). The interdiction dance starts as soon as you see the hollow square. If they're trying to get behind you they're hostile. If they're trying to make it look like they're NOT trying to get behind you, they're definitely hostile. If there's more than one hollow square assume they're in cahoots. Keep all the hollow squares you can on the same side. Don't let them surround you. Player interdictions are typically much harder to defeat so submitting, doing a 180 right at them and boosting is typically the best way to escape. Many suggest high-waking to another star. I find this tedious and cheap, myself.

Manage your own expectations. Don't try to rush through the game in an effort to consume everything it has. Don't get too attached to what you have as it prevents risk-taking, which is essential in pushing the limits of your skills which is the only real way to improve them. Start flying FAoff now and your skill will increase much faster.

Or watch a couple youtube videos about the latest meta, use someone else's cookie-cutter and fast-track your way to all the content because you want it NOW. Then get bored because all the other tasks are inferior, "progress"-wise.

Ashnak · May 13, 2020

No need to apologize for an honest question - this is the Newcomer's questions subforum, and nobody is forced to answer

.

How dangerous is Open? It depends. As you have noticed, there are players who like to shoot up other players. They usually hang out in areas with a large number (otherwise, it would be boring) of easy (otherwise, it would be frustrating) targets. There are also players out there who are roleplaying - Pirates, PowerPlay, BGS were mentioned.
How you can deal with them? Several options

you can play in a private group or in solo
if you don't like to play with another specific player, you can block them (check your comms panel, scroll over to the history tab, there you can see who you encountered and who killed you. Click on them, and you can send them a friend request - or you can block them). That blocking isn't perfect - it's just a strong hint to the instancing server
you can "git gud" and meet those gankers on their terms (not recommended) or annoy them to hell and back without even wasting a single shot
you can avoid the infested areas/systems. That's not always possible, since a lot of them tend to hang around in systems everyone has to visit from time to time, like Engineer bases.
you can join up with a player faction/squadron/group that engages in PvP, learn the ropes and have your group's support in engaging any gankers

If you want a general non-combat private group, I can recommend mobius https://elitepve.com/ . There's also Fleetcomm, with a similar ruleset, but more geared towards explorers.

What I would not advise (but from what you wrote, you didn't do that) is to combat log, i.e. on purpose terminate the server connection of the game after another player has engaged you in combat. That is considered the ultimate in bad manners (at the least) or a violation of Frontier's ToS (in the view of PvP players).

Charming Fawn · May 14, 2020

Oh god, so many replies p-q'
Sorry that I can't reply to every point, it's way more than I've expected.

So thank you all for the answers. ♥

In general I know that I could dodge into Solo or Private play and that was what I did after I got killed the second time while trying to find engineering things on a planet...^^' But I feel like I could be missing out on the interaction, in the end it's just amazing to know how many people are out there and it adds a lot to the game in my eyes. So I want to try and stay in Open Mode for as much as I can, even if I am to explore with time and spend less time in the "main" systems.

I already watched a lot of Tutorials (honestly, otherwise I would not know how to do anything xD), even about thise whole pirate/gank thing, but I was just curious on how often that happens. I totally understand that different people have different playstiles and I don't want to rant about people who "gank" others, in the end it adds a sense of danger I guess. But especially in the beginning and with rising rebuy costs it just is a tat annoying.

But I think I'll just start to avoid systems and move into private mode once I have to go and farm more things to level my engineering for the FSD. That seems to be the best option to avoid randomly dying.

And don't worry, just logging out is nothing I want to do. First of all I'm too nervous once I see that interdiction thing and on the other hand I could ruin my own chance to meet an actual pirate that would add a lot to the feeling of the universe.

Northpin · May 14, 2020

Charming Fawn said:
but I was just curious on how often that happens.

It is also related to your geographical location - the networking model is Peer-to-Peer (P2P) and the matchmaking server will instance people from the same geographical areas.
IF you are from Australia, it is less likely that you will be instanced with someone from Europe (just an example)

Rick6549 · May 14, 2020

If you get blown up, ask them for advice and see what they say. Its not hard to build a survivable ship

Charming Fawn · May 14, 2020

Northpin said:
It is also related to your geographical location

Woah!

That's actually cool to know, thank you!

Rick6549 said:
If you get blown up, ask them for advice

Well jea that would be a good idea for sure, simply to learn more about the game. Sadly the time I tried writing them, I did not get a reply. :/

d8veh · May 14, 2020

I was making a beginners video and flying a shieldless Sidewinder with only D-grade thrusters and power distributor. My rank was harmless, but this all just made the gankers mouths water. In a fairly popular newb magnet area, they interdicted me. After I got pulled out. I turned to them to see if they wanted to talk. Boom - they didn't. I respawned in the local station, so I fitted a heatsink launcher and went out to play. My plan was to use silent running, but when they pulled me out the second time, I found out that I had no keybinding for silent running, so boom again; however, on the 3rd, 4th and 5th times I was able to escape every time. After that, they lost interest in me. I boosted as soon as I dropped out to get some distance, and engaged silent running, while boosting in different directions when I could. A shieldless Sidewinder runs quite cold, especially as I had the cargo scoop and power distributor switched off, so I could stay silent running even with boosting, for quite a long time before needing a heatsink.

To summarise, when you see them closing in, make sure that you have another system targeted to jump to to avoid mass-lock. As soon as you get pulled out, boost and hit silent running. try to zig-zag a bit until your FSD has cooled, then charge it and jump out. You will need a heatsink launcher to stay silent for any length of time.

If I had enough credits, I would have bought a 2A interdictor and gone after them, but this was my first trip after delivering the starter mission.

If you want to have some real fun get yourself a Sidewinder with A-rated thrusters and distributor. No weapons or shields are needed, just a 2A FSD interdictor and heatsinks. Engineering to the thrusters and PD always helps, and the best is the enhanced performance thrusters, which get you to 700 m/s. Chase down the gankers and interdict them. As soon as you drop out, boost away and hit silent running. If you want to be really nasty, you can taunt them with long-range beam lasers with thermal vent, otherwise watch them from a distance (long range sensors help) until they go back into supercruise, then get them again and again until they cry. You can have reasonable success with no engineering, but the faster you make your ship, the more certain that you'll get away. Even if they get you, you spawn in the station nearby with a very low rebuy costs, so you can come straight out and try again. If you let them win occasionally, it keeps them interested.

Here's what I use:

Coriolis EDCD Edition

A ship builder, outfitting and comparison tool for Elite Dangerous

coriolis.io

FrogsFriend · May 14, 2020

Charming Fawn said:
But I think I'll just start to avoid systems and move into private mode once I have to go and farm more things to level my engineering for the FSD. That seems to be the best option to avoid randomly dying.

This, unless you really want to focus on PVP combat. Play in open 99% of the time but use Solo or a Private Group if you need to visit one of the hotspots like an Engineer's base.

Simon Templar · May 14, 2020

I have played in Open for all of 2020 so far. I mostly meet no other Commanders, maybe a couple a week. Night before last I saw a player Viper MkIII leave a station just as I arrived. That was my first contact this week. I have been ganked three times since Christmas - twice in a T6, once in an Asp. Generally fly a Cutter and have never been ganked in it. I'm currently relocating back up to Colonia, one of the reasons for the move is that I get more player interaction up there. The only times I see players in the Bubble in any numbers is at Engineers' bases or at Shinrarta Dezhra. I play Open as I like the added feeling of the unknown, but in reality it makes no difference to my playing experience 90% of the time.

Krieger · May 14, 2020

There are 20,000 inhabited systems in the bubble around Sol. Gankers camp in 10 of them. If you stay away from these systems or switch to solo when you must go there (e.g. system has an engineer) the chance of getting ganked drop to a few times per year. You can see where these systems are under "Security Report" (top right) here:

INARA

The community site for Elite: Dangerous, Starfield, Kingdom Come: Deliverance with the game databases, information, gaming news and other handy content...

inara.cz

The gankers change camp regularly so check this page once a week or so.

Charming Fawn · May 14, 2020

Krieger said:
There are 20,000 inhabited systems in the bubble around Sol. Gankers camp in 10 of them. If you stay away from these systems or switch to solo when you must go there (e.g. system has an engineer) the chance of getting ganked drop to a few times per year. You can see where these systems are under "Security Report" (top right) here:

INARA

The community site for Elite: Dangerous, Starfield, Kingdom Come: Deliverance with the game databases, information, gaming news and other handy content...

inara.cz

The gankers change camp regularly so check this page once a week or so.

Oh! Thank you for that link, that'll help a lot I think.

Right now I think I'll just continue to farm up to finish my ASP Explorer as a proper exploration ship and then try to find some nice things away from the people around Sol. x'3 That should save me from a lot of possible PvP

Tyres O'Flaherty · May 15, 2020

I played in open once. I was sitting outside Jameson scanning FSWs for mats in my Cobra when I was rammed (multiple times) to my death. They must've thought it the height of hilarity but all it did was discourage another player from being in open.

Simon Templar · May 15, 2020

Tyres O'Flaherty said:
I played in open once. I was sitting outside Jameson scanning FSWs for mats in my Cobra when I was rammed (multiple times) to my death. They must've thought it the height of hilarity but all it did was discourage another player from being in open.

It really isn't that bad. I have literally only been attacked at Shinrarta Dezhra. Have had some lovely exchanges with other Commanders otherwise, most notably one in French at a Guardian site while trying to get the FSD booster (he was just leaving). Then the next Commander through arrived while I was still hacking about. He parked his DBX on the other side from my T6, thus doubling up our missile defences, and offered to help me through the unlock process if I needed it over chat (I didn't but it was a lovely thought). So I certainly feel I gain wildly more than I lose. Plus the element of unknown can be fun.

A C Ender · May 15, 2020

Tyres O'Flaherty said:
I played in open once. I was sitting outside Jameson scanning FSWs for mats in my Cobra when I was rammed (multiple times) to my death. They must've thought it the height of hilarity but all it did was discourage another player from being in open.

I share the experience of Simon Templar and would recommend for any experienced commander to play in open, unless you are planning a high-risk activity and can't accept a potential rebuy.

I go to Borann in open to mine, and though I don't mine often, the few times I've gone I've yet to be interdicted, both going to the hotspots or selling station. I do treat every hollow as hostile, and take defensive measures with fast approach from deep space.

Last time I was a the guardian ruins I met maybe 7(!) different commanders during my stay. Most were not very talkative or had limited English skill, but none were hostile and some actively collaborated.

I started open maybe September, and have only had to rebuy once from a 4-man gank. I've probably been interdicted a dozen times at most, if I exclude the time I ran into the Code and they kept trying to chase me from the system to stop any piracy attempts. I was in an Orca so was fast enough to boost away and low wake each time however.

Overall, I can't seriously call open particularly dangerous unless you're reckless or new and doesn't know what you're doing.

d8veh · May 15, 2020

Simon Templar said:
It really isn't that bad. I have literally only been attacked at Shinrarta Dezhra. Have had some lovely exchanges with other Commanders otherwise, most notably one in French at a Guardian site while trying to get the FSD booster (he was just leaving). Then the next Commander through arrived while I was still hacking about. He parked his DBX on the other side from my T6, thus doubling up our missile defences, and offered to help me through the unlock process if I needed it over chat (I didn't but it was a lovely thought). So I certainly feel I gain wildly more than I lose. Plus the element of unknown can be fun.

That's what we all hope for, but I can't think of a time when I was in open at a moderately popular area and somebody didn't attempt to blow me up, apart from one time before engineering. I had an A-class Sidewinder as a harmless pilot in an alt account, which I took to LHS3 447, the starter system, to grief the griefers, but there were white knights swarming the place looking for action and scaring all the griefers away. They kept offering to guard me, which I didn't want.

Charming Fawn · May 15, 2020

Tyres O'Flaherty said:
all it did was discourage another player from being in open.

Honestly, I thought the same at first. Especially since rebuy costs in the beginning can be super annoying. "Wohooo I can afford that one thing I want-" Rebuy.

But in the end, if you stop playing open, you may hurt your own experience and then you'd actually be griefed. Gathering money is not that hard, at least enough money for a nicer ship so loosing some money won't hurt you personally or in a long term. But if you give in and just try to avoid other people in general, you'll miss out on some interactions that could make the game even more enjoyable.
The hint here that helped me the most was the list of "hot spots" that I should avoid where griefers seem to be on their way, other than that I try to stick to open play until I start to leave the bubble.
Maybe the post by @Krieger a bit further up could help you too.

Tyres O'Flaherty · May 16, 2020

Well, I just tried open again based on the replies here.

Unfortunately...

Another CMDR seemed to think ramming me was something fun to do - again. I was within Jameson's no-fire zone. I escaped him though which must've stuck in his craw

Based on this experience, I'll be sticking to solo, thanks.

Rick6549 · May 16, 2020

Tyres O'Flaherty said:
Well, I just tried open again based on the replies here.

Unfortunately...

Another CMDR seemed to think ramming me was something fun to do - again. I was within Jameson's no-fire zone. I escaped him though which must've stuck in his craw

Based on this experience, I'll be sticking to solo, thanks.

Why do you keep going back to jameson