How did a body get missed in discovery, left for me to find?

Piratescribe

Piratescribe
On another thread, I think "varonica" tried to explain the general concept to me, with a combination of how discoveries USED to happen in the game... but I'm just really slow on the uptake, I'm not groking it. So let me try this:
I just visited WREGOE KE-O C20-9 last night, and it said every body there had been already "First Discovered By" a Cmdr ROOK. Except one! The moon WREGOE KE-O C20-9 2 G. That world didn't have a discoverer! So I mapped ALL the bodies of that system, and now I'm credited as "First Discoverer" of that one moon!
My question is: How did ROOK miss it? Did they have to originally visit every world to "discover" it? Or what? How did this happen?
(I'm not complaining! I'm ecstatic to get my first "First Discovered By" credit in the game!! But I'm just curious about the how.)
 

Faded Glory

Faded Glory
Some people like to scan (and sometimes now map) every body in a system, some like to leave bodies for players who come later.

Also, back in the old system some players didn't feel like flying to every body in a system to scan them and put their name on them, and that was especially true of large systems where other stars and bodies were many hundreds of light seconds from the primary star. Because as you asked, yes, in the old system you had to fly to every body to scan and thus 'discover' it.

In this case, it sounds like it was the former situation.
 
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Melorum

Melorum
Before the FSS when you did the honk it immediately revealed the whole system map but all the bodies were unexplored until you individually flew to each one and scanned them. Needless to say tagging a whole system back then was extremely time consuming and most people didn't bother especially because the payouts back then were pure garbage. It's also common practice by a lot of people to leave bodies unscanned for other people especially if it's a unique POI or something
 

ethelred

ethelred
Pulls up a sandbag.

I remember when we had to use parallax and a mk 1 eyeball to find planets. Those certainly weren't the days.

Early exploring threads I can't be bothered to find also had some people complaining that their OCD was triggered by previous pilots NOT tagging all bodies in system so of course CMDRs did that sort of thing more
 

Orvidius

Orvidius
In addition to the above, sometimes people just don't want to take the time to find that last planet (especially if it's a low value one) if it's behind the star, or they somehow missed it the first time they circled the FSS all of the way around, or it's far off the orbital plane and they'd have to hunt for it.

Some explorers intentionally leave one or two for someone else to tag.

Lots of ways this can happen. ;)
 

Sapyx

Sapyx
Anny of the explanations could be true. The only way to know for sure is to hunt down Cmdr Rook, and ask him/her. Assuming, of course, that they even remember that particular system, which is probably one of hundreds or thousand that they've scanned.

You can't even tell how long ago Cmdr Rook passed through the system, unless both you and they are EDSM users and EDSM recorded the first-scanned date. As it turns out, EDSM reports six people passing through that system including yourself, with a Cmdr Count Elmdoor as first EDSM-scanner back in August 2017 - so that's at least five people who came, saw, and didn't bother scanning that moon.
 

Orvidius

Orvidius
And 2017 is during the pre-FSS era. Back then, you'd have to get pretty close to a planet to scan its moons. By then, the planet's scan will have completed, and you might want to move on without getting slowed any further by the planet's gravity. So that was sometimes a factor back then as well.
 

Maelstrom5K

M
Or, the most obvious explanation: it could have been missed by pure chance.
I recently missed two planets in a system I actually came for, and noticed only much later by checking my EDSM logs. I still have no clue how that could have happened.
 

Sapyx

Sapyx
Finally, I should add: there was a glitch a while back, a bug where you'd ocassionally scan a planet and see the scan completed message on-screen, but it didn't "take" - the planet would remain unscanned, you'd get no credits and no Tag. I think this was long after 2017, though, so is not a likely explanation for this specific moon. Especially as there's multiple people who have passed through this system.

I think in this case, Cmdr Rook scanned all-but-one, and everyone else passing through the system afterwards saw his name plastered all over the system map and assumed he'd scanned everything, without scrolling over every single moon to check. So, kudos to Cmdr Piratescribe for thoroughness. :cool:
 

varonica

varonica
And what do you know, just today I came across a good example, here are the before and after pictures;

ZF3fyy4.jpg


xUR8Zl3.jpg
 

Piratescribe

Piratescribe
varonica said:
And what do you know, just today I came across a good example, here are the before and after pictures;

[...]
Click to expand...
:O OMG please please if I may ask, explain to me so that I know with a perfect object lesson, what steps you went through to go from first image to second?
Like, did you enter the system and immediately view System Map before DSS? Did DSS create the 2nd image? Or was that only after doing a FSS?
If I can beg the time from you for that info, this would REALLY help me I think truly understanding the way it all works and happens!
 

Maelstrom5K

M
Piratescribe said:
:O OMG please please if I may ask, explain to me so that I know with a perfect object lesson, what steps you went through to go from first image to second?
Like, did you enter the system and immediately view System Map before DSS? Did DSS create the 2nd image? Or was that only after doing a FSS?
If I can beg the time from you for that info, this would REALLY help me I think truly understanding the way it all works and happens!
Click to expand...
Well... the system map always shows the system to your current knowledge.

  • Stars, planets and belts already discovered by you show up on the system with their name.
  • Stars, planets and belts not yet discovered by you, but already by someone else, show up as "unexplored".
  • Stars, planets and belts not discovered by anyone will not show up on the system map (and not on your radar as well).

So I assume the first picture is immediately after the honk, the second one is after using the FSS to find all the objects.
The giveaway here is HD119278 B in the second picture. It has no "first discovered by" tag, so varonica must have found it first, and must have found it before taking the first picture. Most likely it was by honking, having the honk mapped to a firing button and holding it immediately on hyperspace exit.
The "unexplored" moon shows in the first picture, because it was already found. The honk doesn't show you planets never discovered by anyone, it is just a pre-requisite for the FSS.
 

varonica

varonica
Piratescribe said:
:O OMG please please if I may ask, explain to me so that I know with a perfect object lesson, what steps you went through to go from first image to second?
Like, did you enter the system and immediately view System Map before DSS? Did DSS create the 2nd image? Or was that only after doing a FSS?
If I can beg the time from you for that info, this would REALLY help me I think truly understanding the way it all works and happens!
Click to expand...

I jumped into the system and immediately honked, this told me how many bodies and signals. Then I opened the system map which show the image in the first picture. I haven't yet "discovered" anything in the system. The yellow planet had been discovered already by Bert McGyver, but he hadn't bothered going to the time and effort to discover anything else. So in the system map I can see stuff other people have discovered and for which they have sold the data. Bert got his name on the yellow body and the primary star only.

Since he used the old system he didn't even get his name on the T-Tauri dwarf star but under the new system I got my name on the T-Tauri dwarf automatically.

After seeing that and taking the picture I then entered the FSS and scanned all the bodies, I can't see them until I do that even though I know they are there. All the bodies now in the system except for the primary star and the T-Tauri dwarf have my name on them.

The body A 4 when I scanned with the FSS also had biology, so I mapped that one and visited one of the bio sites, so A 4 has my name as the first discoverer and the first mapper, thus;

gYQAnjL.jpg


But the rest only have me as first discoverer.
 

varonica

varonica
Going to put up a second example, this one is interesting as well. In the first image you see 4 stars. The primary Star A and secondary C has been discovered by an explorer called CWN ANNWN, but he discovered nothing else. The star B and the two planets were discovered by an explorer called Boundry.

60vNqyh.jpg


After mapping. Note that the system was not reported to EDSM by either CMDRS, so while I didn't get first discovered on the star A and C and the two planets, it will show me as the discoverer in EDSM because I am the first one to report it even though I have yet to sell my data;

SPQWYFi.jpg


So visited by two CMDRS, not reported to EDSM and only partially mapped. The fact that one of the stars was also undiscovered shows that this system was last visited by these two explorers prior to the FSS being introduced to the game and not by anyone since, to get their names on the planets they would need to fly up to them like we have to when mapping now and sometimes the extra time wasn't worth it for low value or very distant bodies.
 

varonica

varonica
Piratescribe said:
Thank you thank for all the reply! I truly fully grok it all now!! I really appreciate the time and effort you put in to edumacate me!! I hope I can do the same for some newbie like me one day. Cheers!!
Click to expand...

You're welcome, indeed pass it on when you get the opportunity!
 
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