how much CIF and EFC.

[Aashenfox]

I actually owe the devs an apology, it's not fair to say every single thing I heard is 'way out there' because; one, we haven't heard a lot of ideas yet, two, they aren't actually crazy (the people) and three, the materials broker shows some insight into what I personally perceive the problem to be.

So, sorry for that, BUT, that craziness we heard a few weeks ago about a roll always being better, that was proper scary. I seriously hope that was something someone said while just throwing out random thoughts and it wasn't a properly considered or 'under constructoin' thing.

If they were to change the rolls, I would only ask for less of a difference between a crappy roll and a god roll, although, for some mods this is already the case, for others there's a huge gap, so perhaps it's a 'by recipe' solution.

 

[sovapid]

So, sorry for that, BUT, that craziness we heard a few weeks ago about a roll always being better, that was proper scary. I seriously hope that was something someone said while just throwing out random thoughts and it wasn't a properly considered or 'under constructoin' thing.

And I disagree with this. The biggest issue I have with the Engineers is the randomness of the rolls. I think I can handle randomness on the the collection of mats (although I dont like this either).

It is the complete disconnect between the amount of time investing in engineering vs the result.

I rolled 600 times on 6A thrusters before I got a pretty good/really good roll (140.5 multiplier, -14 opt mass. could definitely be better though). Took me 600 rolls, but could be done in 10 rolls, or 1000 rolls. Since it is RNG there isnt a direct correlation between effort and results.

Even with the commodity broker stuff, that disconnect still exists.

 

[Aashenfox]

And I disagree with this. The biggest issue I have with the Engineers is the randomness of the rolls. I think I can handle randomness on the the collection of mats (although I dont like this either).

It is the complete disconnect between the amount of time investing in engineering vs the result.

I rolled 600 times on 6A thrusters before I got a pretty good/really good roll (140.5 multiplier, -14 opt mass. could definitely be better though). Took me 600 rolls, but could be done in 10 rolls, or 1000 rolls. Since it is RNG there isnt a direct correlation between effort and results.

Even with the commodity broker stuff, that disconnect still exists.

I don't agree, I think the 0.00001% of people that get a 140 roll first time are just lucky, they won't get that again on another module. Which means that the other 99.99999 have to put in the hours to get the god rolls, and it is as it should be. Why do you begrudge the luckjy few a god roll on a single module? You didn't get lucky with great rolls in the first few attempts for at least a couple of items? Didn't that feel great? Why do you want to remove it?

Under your model everyone will have god rolls in a fixed number of hours, EVERYONE will have to grind for EVERY module, this would be a total disaster and kill engineering dead (because if everyone is ultimately at the same level, why did engineers exist in the first place? And also, you have INCREASED the effort required for engineering several-fold) The removal of RNG would make them even more grindy and ultimately remove any reason for their existence.

But hey, I can give you what you want, as you stated, more rolls for less effort. The materials broker. That's what needs to happen, the rolls are fine.

 

[AnotherVoice]

If i had to rank them, i would say 1) EFC 2) BC and 3)CIF which appear to be the rarest of the 3 on mission boards

 

[sovapid]

I don't agree, I think the 0.00001% of people that get a 140 roll first time are just lucky, they won't get that again on another module. Which means that the other 99.99999 have to put in the hours to get the god rolls, and it is as it should be. Why do you begrudge the luckjy few a god roll on a single module? You didn't get lucky with great rolls in the first few attempts for at least a couple of items? Didn't that feel great? Why do you want to remove it?

I don't begrudge the lucky few, I begrudge FDev for setting it up this way.

And assuming a normal distribution of randomness, I'm more worried about the player that has to roll 10,000 times to get a really good roll vs the one the rolls 20 times.

And I know of a player during the the exploit deal, that rolled 9000 times before getting a really good drive roll.

 

[Aashenfox]

I don't begrudge the lucky few, I begrudge FDev for setting it up this way.

And assuming a normal distribution of randomness, I'm more worried about the player that has to roll 10,000 times to get a really good roll vs the one the rolls 20 times.

And I know of a player during the the exploit deal, that rolled 9000 times before getting a really good drive roll.

I do see what you mean, but I think the current state isn't that bad, I have near god rolls (but if I'm honest, I think I only have one TRUE god roll, an efficient PA) on many things from less than 20 rolls. I think the problem is a little overstated, but I would agree that the difference between a crap roll and a god roll could use some reduction in some cases (and not in others).