It also appears that you only have to pay the bounty/fine for the jurisdiction that you are in. i.e Sol authority doesn't care about your status in LHS-BobsYourUncle. So unless you get pegged with a KWS you only have to pay for the system you die in.? Still looking into this as well
Huge changes to crime and punishment. No discussions, no patch notes, no warning
- Thread starter Starbuck Phoenix
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Negative when you log back into Horizons all the Bounties return to the "hot ship" in question. Literally two completely different systems depending what mode you launch... the question we have is if we eliminate the "hot ship" in Horizons will those Bounties still cross into odyssey. Will update when I have an answer on that.
You can store the dirty modules. But in order to out them on another ship you have to pay a cost to "clean them" small bounty amount for each module basically, while the frame of the ship itself stays dirty.
I think you are missing the point. The C&Pinitial changes were never introduced as a counter to PvP, Ganking, etc. (no matter how many mistakenly thought that). They were introduced to try and balance certain aspects of BGS & PP gameplay, which involved killing NPCs only. It introduced an interesting concept - hot ships (basically the equivalent of a stolen/disguised vehicle used to commit crimes in) that could then be stored at an anarchy station, and the Cmdr could then fly off in a completely different ship, knowing that whenever they took out their anti-Batmobile they had a giant bullseye on them. This was all about PvE, not PvP. Gankers just shrugged off these changes. BGS/PP PvE players, however, purchased and designed dirty ships to be used exclusively for specific nefarious missions. Now those PvE players are getting a massive slap for playing the game the way FDev designed - in an interesting way that has nothing to do with PvP or Ganking. And these new changes will not affect Gankers at all.
Exactly my point! Thank you!
I have raised an issue in the tracker to see if fdev actually will address it... the next step we will be taking is individuals putting in tickets to see if fdev will take pity on them.. however as you can probably understand. Some of the more severe cases are afraid to log into the game at all right now as a result
Thankyou for your service to the community Slim_Sumo & Starbuck Phoenix! Until Fdev commit to a consistent C&P system between game versions its going to be frustrating to casual players that don't get it, and exploited to death by the masters. Also I hope they hear Rubbernuke's Risk vs Reward. I'd like a more dynamic universe that includes ways to thrive outside the law.
If history in Elite has taught us anything it's that fdev won't do anything unless you can get the Hutton truckers on board with the complaint. Gotta get the NDA folks to sign the petition.
This could be a decent halfway house if bounties sit permanently:
forums.frontier.co.uk
In short: it relies on scans of other ships to activate the bounty, and for the perp they have to smuggle themselves in plain sight. So, if you are really, really wanted you have to be quite paranoid....
At notoriety 10, each full NPC / player scan spawns an ATR vessel
A half though out idea, but: If a player is at notoriety 10, they have to be very careful about being scanned by random ships, security or other players as if they are, an ATR security vessel drops in to hassle them. The handwavium being that a scan is like a sighting of you thats disseminated...
In short: it relies on scans of other ships to activate the bounty, and for the perp they have to smuggle themselves in plain sight. So, if you are really, really wanted you have to be quite paranoid....
Precicely why support should feel obligated to step in. It's an unwanted side effect of the changes.
If EDO actually ran, this level of threat and consequence would really tingle my berries- that is, if C+P was joined up enough to mould itself around my deeds and change the BGS' response properly.
I got a better proposition.
If CMNDR has the credits, but doesn't want to pay up their debt to society then:
Serve time in a Solo instance Hardspace Shipbreaker scenario driven detention star system. aka a temporary time out box where naughty CMNDRs go to sulk and pay their debts to society
Hardspace: Shipbreaker on Steam
Equipped with cutting-edge salvaging tech, carve & slice spaceships to recover valuable materials. Upgrade your gear to take on more lucrative contracts and pay your billion credits debt to LYNX Corp!
But instead of breaking down and salvaging space ships and stations for credits, CMNDRs would do a variety of mission/sandbox activities for the star system NPC authority. Just like Hardspace: Shipbreaker, CMNDRs would get a percentage of the credits they earn for their effort from the IF authority in the detention star sytem.
Criminal CMNDRs who avoid paying, or are unable to pay their bounties would be locked into this speical instance (no Galaxy map access). They would have the entire star system to work in (unplottable & invisible from normal galaxy map) with size similar to the one in the alpha test. They would serve time doing a variety of missions/sandbox activities. From bounty hunting/combat/assasination/sabotage missions to sandbox mining/scavenging/refining raw mats. Or scanning planetary bodies for terraforming/bioscan samples of alien flora/fauna for research.
In this special Solo instance system, CMNDRs would
- have to earn whatever deficit their bank account is to return to zero or positive. If a CMNDR entered the detention star system at -100 credits after paying their fines at the IF, then they would only owe society -100 credits. So thieir time in this detention star system would be very short (vs. a -1M credit CMNDR criminal)
- lose access to their engineered/OP ships. No OP "Condas, Pythons or upgraded T-9 heavies etc. HOWEVER Cmndrs would
- have access to ALL the vanilla ships for a loan (similar to how you always have a free Sidey but you can't buy/swap parts on the vanilla ships).
- CMNDRs would unlock access to the larger ships when their earned credit from doing missions/sandbox stuff on side like mining/salvaging/SAR for NPCs etc reach a certain threshold. So you would have to earn your way to upgrading from a loaned Sidey to T-9 or Corvette
- have a variety of different mission types (Combat v. NPCs both bounty & system faction driven warfare, salvaging shipwreck on planets/space, investigating space anomalies, distress signals etc. OR
- have a variety of PvE sandbox sandbox acitivities like mining, mapping planetary data in star system, biosampling, space trucking/ubering NPCs etc). Basically Cmndrs free to chose what they like to earn their freedom from this special Solo Instance.
- would face more aggressive/hostile NPC criminal types trying to hinder their progress (like space pirates stalking you while mining/salvaging, evading you if you opt the bounty hunter route, trying to stalk and assasinate you if you opt for a more combat oriented mission route for system NPC authorities etc)
Just like Hardspace Shipbreaker, they'd get to keep a minor percentage of all proceedings they performed during their incarceration. This would accumulate until their bank accounts reach the zero (or surpass this) threshold. At which point, they would've earned enough to buy their freedom/post bail. They would be free to FSD out the detention system and would be teleported (while in witchspace load screen) back to a normal instance of their choice (i.e. before jumping out the system, chose a destination solar system from their nav menu that is in Open, PG, or Solo)
Odds are a good number of CMNDRs on the wrong side of the law aren't going to care or like this proposition.
Which is why it's the perfect solution, because THAT is the purpose of jail/detention facility. So yes, this would be hardest on those socially minded CMNDRs who prefer to play with other ppl in Open & PG. But that is the entire point. The purpose is a temporary loss of personal freedom and privileges to play how you want. Because accountability = key to a successful C&P system. Basically, if you can't do the time, don't do the crime. Or at least show responsibility to the community by paying your fines before you get busted by the authorities.
So if you ran afoul of C&P and couldn't/wouldn't pay, or if you're the IDGAF type CMNDR: serve your time, earn a small percentage doing similar sandbox and mission driven opportunities you'd do in the regular game. Then return to society (albeit a probably more vengeful and meaner SOB than you were going in
) But you wouldn't be penniless if you entered the facility completely broke due to the Hardspace:Shipbreaker profitsharing design.
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I like itI got a better proposition.
If CMNDR has the credits, but doesn't want to pay up their debt to society then:
Serve time in a Solo instance Hardspace Shipbreaker scenario driven detention star system. aka a temporary time out box where naughty CMNDRs go to sulk and pay their debts to society
Hardspace: Shipbreaker on Steam
Equipped with cutting-edge salvaging tech, carve & slice spaceships to recover valuable materials. Upgrade your gear to take on more lucrative contracts and pay your billion credits debt to LYNX Corp!store.steampowered.com
But instead of breaking down and salvaging space ships and stations for credits, CMNDRs would do a variety of mission/sandbox activities for the star system NPC authority. Just like Hardspace: Shipbreaker, CMNDRs would get a percentage of the credits they earn for their effort from the IF authority in the detention star sytem.
Criminal CMNDRs who avoid paying, or are unable to pay their bounties would be locked into this speical instance (no Galaxy map access). They would have the entire star system to work in (unplottable & invisible from normal galaxy map) with size similar to the one in the alpha test. They would serve time doing a variety of missions/sandbox activities. From bounty hunting/combat/assasination/sabotage missions to sandbox mining/scavenging/refining raw mats. Or scanning planetary bodies for terraforming/bioscan samples of alien flora/fauna for research.
In this special Solo instance system, CMNDRs would
- have to earn whatever deficit their bank account is to return to zero or positive. If a CMNDR entered the detention star system at -100 credits after paying their fines at the IF, then they would only owe society -100 credits. So thieir time in this detention star system would be very short (vs. a -1M credit CMNDR criminal)
- lose access to their engineered/OP ships. No OP "Condas, Pythons or upgraded T-9 heavies etc. HOWEVER Cmndrs would
- have access to ALL the vanilla ships for a loan (similar to how you always have a free Sidey but you can't buy/swap parts on the vanilla ships).
- CMNDRs would unlock access to the larger ships when their earned credit from doing missions/sandbox stuff on side like mining/salvaging/SAR for NPCs etc reach a certain threshold. So you would have to earn your way to upgrading from a loaned Sidey to T-9 or Corvette
- have a variety of different mission types (Combat v. NPCs both bounty & system faction driven warfare, salvaging shipwreck on planets/space, investigating space anomalies, distress signals etc. OR
- have a variety of PvE sandbox sandbox acitivities like mining, mapping planetary data in star system, biosampling, space trucking/ubering NPCs etc). Basically Cmndrs free to chose what they like to earn their freedom from this special Solo Instance.
- would face more aggressive/hostile NPC criminal types trying to hinder their progress (like space pirates stalking you while mining/salvaging, evading you if you opt the bounty hunter route, trying to stalk and assasinate you if you opt for a more combat oriented mission route for system NPC authorities etc)
Just like Hardspace Shipbreaker, they'd get to keep a minor percentage of all proceedings they performed during their incarceration. This would accumulate until their bank accounts reach the zero (or surpass this) threshold. At which point, they would've earned enough to buy their freedom/post bail. They would be free to FSD out the detention system and would be teleported (while in witchspace load screen) back to a normal instance of their choice (i.e. before jumping out the system, chose a destination solar system from their nav menu that is in Open, PG, or Solo)
Odds are a good number of CMNDRs on the wrong side of the law aren't going to care or like this proposition.
Which is why it's the perfect solution, because THAT is the purpose of jail/detention facility. So yes, this would be hardest on those socially minded CMNDRs who prefer to play with other ppl in Open & PG. But that is the entire point. The purpose is a temporary loss of personal freedom and privileges to play how you want. Because accountability = key to a successful C&P system. Basically, if you can't do the time, don't do the crime. Or at least show responsibility to the community by paying your fines before you get busted by the authorities.
So if you ran afoul of C&P and couldn't/wouldn't pay, or if you're the IDGAF type CMNDR: serve your time, earn a small percentage doing similar sandbox and mission driven opportunities you'd do in the regular game. Then return to society (albeit a probably more vengeful and meaner SOB than you were going in
I had a similar (but smaller scale) idea where you break rocks to pay off your crimes for the controlling faction. However, you also have a minor criminal faction where you can do small scale rep missions for tools to escape from your sentence.^^
Perhaps the rock breaking (I'm assuming by this you mean a sentence of mining only?) should be reserved for the worst of the worst offenders. PvP and PvE combat minded CMNDRs HATE doing sandbox activities like mining, salvaging etc. It's far too boring and wussy gameplay for their hardcore gamer mindset
With no SC timer count down if you log off the game. Never understood how that game mechanic would impact player behavior when all they need do is log off and return later. IMO a real punishment is a detention that would stop and continue only when the Cmndr returns online. And it would be only based on whether that CMNDR had achieved the threshold to bail themselves out of the detention system.
This way, those CMNDRs who're the most socially challenged morons in Open (and who btw are ironically very socialized players given their need for constant anti-social human contact) would genuinely be punished for the more extremes of their antisocial behavior.
Perhaps the rock breaking (I'm assuming by this you mean a sentence of mining only?) should be reserved for the worst of the worst offenders. PvP and PvE combat minded CMNDRs HATE doing sandbox activities like mining, salvaging etc. It's far too boring and wussy gameplay for their hardcore gamer mindset
With no SC timer count down if you log off the game. Never understood how that game mechanic would impact player behavior when all they need do is log off and return later. IMO a real punishment is a detention that would stop and continue only when the Cmndr returns online. And it would be only based on whether that CMNDR had achieved the threshold to bail themselves out of the detention system.
This way, those CMNDRs who're the most socially challenged morons in Open (and who btw are ironically very socialized players given their need for constant anti-social human contact) would genuinely be punished for the more extremes of their antisocial behavior.
Hmm now when we have on foot activities, why not literal rock breaking^^
Perhaps the rock breaking (I'm assuming by this you mean a sentence of mining only?) should be reserved for the worst of the worst offenders. PvP and PvE combat minded CMNDRs HATE doing sandbox activities like mining, salvaging etc. It's far too boring and wussy gameplay for their hardcore gamer mindset
With no SC timer count down if you log off the game. Never understood how that game mechanic would impact player behavior when all they need do is log off and return later. IMO a real punishment is a detention that would stop and continue only when the Cmndr returns online. And it would be only based on whether that CMNDR had achieved the threshold to bail themselves out of the detention system.
This way, those CMNDRs who're the most socially challenged morons in Open (and who btw are ironically very socialized players given their need for constant anti-social human contact) would genuinely be punished for the more extremes of their antisocial behavior.
I kind of had Prison Break or Riddick Butcher Bay in my head. There you are, in an orange penal Sidewinder with a tiny FSD having to do mining missions equal to your bounty- you could be good and pay it off...but then you could do the prison missions (deliver drugs, kill someone while guard ships distracted). You might then be given a decent FSD and you escape (chased by ATR or guards), or smuggled to a selected starport.^^
Perhaps the rock breaking (I'm assuming by this you mean a sentence of mining only?) should be reserved for the worst of the worst offenders. PvP and PvE combat minded CMNDRs HATE doing sandbox activities like mining, salvaging etc. It's far too boring and wussy gameplay for their hardcore gamer mindset
With no SC timer count down if you log off the game. Never understood how that game mechanic would impact player behavior when all they need do is log off and return later. IMO a real punishment is a detention that would stop and continue only when the Cmndr returns online. And it would be only based on whether that CMNDR had achieved the threshold to bail themselves out of the detention system.
This way, those CMNDRs who're the most socially challenged morons in Open (and who btw are ironically very socialized players given their need for constant anti-social human contact) would genuinely be punished for the more extremes of their antisocial behavior.