If I were as clever as Frontier I would have built elite differently

dubsdj

dubsdj
If I were as clever as those guys (which I'm not) Didn't get an interview with them , got rejected. Anyway If I was chief Elite designer then I would have built elite dangerous in a different way.

Firstly I would have started off with a much smaller amount of systems and concentrated on more content and diversity (Including planet landings in the first commercial release). Once that was all in place I would have then been able to use that 'template' and added more systems in future updates. That way there would be a lot more variety in space stations and things to do.

Having a billion odd stars is very impressive I agree but its almost futile when trying to create diversity and content on such a big scale that it just cannot be achieved.

so the saying I've heard in various forums "a mile wide and an inch deep" is currently how it feels.

anyway I've bought the game so I will continue to play.. I do 30 minute shifts most nights to keep it fresh.

PS. Well done for adding oculus rift, I love that.:)
 

Apos

Apos
They didn't create every single system. They created an engine that does it for them. It's actually a much bigger achievement and with lot of investment value for the future, because with a few tweaks it can be expanded to generate every single planet's surface as well.

The impression of lack of content is also due to a disjoint between active players groups and the universe. It's hard for a new player to realize that there are groups of players who influence the universe in a multitude of ways and they can be part of that and have an actual identity in the game. Even if someone doesn't want to join a player community, there's a lot they can do with factions just solo, but there is minor feedback issues with that, since they won't see immediate effects until the day refreshes the influence values.

In the end, this disjoint makes them focus mostly on their credit balance and the game becomes a grind. This is also in addition to a false sense that bigger ships equal better, when in reality most people end up turning their anaconda to their trading ship.
 

Agarthan

Agarthan
Except that's not what you have from SC at all. After how long? 4 years? What do you have. A single fighting arena in one planet? A hanger to walk around in? And a bunch of ships that you have to 'donate' hundreds of dollars to online to 'help fund' the game when the game already has 10 times the funding this game did?

I mean don't get me wrong I want to see Chris Roberts succeed with that, but damn, If I was clever as him and I made promises as big as I made, I might want to deliver on at last a quarter of it within half a decade.
 
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Krait_79

Krait_79
Funny because if i were in charge i would have done pretty much what they have done.

Give us the original Elite experience with nice graphics and then add additional content.

Being able to land on planets etc is very nice but my only concern is people have expectations for what we should be able to do far in excess of what is currently possible.
 

Defacto

Defacto
Apos said:
They didn't create every single system. They created an engine that does it for them. It's actually a much bigger achievement and with lot of investment value for the future, because with a few tweaks it can be expanded to generate every single planet's surface as well.

The impression of lack of content is also due to a disjoint between active players groups and the universe. It's hard for a new player to realize that there are groups of players who influence the universe in a multitude of ways and they can be part of that and have an actual identity in the game. Even if someone doesn't want to join a player community, there's a lot they can do with factions just solo, but there is minor feedback issues with that, since they won't see immediate effects until the day refreshes the influence values.

In the end, this disjoint makes them focus mostly on their credit balance and the game becomes a grind. This is also in addition to a false sense that bigger ships equal better, when in reality most people end up turning their anaconda to their trading ship.
Click to expand...

In the Beta, FD focused on a small area, and this made it possible to make the systems that were in the bubble a lot richer. If we would have kept slowly expanding the bubble, we could have had the possibiltiy for more regional variance as well as more stuff in general for things going on in the system. I think generation is a great way to create variation on the astronomical scale, but for system history, politics and culture, it's obvious that the generation we have isn't enough.

FD could also have worked on making deep-space exploration challenging, but now they opened the galaxy, we got to the Orion Nebula in 12 hours and to the core of the galaxy after a few weeks.

I think the disjoint you talk about could at least partially be solved if we give players the impression that they live in a living universe, with a functioning economy and political simulation. I remember being overjoyed when they reimplemented dynamic trading in the late Beta 1, but it really didn't do much. Systems can live off Palladium, and generally, what decides which faction is the most successfull in a system is the faction with a station closest to the exit point.
 

mbcx4jrh

M
dubsdj said:
If I were as clever as those guys (which I'm not) Didn't get an interview with them , got rejected. Anyway If I was chief Elite designer then I would have built elite dangerous in a different way.
Click to expand...

Or maybe it's because you're not as clever as them that makes you think it should have been built a different way. If you were as clever as them you might have built it exactly the same way.
 

[VR] Mad Mike

[VR] Mad Mike
dubsdj said:
If I were as clever as those guys (which I'm not) Didn't get an interview with them , got rejected. Anyway If I was chief Elite designer then I would have built elite dangerous in a different way.

Firstly I would have started off with a much smaller amount of systems and concentrated on more content and diversity (Including planet landings in the first commercial release). Once that was all in place I would have then been able to use that 'template' and added more systems in future updates. That way there would be a lot more variety in space stations and things to do.

Having a billion odd stars is very impressive I agree but its almost futile when trying to create diversity and content on such a big scale that it just cannot be achieved.

so the saying I've heard in various forums "a mile wide and an inch deep" is currently how it feels.

anyway I've bought the game so I will continue to play.. I do 30 minute shifts most nights to keep it fresh.

PS. Well done for adding oculus rift, I love that.:)
Click to expand...


This is kind of the Star Citizen way of doing it... which is just as good, just different.

IMO (and I accept i may be wrong as I have no facts... but this is an internet forum so lets not let lack of evidence get in the way ;)) but, imo DB is an astronomy nut and my gut feeling is that the simulation of the milkyway is a HUGE part of the reason why he wanted to make Elite D.

without this simulation I do not think he would have wanted to get a team together to make the game as much as he did. Again IMO the "game" inside the universe simulation is partly a hook he needed to drag people in to help fund making his milkyway.

In truth I do agree however there there currently is not enough difference in flavour around the universe. I would like to see more of a hand made brush added as we go forward.

go to thailand and the buildings are totally different compared to russia, compared to England, compared to holland etc etc.

I would love to see some differences between, certainly the empire and the federation, the the alliance and independents maybe taking bits from both.

I would also like to see different stations, from very old and past their best - in terms of technology - to the shiny new and cutting edge.

then within these extras, I would also like to see a range of wear and tear, with missing panels, parts blown out or half built (like the deathstar in return of the jedi) and basically just places which have not been looked after well.

I know all this takes time, but 12 months from now......... who knows?
 
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AgentK

A
dubsdj said:
If I were as clever as those guys (which I'm not) Didn't get an interview with them , got rejected. Anyway If I was chief Elite designer then I would have built elite dangerous in a different way.

Firstly I would have started off with a much smaller amount of systems and concentrated on more content and diversity (Including planet landings in the first commercial release). Once that was all in place I would have then been able to use that 'template' and added more systems in future updates. That way there would be a lot more variety in space stations and things to do.

Having a billion odd stars is very impressive I agree but its almost futile when trying to create diversity and content on such a big scale that it just cannot be achieved.

so the saying I've heard in various forums "a mile wide and an inch deep" is currently how it feels.

anyway I've bought the game so I will continue to play.. I do 30 minute shifts most nights to keep it fresh.

PS. Well done for adding oculus rift, I love that.:)
Click to expand...

Good morning Captain Hindsight!
 

CaptainKremmen

CaptainKremmen
Imagine the howls of fans... "Elite delivered a WHOLE GALAXY in the 1990s, but now, in 2014, we have just this tiny postage stamp area to all fly in! It's just a poor man's Star Citizen! At LEAST just reuse the Fronter Elite II procedural generation, and update the graphics! What a con, this isn't Elite!"
 

kreuzbichler

Banned
kreuzbichler
dubsdj said:
Firstly I would have started off with a much smaller amount of systems and concentrated on more content and diversity (Including planet landings in the first commercial release). Once that was all in place I would have then been able to use that 'template' and added more systems in future updates. That way there would be a lot more variety in space stations and things to do.

"a mile wide and an inch deep" is currently how it feels.
Click to expand...

correct
the billion ´systems´was just there for marketing, makes no sense whatsoever and offers zero benefit or variation, but it was probably cheap and easy to generate.
They can say ´look, big game´.
 
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Agony_Aunt

Agony_Aunt
dubsdj said:
Firstly I would have started off with a much smaller amount of systems and concentrated on more content and diversity (Including planet landings in the first commercial release).
Click to expand...

There's a group of us players, maybe you have heard of us, who they collectively call "Explorers". Its one of the big 3 gameplay styles currently in the game and the full galaxy perhaps attracted many people to the game in the first place.

PS: I can't believe you used the mile wide, inch deep meme. Can we get some sort of electric shock system set up for every time someone uses that phrase?
 
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Alex Merion-Turner

Alex Merion-Turner
dubsdj said:
Didn't get an interview with them , got rejected
Click to expand...

Kudos for trying sir! Many wouldn't have the balls.

dubsdj said:
Firstly I would have started off with a much smaller amount of systems and concentrated on more content and diversity (Including planet landings in the first commercial release). Once that was all in place I would have then been able to use that 'template' and added more systems in future updates.
Click to expand...

I don't think you've grasped the power of procedural generation.

Mind you I'm not entirely sure that FD have done as much with it as they could. Planetary landing will show us whether or not they can crack it.

I really, really hope we see some diversity there.

I'd love to see some more station types, also with some crazy modularity defined by the PG stuff. I thought outposts were supposed to be like that but it feels more like there's just about 10 different types, not thousands that there could be.

Asteroid bases will be cool if they ever appear.
 

dead_rock

dead_rock
As much as I love the game I have to agree with OP to a certain extend.
It sure would've had far more mass appeal to have a complex game from the beginning that slowly expanded to 400 Billion stars.

That being said, now half a year after official release the Power Play update (free of charge!) seems to add much needed content.
Just in time - for me at least ^^

Let's see what those powers bring in terms of variety - I'll surely be a miner now for some time and venture out from densely populated space.
 

Riedquat

Riedquat
I would not have implemented Super cruise, I think this is the root cause of people feeling there is a lack of depth.

I would have gone with a jump drive solution as in the very first game, like a mini hyperspace that drops you out when you are in the vicinity of another object.

On top of that , I would of made every single NPC ship persistent, with registration plates rather than names.

Every ship you see would have a role and would be attempting to fulfil that role - this would make the galaxy feel alive.

Npc wingmen, so you can form a group and fit them out how you like and give them orders, maybe even send them off to carry out tasks individually.

I like the idea of powerplay tho, I just would of made sure everything was in before implementing it.
 
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Patrick_68000

Patrick_68000
The essential is not to have of billions of planets, but to know they are there. Anyway, later, very superior civilizations to the human species, will invade the galaxy in its totality
 
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salad

salad
I would have added blackjack and hookers to every starport.

And a lottery system.
 
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