CQC "If you are new to CQC, Don't."

[Gryphorim]

Title is a quote from my brother, who I just introduced to CQC. My wing just tried a few rounds with the following results. Keep in mind, I only just made level 4, all 3 of my wingmates are level 1s.
And one of those never connected to our game.
First Match: I was booted from squad until half-way into the match, whilst trying to join my own game to pass time, was added to their game. They were 2 lvl1s and a random lvl 20something against a mix of 20s, 30s and a 41.
All higher tier players in tricked out ships with nigh immunity to the basic pulse laser. Reversed resistance shields? Also, one flying an Eagle that seemed in every way a better ship than the Condor.
Someone had a ballistic weapon that one-shots a Condor with no shields.

Second Match: I was shuffled against my wingmates, paired with the two highest performers from the previous game and sent against my wingmates, and one random who was AFK for the whole match. My wing, having a numbers advantage, and with me focusing on the high level player on their team, won by only two points. So a team of one experienced player and two newbs are up against one extremely high level player, a moderately experienced player and someone actively ignoring the new players to hit their one experienced player, and still couldn't win.

Third Match: Myself and the two more moderately placed players from round 2, plus a new level 20+ are up against my two wingmen and the highest ranked player, but no 4th team member. Wouldn't have been terrible if our 4th man could connect, but 4th slot was held by an AFK, so they were out-manned from the start, and to top it off, the high-lvl on their wing just up and left, leaving the two lvl 1 players to take on three experienced players and me, i did the gracious thing and did laps of the level, with no regard for combat anymore.

So, TL;DR:
AFKs filling team slots at start of game = bad matchmaking,
terrible matchmaking of high lvl vs low lvl,
high-lvl upgrades protect from starter weapons,
some high-lvl weapons might be too good against lvl 1 defences
mid-game AFKs and Disconnects, leave one team at the mercy of other team.

At high or even moderate level, these issues might even out, but how am I supposed to recommend CQC to my friends if this is what we are given. They called it the most un-fun part of Elite they've seen to date.

 

[BEKTOP 3APEMOB]

Maybe it's hard to frag more experienced people, but you will learn much faster with them around. And you'll get to rank 10 (with reversed resistances shields iirc) in a few days, even if you just make a couple frags per round

 

[TheGrimCorsair]

Maybe it's hard to frag more experienced people, but you will learn much faster with them around. And you'll get to rank 10 (with reversed resistances shields iirc) in a few days, even if you just make a couple frags per round

This is well known bunk. It's a fact that players learn fastest when playing against players close to, and slightly above, their skill level. Feeding the lambs to the wolves tends to just lead to the wolves getting fat and the lambs getting decimated.

Now, compound that with said more experienced players have a clear, tangible, mechanical advantage and you have a recipe for a PvP system that's only lacking in cash-shop consumables to take it to peak scummy-ness.

If Frontier wants CQC to be a decently competitive PvP arena they need to toss tying power to level out the window. If they don't care about that, but do want a reasonable experience for players they need to control much better in their matchmaking for variable skill level, time played, and mechanical strength of those participants.

 

[BEKTOP 3APEMOB]

This is well known bunk. It's a fact that players learn fastest when playing against players close to, and slightly above, their skill level. Feeding the lambs to the wolves tends to just lead to the wolves getting fat and the lambs getting decimated.

Now, compound that with said more experienced players have a clear, tangible, mechanical advantage and you have a recipe for a PvP system that's only lacking in cash-shop consumables to take it to peak scummy-ness.

If Frontier wants CQC to be a decently competitive PvP arena they need to toss tying power to level out the window. If they don't care about that, but do want a reasonable experience for players they need to control much better in their matchmaking for variable skill level, time played, and mechanical strength of those participants.

Look, I don't know why you're stating some things as facts, but fact is: I and lots of other players didn't change their default condor setup until rank 30 and only done it, because we were getting bored of standard setup. It's not disadvantageous - it's the middle ground, it's slightly better against kinetic rounds and slightly worse against lasers compared to reversed resistances shields. Even if you find yourself in a match against 40+ level peeps with lasers, you can still win and/or get many frags - just need to use your head a little.

This is the setup for many MAJOR FPS games - you don't start with best weapon loadout, but the more you play, the more you unlock. If people like it in other games, why it should be changed in this one?

 

[znôrt]

play single deathmatch. it's fun.

i agree both other modes are 'broken'. i never really bothered with them. e:d just isn't a platform for that kind of pvp. it isn't in the 'normal' game mode either. but plain old hectic free for all carnage? hell, yeah! gimme more!

 

[Fendalton]

Never play TDM, purely for the facts you mentioned above.

 

[grammatonfeather]

Maybe it's hard to frag more experienced people, but you will learn much faster with them around. And you'll get to rank 10 (with reversed resistances shields iirc) in a few days, even if you just make a couple frags per round

Totally agree. I've played CQC twice. First time I got a fair number of kills. Now a month later and last night I found my ship destroyed in seconds again and again on one deathmatch game. I didn't get any kills but it did make me more determined.

So then I tried some team deathmatch and again was having my ship blasted but I persisted and used different tactics. So I was able to get some kills again with some better tactics employed.

I don't agree that everything in life has to be perfectly balanced. That doesn't reflect reality. I have no issue being a noob pilot up against top pilots because it forces me to learn and try new approaches.

Oh and I had a lot of fun on CQC last night.

I'm about rank 4 now so still very low but I love the fast paced dogfighting.

 

[Nebohtes]

Totally agree. I've played CQC twice. First time I got a fair number of kills. Now a month later and last night I found my ship destroyed in seconds again and again on one deathmatch game. I didn't get any kills but it did make me more determined.

So then I tried some team deathmatch and again was having my ship blasted but I persisted and used different tactics. So I was able to get some kills again with some better tactics employed.

I don't agree that everything in life has to be perfectly balanced. That doesn't reflect reality. I have no issue being a noob pilot up against top pilots because it forces me to learn and try new approaches.

Oh and I had a lot of fun on CQC last night.

I'm about rank 4 now so still very low but I love the fast paced dogfighting.

Just remember that there are some pilots that will sandbag a match or try different load outs when they're up against new pilots and let the match play out, and some that will end the match as soon as pposible. Some pilots are just trying to rank; it's nothing personal, and at least you're collecting experience at short intervals. I do recommend focusing on staying alive; it doesn't help your score (there's a 100 experience bonus if you don't die at all) much, but if you can get a rep as a survivor, some of the pilots focusing on maximising experience will stop chasing you -- it's not worth their time to hunt you down. Hug structures, put four pips in shields when they have LOS, and four in engines whenever you can break it. Double back when they can't see you and make them turn around when you fly past them. If they have to work hard enough for the kill, they'll move on to another target.

*edit* and learn where the weapon enhance is on every map; most pilots trying to shore up a short win are controlling the spawn on it (when you grab it, the respawn timer is the duration of the buff, so timing when to head back to its spawn point is as easy as watching the buff decay). You can use this to get eyes on the controller, take it yourself, or avoid the spawn point and the pilot with super guns (not all pilots camp the area, but some do). Even it it's already taken, you can target the halo. On Elevate, for instance, it's always at the end of the spire with the antenna (which is always "down" from where I spawn); practice getting there fast; if it's gone when you get there, get far away fast (there's a stealth at the other end of the spire) count to twenty and be back there at twenty.

 

[Khelder]

Hmm... I'd like to be matched up with... anyone... when trying to play TDM or CTF.

Playing against superior (skill/loadout) pilots does (should?) teach you to try different things. Learning to get out of trouble quickly has been interesting. You've just got to get used to the quick-kill nature of the game though.

On a side note, I found the win/loss ratio to be rather annoying. Does anyone else? If you're in a match with 7 others, you've got an 87.5% chance of that statistic getting worse. Maybe some pilots can consistently rank 1st, but it certainly isn't me. Win/loss tends to make more sense in a 1-on-1 competition.

 

[SushiCW]

Eh, just don't take the stats too seriously. They're useful mostly as a rough indicator of how tough your competition is when you're waiting in the lobby.

 

[grammatonfeather]

Just remember that there are some pilots that will sandbag a match or try different load outs when they're up against new pilots and let the match play out, and some that will end the match as soon as pposible. Some pilots are just trying to rank; it's nothing personal, and at least you're collecting experience at short intervals. I do recommend focusing on staying alive; it doesn't help your score (there's a 100 experience bonus if you don't die at all) much, but if you can get a rep as a survivor, some of the pilots focusing on maximising experience will stop chasing you -- it's not worth their time to hunt you down. Hug structures, put four pips in shields when they have LOS, and four in engines whenever you can break it. Double back when they can't see you and make them turn around when you fly past them. If they have to work hard enough for the kill, they'll move on to another target.

*edit* and learn where the weapon enhance is on every map; most pilots trying to shore up a short win are controlling the spawn on it (when you grab it, the respawn timer is the duration of the buff, so timing when to head back to its spawn point is as easy as watching the buff decay). You can use this to get eyes on the controller, take it yourself, or avoid the spawn point and the pilot with super guns (not all pilots camp the area, but some do). Even it it's already taken, you can target the halo. On Elevate, for instance, it's always at the end of the spire with the antenna (which is always "down" from where I spawn); practice getting there fast; if it's gone when you get there, get far away fast (there's a stealth at the other end of the spire) count to twenty and be back there at twenty.

Thanks for the advice! I'm gonna print it off and refer to it.

 

[Mark Lock]

I personally like CQC but I get bored quickly compared to Open game mode, CQC is too chaotic in my opinion, you start shooting somebody, you get killed by 2,3 other people from behind, killing is more about luck than anything else, I wish they added 1 vs 1 mode in this game mode and maybe the possibility to challenge friends to duel in CQC.

 

[Beavis Tingleball]

I remember a day when people tried harder when they werent successful at something. You almost never heard anyone say "it's too haaaaarrd"...Man, I feel old...

 

[Shaamaan]

I feel you, OP. I really do. I tried out CQC myself, and...

a) it felt seriously broken (matchmaking-wise)
b) unfair (problems you mentioned about loadouts)

Of course any criticism about point a) is met with indifference (which I kind of understand - there's nothing people can do except hope Frontier does something about this) and point b) is met with the really flawed "rank doesn't equal skill" argument (technically correct, but rank is a good indicator of experience if nothing else) or that "at rank 11 it's all good", which still leaves ranks 1-10.

That said, IF (and that's a big if) you manage to get into a decent team-fight it can be pretty darn awesome. I had a game which ended in a draw yesterday with very similar teams both rank-wise and skill-wise. So it CAN happen. But that single instance felt like Christmas... because it's so rare.

I remember a day when people tried harder when they werent successful at something. You almost never heard anyone say "it's too haaaaarrd"...Man, I feel old...

Ahh, the condescending tone of the sharp veteran. But I think this may be because people played things like Quake back in the day, usually DM, which meant that even if there was one person dominating the game, everyone else was still having fun. Oh, and there were things like servers and you could also observe how others play - the former could be used to change the skill level if it was too low / high and the latter allowed one to learn tips and tricks from the pros without being on the receiving end.

Finally, there used to be bots too! Oh, those sweet sweet Unreal Tournament bots. Those helped in training too!

 

[Mr_Blastman]

CQC isn't bad at all--you just need to get over the shock that...

a. You probably aren't as good a pilot as you thought you are
b. There's a lot more to combat in this game than you previously thought
c. It is more than pulling the trigger and watching stuff explode
d. You must think and use your head to stay alive
e. It will take more than one or two matches to figure all this out

CQC has a lot of depth. The first one or two matches obscures this but trust me, it is there. Of the modes, Team Deathmatch allows you to really influence the odds once you understand the fundamentals of aerial combat (they apply in space!) and how to manage the flow of battle.