Community Event / Creation Implications of AD 3300

[Memnoch]

Presumably there would be a point where the technology they have has advanced to the point that it can't easily be improved. At least the bits we see in the movies like space craft, weapons, hyperdrive etc. We've never seen them but they might have something really advanced though, like a toaster that actually browns all of the bread without leaving that little white strip at the top.

P.S. I know about putting the bread in sideways, just in case anyone decided to mention that.

 

[Allen Stroud]

That's actually from the fan-produced "expanded manual" for First Encounters that's available online, but it isn't in the original manual, which doesn't mention any dates later than when the game begins in 3250.

The expanded manual is a nice replacement, with lots of interesting stuff in it, but most of it is firmly in fan-fic territory.

Really, gosh, my bad. I'll go look out an original. :S

 

[Abysinth]

if it's 175 years since Elite, shouldn't we have a Cobra mk IV by now?

 

[Fermats Folly]

Möbius, you raise an interesting point about religion. I'm sure religious belief will have altered, especially if there are alien races. However, I find it hard to believe that all humans will (ever) be atheists. I'm sure there'll always be some people who believe there is more 'out there'. Indeed I suspect that the vast scale of the universe, which will be much more apparent to most in a spacefaring civilisation, may reinforce some religious beliefs.

 

[drew]

There are entire systems in FE2 and FFE which are given over to "Isolationist Religious Conclaves" - whatever they are - the most famous being Van Maanen's Star as I recall. Religion remains a feature. I'm planning to use it in my novel.

Cheers,

Drew.

 

[AlexGS]

Really, gosh, my bad. I'll go look out an original. :S

I was looking for the manual online myself, which is how I came across the expanded version. It was surprisingly difficult to find the original, but it's available at http://www.lotf.co.uk/download.shtml, as an old Word Perfect file. I think most modern word processors can still open those, possibly with a little coaxing.

 

[Ian Phillips]

I will be drawing a Pension.

You sir are an optimist!

 

[Nvmb3rth30ry]

A well know example of technology not advancing is the Star Wars universe,

we have tales from the old republic and 4000 years later we have the star wars we all know, and as far as I can tell not allot has changed.

Heh. Indeed, Star Wars technology development seems to be under the overwhelming influence of a tachyon field. The earlier stuff seems more advanced than the latter.

 

[Nvmb3rth30ry]

Oh a Cobra Mk IV.... I want to see that! C'mon Faucon deLacy - get those AI's designing please!

News just in: Faulcon Griff Kleptra Inc is pleased to announced the initial shipment of its long-awaited Cobra IX model, following successful proving throughout the Xexedi cluster. Cobra IX represents the very state of the art in high performance combat and fully integrated weapons systems, featuring exciting Windows 8 touch-HUD technology. See your ship dealer today

 

[Susimetsa]

Oh a Cobra Mk IV.... I want to see that! C'mon Faucon deLacy - get those AI's designing please!

Missed this earlier, but had to say that there's no AI in Elite Universe. It is the humans doing the designing and I suspect that the next model that sees the light of day will be Mk XI - after the models in-between have been abandoned due to further problems with hull design.

 

[deMangler]

Personally I find it more fun to look for explanations as to why the Elite universe is the way it is rather than why it should be different. Otherwise the Elite future universe just makes no sense.
Bottom line it that any explanation about how things might be in 50 years from now is likely to seem very quaint and archaic when 2063 rolls around.
If the Elite universe is the way it is in 3250 then I see no reason why it should be very different in 3300.
The biggest suspension of disbelief I have to make when considering any far future science fiction is to believe that recognizable humans are going to exist at all. Once I have done that then believing what I need to for the story and setting to make sense is relatively easy. As long as it is internally consistent.

 

[Abysinth]

It seems as though the technological level in Elite has reached a plateaux. That makes a lot of sense really, we currently live in an unprecedented age in terms of technological development. Compare that to the hundreds of years in the past when the sword was the peak of close combat technology.

I think the Sword is still the peak in close combat technology, it's the distance stuff that has improved (Bow and Arrow -> musket -> rifle etc.)

 

[Andrew Sayers]

Ever wondered why every low-budget armed group in the world uses the same Avtomat Kalashnikova 1947 model rifle? Well, there's lots of reasons but a big one is that it's a decent enough gun that can be produced in great numbers by a local shop with technology 70 years behind the cutting edge. A procession of firearms technology is all well and good if you've got a military-industrial complex to maintain, but cranking out a proven design is a much easier sell if you just want to fight a civil war.

Doesn't seem too implausible a similar incentive would keep frontier systems producing designs with widely-copied blueprints while the big boys produce the new shiny and all of shipbuilding history in the middle gets forgotten.

 

[Fermats Folly]

Doesn't seem too implausible a similar incentive would keep frontier systems producing designs with widely-copied blueprints while the big boys produce the new shiny and all of shipbuilding history in the middle gets forgotten.

I agree. The new rarely completely replaces the old (or at least takes decades or even generations to do it). Some people still use fountain pens. It can be quite a while before new tech filters down and as you say it may require a complex infrastructure to maintain it.

It reminds me of Bladerunner. One of the strong elements for me was the way that the future world still had some buildings etc recognisable from our past. Makes a world seem much richer and gives it a feeling of history.

 

[jptreen]

I've been thinking about the ship design thing a bit for a little story idea I had.

It seems to me there's a very simple reason for a) the paucity of ship designs and b) the slow nature of progress.

Every station has a shipyard. Every shipyard can repair or upgrade any ship. The easiest way to make that possible is to have a limited number of standardised components that fit into a limited number of proven ship types.

Take the current space industry as an example. There's only one company really designing and building new engines that are going into space anytime soon. That's SpaceX. Everyone else is still using '60's designs or struggling to get funding to move off the drawing board.

In aerospace, look at what happens when someone tries something new. The Dreamliner is still grounded, I think.

And this is just one small planet.

Multiply the logistics over a solar system and you can see why conservatism would win the day. Now multiply it over a galaxy, and (I don't think I'm being toooo extreme here), the whole fabric of interstellar travel just wouldn't function without a reliance on a small core of proven ships with interchangeable parts.

Maybe I put it a bit strong, but does that sound reasonable?

 

[Andrew Sayers]

jptreen - that would certainly make some sense. For technology from 3125 (Elite) to still be viable in 3300 (Dangerous) would imply a stagnation on a par with the dark ages.

There's an argument that over-powerful corporations tend to stifle progress, because once they've saturated their market the only rational course of action is for them to hold on to it as long as possible. Making interchangeable parts the other guy can't replicate is a common real-world tactic - you're probably wearing a few examples right now - and given the theme of corporations running government in the Elite universe, it seems quite believable they would use upgradable ship parts to make a sort of oligopoly to thwart progress. A wise man once explained how that pressure is resisted in the modern world:

There has grown up in the minds of certain groups in this country the notion that because a man or corporation has made a profit out of the public for a number of years, the government and the courts are charged with the duty of guaranteeing such profit in the future, even in the face of changing circumstances and contrary to public interest. This strange doctrine is not supported by statute or common law. Neither individuals nor corporations have any right to come into court and ask that the clock of history be stopped, or turned back.

 

[jptreen]

Andrew,

I love that Heinlein quote, thank you. From that perspective, it's not difficult to imagine possible ways the existing corporations could place certain barriers to entry into any number of areas, if they had too many claws in a government's back (or indeed were a government).

Easy enough, at any rate, to see that part of the Elite universe as a plausible one.

 

[Darren Grey]

Also technology itself has surely changed - one can see some progression in the existing games, and there are sure to be more new tech items in Dangerous. We already know at least that hyperspace travel has been speeded up immensely. Ship designs have stayed the same for conservative licensing purposes perhaps, but under the bonnet we're still seeing development.

 

[Jjagged Bbanner]

I liked the fact that the universe was still not too different to today. HG Wells wrote about time travel and invaders from mars. In the 1960s we expected moon bases as a _MINIMUM_. Star Trek predicts things like warp drive etc. The reality is that in some areas we've moved quickly - computer power - in other areas we've moved very slowly, as there is no faster than light travel, there's barely any real research money funnelled directly into that area; and apart from a few efforts to allow orbital visits by tourists, there's no money in space.

Frontier: Elite 2 featured a manual and gazetteer that painted a universe which moved slowly, there were wars/pullution problems and things only picked up when hyperspace was discovered, even then there were sentient species wiped out, the corporations actually moved people off world, and whilst there were many inhabitable planets, there were also those too hot, or too cold; or where the star systems had too much radiation etc.

The reality is space is dangerous. Frontier with e.g. having narcotics as still being illegal in most places and yet still being traded, showed a humanity that had brought its flaws and freedoms into space. Humans in Elite are not enlightened like those from Star Trek 'we have moved beyond a monetary economy'. They are more like those in Babylon 5 - doing jobs in the military for glory or self improvement, but basically earning money, trading etc. Humans won't magically evolve in a thousand years unless by their own doing with genetic engineering or cybernetic enhancement (which the book of stories touched on in Elite 2).