In game trade tools still lie?

Dbrn47

Dbrn47
Since apparently taking screenshots doesn't work for me anymore (they don't save anywhere), I'll try to explain the best I can. Mission to find Battle Weapons, I use the trade tools on the galaxy map, I updated the trade information on all the systems close by, enabled export prices and trade routes for battle weapons, what shows up is several systems nearby supposedly exporting battle weapons, however out of the many only 1 actually exports it because they are illegal in the rest of them. On top of that, there are actually export prices from stations in systems where they are supposed to be but yet are illegal at station (even though it's not saying it's illegal, it's showing an export price) thus cannot be sold from there. So how did I actually end up finding battle weapons? EDDB, just as before.

Now maybe I don't understand what's going on here, but it's curious why we have this new set of filters if they aren't even going to be near accurate. Is it just trying to tell me that 'at some point in the past, maybe hours, maybe years ago, this item was sold and exported from here?' If so, that's a bit useless isn't it, especially after paying to update trade data? Seems like 'speculative' information just as before, which may as well be a lie.

Please help me understand, thanks.
 
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kpmop

K
Yeah. I don't know what's happened since the update but all the markets have gone a bit weird. I had a load of places bookmarked (for dodgy stuff - slaves, nerve agents, battle weapons ...) and the markets no longer have them, (not 0 stock, no longer list them) for no apparent reason.

The commodities filter show a lot of places with a 0 cr export price (for various things): the only way to find stuff now seems to be if the station has a green triangle and a non-zero export price (which turned out to be about in 1 in 10 systems that claimed to sell them...)

So I can't help you understand - it's a mystery to me too!
 

Dbrn47

Dbrn47
kpmop said:
Yeah. I don't know what's happened since the update but all the markets have gone a bit weird. I had a load of places bookmarked (for dodgy stuff - slaves, nerve agents, battle weapons ...) and the markets no longer have them, (not 0 stock, no longer list them) for no apparent reason.

The commodities filter show a lot of places with a 0 cr export price (for various things): the only way to find stuff now seems to be if the station has a green triangle and a non-zero export price (which turned out to be about in 1 in 10 systems that claimed to sell them...)

So I can't help you understand - it's a mystery to me too!
Click to expand...

That's odd. There has to be something to it, it's hard to believe they would want it to be so convoluted.
 

Dbrn47

Dbrn47
Give this a little bump because I'm genuinely curious, someone has to know what's going on here. I especially think things like this are a good opportunity for someone at Frontier to give a rundown, even if short, on how this is working or isn't. I could bug report it, but at the same time, it might be working as intended, really is hard to tell sometimes.
 

Alecz

A
I don think anything with the Galmap tools changed.

If you see they are exporting Dodgy goods, they may normally do, but if the Government changed, they become illegal and are no longer produced.

A similar effect is for the Black Markets. You can find them on the Galmap, but if the Government is Corporate, they will be disabled,.


FWIW, I had the following good experience with the galmap:
1 - I found a system for which the Galmap said I have no data.
2 - Traveled to said system and saw that the Large landing pad station was about 6,000 Ls away
3 - Did not feel like travelling, so I scanned the local Nav Beacon
4 - Check the Galmap again and now, I had trade data available

I am not sure how accurate the trade data is, but it seems it pays to scan the Nav Beacons, at least you get something...

Also, I find Collect missions for dodgy goods rather challenging, even with EDDB which mostly shows stock levels < 50units for stations withing a 100 Ly radius...Not easy when the mission is to source 1500 units or so...
 

Dbrn47

Dbrn47
Alecz said:
If you see they are exporting Dodgy goods, they may normally do, but if the Government changed, they become illegal and are no longer produced.
Click to expand...

Right, but why are they still showing as exporting after updating trade data?
 

Alecz

A
Dbrn47 said:
Right, but why are they still showing as exporting after updating trade data?
Click to expand...

Probably for the same reasons black markets are shown when they are in fact disabled. Not saying it's right...

I also generally found the trade data to be often outdated
 

FrogsFriend

FrogsFriend
There's a bug report on this here that you could add to:
https://forums.frontier.co.uk/showthread.php/411796-Incorrect-trade-price-data

It appears to have a problem with goods that are not available due to a particular faction being in control, and making them illegal, or the state of the faction temporarily removing them from the market. As though they are still there in the underlying market, though not shown in the commodities screen due to the previous reasons, but the trade tools aren't picking up that they should be hidden.
 

Speedcuffs

Speedcuffs
They were all commodities for 50mil fetch missions.
Unfortunately I have wiped stock out galaxy wide, but things should settle down soon, as I am retiring with my fortune to one of several systems that I now own.

Yeh, somethings broken.:(
 

Jmanis

Jmanis
Legality is one thing... and I note the comment about faction state making goods temporarily removed.

It's important to note with that one that the items aren't actually being removed, but that demand (exports + because the faction is at war) actually outstrips supply, so they "appear" to be off the market, but they still show up on trade data maps.... this is because theoretically, goods are still being produced, and are still being shipped (via NPC routes) to other systems and meeting local demand, but that all results zero profit.

To exemplify, War state creates increased demand for weapons, but also *decreased* overall supply of goods. So technically in the back-end there is still trade, just nothing visible to commanders (and probably why the UI distinguishes player trade routes from non-player ones).

Arguably, there may be a bug that this just effectively "removes" those types of commodities from the market rather than create supply for them, but that's not a call I've got any preference over.
 

-VR- Max Factor

-VR- Max Factor
Dbrn47 said:
Working in what way? System has an export price and the item is available? System has an export line and the item is there? Both?
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Both. But I may have been lucky. And I don't think I was looking for any dodgy commodities like Battle weapons.

Seems the issue is with illegal items only.
 
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Dbrn47

Dbrn47
Jmanis said:
Legality is one thing... and I note the comment about faction state making goods temporarily removed.

It's important to note with that one that the items aren't actually being removed, but that demand (exports + because the faction is at war) actually outstrips supply, so they "appear" to be off the market, but they still show up on trade data maps.... this is because theoretically, goods are still being produced, and are still being shipped (via NPC routes) to other systems and meeting local demand, but that all results zero profit.

To exemplify, War state creates increased demand for weapons, but also *decreased* overall supply of goods. So technically in the back-end there is still trade, just nothing visible to commanders (and probably why the UI distinguishes player trade routes from non-player ones).

Arguably, there may be a bug that this just effectively "removes" those types of commodities from the market rather than create supply for them, but that's not a call I've got any preference over.
Click to expand...

The thing is, generally, items that even have zero supply still show up in markets, you just can't purchase because there isn't any. I know that it's the fact that the items are illegal is the reason they aren't there, it's just the part where the trade tools tell you exporting is still happening and that there is an export price for them, but not in all systems since some will outright tell you there is no price because it's illegal. It's inconsistent at best.

Max Factor said:
Both. But I may have been lucky. And I don't think I was looking for any dodgy commodities like Battle weapons.

Seems the issue is with illegal items only.
Click to expand...

I'll check if I have the same problem with universally legal items then.
 

GhostYou

G
yep over 30 stations showing large numbers of slaves in eddb and can't get more then 4 at a time. this will takes weeks to fill my cutter and years to do "industry needs 1512 units of slaves" :( any help would be great.

im over at "DECH" only got 4 hours left on mission and not even 1/2 full on 1st trip
 
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