Insurance

Searching the forum it appears that many people have fallen foul of being unable to pay the insurance to regain their ship after destruction. I joined their ranks a couple of days ago and rage-uninstalled ED at the time (though tbh I will probably re-install it at some point, me being a die-hard fan of the original BBC micro version of the game). I'd spent nearly 2 months trading to get to the point where I had an upgraded ASP before looking to take on some of the missions on the bulletin board. I figured having a top-notch loadout with military grade hull etc would give me a reasonable chance of surviving in a fight. I chose a mission that required me to take out three ships in a low intensity conflict zone. I picked off a vulture relatively easily but then had to take on a python for lack of smaller targets. My shields went fairly quickly (1.7m CR shield generator plus 2x 260k CR boosters) and my military grade hull went down to 50% soon after. I decided to get clear of the area to fight another day so hit the boost. Seems I was too late. Within the space of approximately 4 seconds my canopy shattered, my hull collapsed and my ship was destroyed. Ouch. And so to the insurance screen.

It was at this point that the true enormity of what had just happened started to dawn on me. I had 240k or so in the bank. I needed around 1.6m to recover my ship. I could borrow up to 1m so was around 350k short. In a round about way the screen was telling me I had to pretty much go back to where I'd been 8 weeks before. Having read the summary judgements made of so many others that have suffered the same fate I'm not so naive as to expect sympathy. Apparently, many are of the opinion that leaving dock without enough money to rebuy your ship is 'stupid'. That's a bit harsh, even if one is fully appraised of the insurance screen maths. Of course with hindsight there is no way I would have done so myself but the fact is I didn't appreciate the risk I was taking. I bought the game, starting playing it and referred to the user manual as and when I needed to in order to find controls etc. I did not study the manual as if for an exam and so was not forewarned. And so to the point of this post which is to suggest possible improvements in this area:

1. I gather the insurance is set at 5% of the ship cost. In my case the insurance was around 1.6m so must have included cover for the upgraded FSD (5m CR), thrusters (5m CR), power plant (5m CR) etc. Yet I did not have the option to take stock versions of these components which would have significantly reduced the insurance cost. Even deselecting all the available loadouts did not reduce the insurance cost sufficiently. Surely I should have the option to take stock versions of these very expensive items if it means I can avoid a total reset.

2. I had a Cobra MKIII in storage and worth around 400k. I think there should be the option to trade in any stored ships in order to make up the required insurance premium and/or reduce an expensive loan.

3. With ships worth such huge amounts of credits, 1m seems a bit light as the upper limit for a loan.

4. In recognition of the fact that people tend not to study the user manual before taking to the skies I think giving them some kind of active warning that they have insufficient cash to recover their ship would be greatly appreciated or, at the very least, dramatically reduce the amount of criticism of the game on this forum.
 
Sorry for your loss. Most people don't have insurance to cover their ship the first time out of a lack of knowledge..and easy game play mechanics at the lower levels of the game that do not give you an opportunity to fully understand the need for insurance...to many people lose their first ship at to high a level. You have learned a valuable lesson.

I disagree with your suggestions...but good luck with the effort!
 
Recovery is easy as never, you should already have some trade/combat/explorer ranks and so you get more from the missions. Just go to a place where you have high faction, you should be able to recover quickly.
 
I'm not so naive as to expect sympathy.

Well, you can have my sympathy. :(
Take heart. It will not take you nearly as long to get back to where you were as it took you in the first place. When you decide to come back.
You only uninstalled the game on your machine. You will still have your Cobra to come back to. And your experience.
I learn by hard knocks too. ;)
 
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Ok, honest serious reply I agree with the principal that new players do not appreciate the risks until they fall foul of the system.

Part 1) I don't really agree since it has been experienced many times where people have sold a powerplant or FSD and been unable to buy a good enough one to leave that system effectively gounding the ship. Leads to complaints...
Part 2) I kind of agree you should be able to sell ships but for an increased loss (say 70% value instead of the normal 90% when selling) I hasten to add I would not want this extended to selling individual modules to effectively downgrade ships to afford insurance.
Part 3) I thought since 1.3 update the loan limit is linked to your ranking or did I misread the patch notes?
Part 4) Fully agreed, make people aware and ridicule them for being silly not for lacking knowledge ;)

You made the very smart move of having a backup cobra so as to not be booted right back to the sidewinder :)
Although I personally learnt about the insurance screen in my Hauler (first new ship) I am still surprised many people get into multi-million credit ships without experiencing it, I can understand having a Cobra or T6 and not having died but getting to Vulture/Clipper levels I'd expect everyone to have died at least once and worked out the screen costs...
 
Here, have my sympathy, I feel for you mate.

I did fly my python without insurance once - but I was fully aware what I was doing. No fights whatsoever if I could avoid it, and every docking was very very careful until I made back the 3 mil needed :)
Was thrilling too.

1m loan? that's nice. I only had 600k at that time, I think they upped it at some point in 1.3.

Also, for me there's a very important lesson to learn - don't run at 50% hull. Run at 10% shields. Especially in combat zones where new enemy ships arrive constantly.
 
Maybe the outfitting screen which is currently lacking many details about the modules should show one more detail - the insurance cost to expect when changing a specific piece of equipment.
But then again... ED has had months to implement more detailed module descriptions (what does a class 3 interdictor better then a class 1 - the screen won't tell you... one of many modules missing proper explanations) yet they did not.
 
4. In recognition of the fact that people tend not to study the user manual before taking to the skies I think giving them some kind of active warning that they have insufficient cash to recover their ship would be greatly appreciated or, at the very least, dramatically reduce the amount of criticism of the game on this forum.

Key #4 Status Its there for all to see

Now you have a good grasp of play a rebuild should be a lot faster and good luck with that.
 
Hmmm, There needs to be a way so I can ignore insurance and if it all goes wrong there is still a way to get out of it like it doesnt matter..

1 rule of elite, dont fly what you cant afford.

Break that rule and accept the consequences.

I dont believe you didnt know you had to have insurance, you just thought you wouldnt die so why bother.
 
I lost a lot of ships at the beginning, Haulers and Adders mainly and at one time ended up in a standard sidewinder when I didn't have the insurance excess. The main thing was I made and paid for my mistakes early on.

Like you I took the path of combat but I spent several weeks in a Cobra MK III and went through about three of them, but always had enough credits to get my original loadout. All the while improved my combat skills before upgrading to a Vulture. Each ship is very different and it makes sense to start combat in a cheap ride and let your skill grow you out of that. With each new ship there is a certain learning curve before you get the hang of handling characteristics, heat management, weapon management, shield/shield cell bank management so it pays to go easy at first before throwing caution to the wind.

Even without saying anything I think you've learnt your lesson so you'll come back older and wiser and a better player.
 
Searching the forum it appears that many people have fallen foul of being unable to pay the insurance to regain their ship after destruction. I joined their ranks a couple of days ago

It's a pain, but those ranks you refer to are quite large now I think. At least now you can see exactly what the rebuy cost is rather than having to manually work it out.
 
The OP is right that people don't really appreciate the risk until it happens to them, but the fact is even if a big clearly explained warning sign came up if you tried to launch without enough to cover your insurance and you had to click YES to accept the risk, people would STILL do it and STILL come on here to complain afterwards.
 
1. I gather the insurance is set at 5% of the ship cost. In my case the insurance was around 1.6m so must have included cover for the upgraded FSD (5m CR), thrusters (5m CR), power plant (5m CR) etc. Yet I did not have the option to take stock versions of these components which would have significantly reduced the insurance cost. Even deselecting all the available loadouts did not reduce the insurance cost sufficiently. Surely I should have the option to take stock versions of these very expensive items if it means I can avoid a total reset.
You do have this option. You can deselect the components you don't to get back, and they will revert to stock. You could have taken a completely stock asp if that was all you could afford.

Also the curse of the asp strikes again. The asp is usually the first ship you can lose so that's the most common. Just know it could have been a lot worse, I remember a thread where someone lost an anaconda that was worth over 200 million.
 
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Thanks everyone for all the suggestions and philosophical encouragement - very impressed by the speed and quality of responses.


Even with the imagination of someone much younger than me the buy/sell cycle gets pretty monotonous pretty quickly so I haven't yet decided whether I'll come back to the game. But as I said, I'm not looking for sympathy. The key point is around the balance of people's reaction in general and the trade-off affecting FD's bottom line. For some, features like the one I highlighted might mean the 'fun per hour' is not enough for them to continue playing. For others it might be this degree of harsh realism that sets ED apart and makes it worth playing. It's up to FD to make the judgements that they feel will ensure the second group has the greater numbers. I absolutely loved Elite in the 80s and I'm sure you'll succeed.
 
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