Is dying in Odyssey meant to be so punitive?

Pernicious

P
So, just re-started playing ED after a 3+ year break. I thought I'd spend a few weeks building back up some decent ships and cash reserves before trying the Odyssey part. The time to try ground combat for the first time was last night. I had heard that your ship can get destroyed when you're on the ground, so I took an Apex shuttle to the target location.

Went through the mission, killed the target, tried to find somewhere to take cover while I summoned the shuttle, and promptly died as I got flanked waiting for the shuttle. No problem. That's the reason I keep a cash reserve right? Must be like rebuying. Only $4k credits in fines and bounties? Easy! They must like not punishing newbies too hard. Nope.

I get revived on The Penitent... Almost 400Ly from where I died. Tried to summon my Python. 1h 5m away... Okay, I'll catch an Apex back. Nope. Too long a distance. sigh I'll manually plot multiple Apex shuttles. Nope, no drop off points for a huge section between me and my Python. Okay, summon my Python and go to bed.

Next morning, Python is in. Ah crap, I had configured it for combat, so very heavy mass, and no fuel scoop. So, I plot refueling stations, and finally get my ship back to civilisation. Probably overall close to 3 hours of not being able to play, just for trying a ground combat mission for the first time? That's harsh.

Okay, there has to be a way around this. What are they? Do I:

1. Always fly my own ship instead of taking the shuttle? (Do I then get the choice to spawn on my ship, rather than in The Penitent? Or do I always spawn on The Penitent?)
2. Only do combat missions near The Penitent?
3. Make sure my explorer ship is the last ship I use before trying combat missions?
4. Leave a spare ship at The Penitent?
5. Git Gud and not die?

ED has always had a very steep learning curve and relies on learning from external sites/communities. This is no different, and I think I was a bit foolish not doing my own research before trying my first combat mission. But I'm trying to fix that now. So to you, dear community: What's the tips for getting into ground combat?
 

Elpapo

Elpapo
Pernicious said:
1. Always fly my own ship instead of taking the shuttle? (Do I then get the choice to spawn on my ship, rather than in The Penitent? Or do I always spawn on The Penitent?)
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You probly had bounty on you, thats why u spawned at penal station. Otherwise if you die while having own ship, you will respawn at it. But if you get wanted by any chance, u might still end up in penal station.

In oddy, its never bad to use own ship instead of shuttle. Small ships are very good for this, and having some dumbfires can be helpfull to deal with ground forces if you find overwhelmed by them. Those can be fitted for jumping range, while having options to deal with ground forces. But dont sleep on shields, cuz ground forces can deal quite bit of damage, and if u left paper thin shields to some squad to shoot at it, they destory it rather quickly.
Pernicious said:
2. Only do combat missions near The Penitent?
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not really
Pernicious said:
3. Make sure my explorer ship is the last ship I use before trying combat missions?
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If you sure that u will die, why not.
Pernicious said:
4. Leave a spare ship at The Penitent?
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Having spares in diffrent part of bubble, surely will decrease waiting time.
Pernicious said:
5. Git Gud and not die?
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Yes.
 

metatheurgist

metatheurgist
Yeah, most of us have ships specifically built for Ody. Another alternative is to ask a friend to give you a lift.

The black screen of ship entry is basically X seconds of them making free attacks on you, so, don't do it unless you are sure you can survive. Maybe pop a shield grenade first? Never tried that one. 🤷‍♂️
 

Pernicious

P
Elpapo said:
You probly had bounty on you, thats why u spawned at penal station. Otherwise if you die while having own ship, you will respawn at it. But if you get wanted by any chance, u might still end up in penal station.
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Pretty sure the only bounties I had on me were the ones I gained from assassinating the target I was sent to assassinate. A friend who also restarted at the same time (but jumped straight into the Odyssey part) also mentioned that he found that weird. Is that just part of being an illegal mission? If you die, you are guaranteed to wind up at a penal station?
 

Pernicious

P
metatheurgist said:
Yeah, most of us have ships specifically built for Ody. Another alternative is to ask a friend to give you a lift.

The black screen of ship entry is basically X seconds of them making free attacks on you, so, don't do it unless you are sure you can survive. Maybe pop a shield grenade first? Never tried that one. 🤷‍♂️
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Thanks for that. What type of ship do you use for Ody missions? Something specific about them? Are they just cheap ships with a very low rebuy?
 

Ned Flandalorian

N
Pernicious said:
Pretty sure the only bounties I had on me were the ones I gained from assassinating the target I was sent to assassinate. A friend who also restarted at the same time (but jumped straight into the Odyssey part) also mentioned that he found that weird. Is that just part of being an illegal mission? If you die, you are guaranteed to wind up at a penal station?
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Yes. If you die anywhere where you are currently wanted, you'll be sent to prison.
 

Luriant

Luriant
Pernicious said:
Interesting... Sounds a bit abusable though?
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Yep. Leaving a station or planetary dock? This tool give unobstructed jump, without any planet or star between you and your destination. Useful for some rescues.

FC near the stargoid? Use the Escape pods for a quick return to the bubble, and apex shuttle, see Reienadi planetary Collision, and use the Stuck option to return to your Fleet Carrier/Ship system at 2000Ly

But was the old "Load the game in Horizons", the change is that onfoot+apex+escape pods , increase the distance with your ship system, something impossible before.
 

Northpin

Northpin
Pernicious said:
Thanks for that. What type of ship do you use for Ody missions? Something specific about them?
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I use a specifically crafted DBX - due to a combination of factors, like:
  • small ship (to be able to land/autoland at any settlement and to minimize hangar run)
  • best jump range,
  • size 4 srv hangar (so i have a spare srv on board),
  • on-foot back entrance (to minimize hangar run for certain stations with hangar back exit/entrance)
  • solid shields
  • solid mix of weapons to allow both ship combat and ground attack

iCourier is nice too, it has better shields, but lesser jump range, lesser firepower, no size 4 slot for the Srv Hangar
Viper Mk4 also nice, but also lesser shields (although it can be used as a hulltank with quite success) and forward on-foot boarding - which means increased hangar run distance
 

SteveWW57

SteveWW57
Odyssey has given the small ships a new lease of life.

For fighting in ground CZs, any small ships can be used (even a Sidey), but good jump range (to get to where the conflicts are) is useful, and one or two SRV bays for Scarabs (why is another discussion). Land at the CZ, drive out in the SRV, dismiss ship and drive SRV close to settlement, dismount and fight. The SRV offers an extra supply point/sanctuary, and if you get critically injured when you return in a drop ship, it may or may not get destroyed.

Doing assassinations you can use the SRV to drive to the settlement, do the business and leave. Even if you have to flee and abandon the SRV, it's only 5k credits to replace.

I have amongst others, an iEagle as a ship to deliver my CMDR to the action, as well as the aforementioned Sidey. Keelback and T6 get used, but I find a Dolphin very good for Ody work.

Steve
 
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Disemboweled Ego

D
Is dying in Odyssey meant to be so punitive?
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Probably not intentionally so since it's just a mess of systems interacting with each other that result in this.

You can see vestiges of other ideas like holding cells in security areas that would be a way to not send you 400Ly away, but with other things like Odyssey murders not giving notoriety and ship impounding working differently some patches later it's uncertain if it those were a bug or feature intended from the start.

From a game design perspective it might be worth making it punitive on purpose to stretch out what little content odyssey had and implementing quality of life features would take genuine extra effort so let the players suffer I guess.
 

Screemonster

Screemonster
Welcome to "the crime and punishment system is way more punishing against regular players who commit incidental crimes during gameplay than it is against career criminals and gankers". It's been a problem with the game for a long time, it's only become apparent to most players under Odyssey because odyssey has crimes actually worth committing.
 

Jmanis

Jmanis
Screemonster said:
Welcome to "the crime and punishment system is way more punishing against regular players who commit incidental crimes during gameplay than it is against career criminals and gankers". It's been a problem with the game for a long time, it's only become apparent to most players under Odyssey because odyssey has crimes actually worth committing.
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💯

To the thread title, arguably, non-Ody isn't punitive enough... but that's because non-Ody crime isn't incentivised like it should be... as opposed to Ody where being wanted/ hostile is comparably less of an issue... if you know how to manage that.
 
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