Its to empty and marketed wrong

Ok so first let me start off saying Elite has solid gameplay in form of ship to ship combat for most part. However, Elite is being marketed as an MMO, when it should be touted as space sandbox with multiplayer functionality. I also have huge issue with how empty the game is. If the human population is large enough to have stations in so many star systems, not including inhabited planets, then there should be way more traffic though out the galaxy than there currently is. There also should fleets floating around controlled space of each of the respected factions. The fact that I fly to a star system that has multiple stations (as well as a couple outpost) and yet there is only a handful of ships in the system is a huge issue. The galaxy is massive no argument, and i get the concept of fringe space, but the "settled" part of the galaxy should feel a lot more populated and active then it is currently portrayed. If these station are as big as made out to be, from size, scope, design, then why aren't there more ships flying around, especially if the markets and what they offer and "need/demand" there would be more pilots than the "elite". Simply put its seems Elite has fallen into the same trap most open world/sandbox games do and that is the feeling of emptiness with lack of ambiance and feeling like a living breathing place. Someone also made a valid point of why inhabited worlds you don't see city lights on the darkside.

The other gripe I have is the fact this is supposed to be or has been marketed as an mmo. This game doesn't feel anything like an mmo, persistent universe sure, mmo not a chance in hell as an mmo is just that massive multiplayer online and yet there is a significant lack of multiplayer features and functions. There is no common "watering holes" where the player base would/could congregate to swap tales, find groups to explore with etc. Ships being, especially early on, so limited by jump range makes it that much more difficult to get around and possibly meet up with fellow players. I still have yet to get my free eagle b/c where it was stored and where I started there is 179ly b/w me and it and in sidey I'm locked into an island of star systems. The island factor is biggest issue, which goes into previous point of emptiness, we have these factions that are to believed that we are in their controlled sector of the galaxy except for the fact seems they don't have the ships or man power to patrol their territory so how can they possibly "control it". Also if it is there sector where are the military stations where is the capitols/central hub of influence. This would be a perfect example/opportunity where they could create "watering holes" as each faction would have a central place where command decisions are made and good chuck of population that belongs to it would be. Then they'd have forward operating bases spread out among their territory. This could fix the island issue of jump limitations by having these installations having hyper gates which would allow for jumping beyond a ships normal range and get to central point of faction space and meet up with other players before heading back out into fringe space.

These are my two biggest gripes we are made to believe we have these controlling factions and that man has spread out among the galaxy and yet seems only but the select few are able to fly a damn space ship when you have stations supporting a few hundred thousand to a few million people but only but a few can/know how to pilot a ship. Overall I'm getting bored quickly as seems I can travel around a "explore" or trade, and on rare occasion interact/combat with another ship, and even more rare with another human player. Having a whole galaxy to explore sounded awesome at first, but its becoming clear that having such a large play space with out design to create areas of interest where the player base can meet up and congregate and one doesn't feel like one of the only living being in the galaxy. I'm not saying there isn't lonely parts of the galaxy out there and there should be, but in "controlled" space of a faction it should be bustling with ships travelling around as well as seeing a military presence other than the occasional "federation fighter or security force" there would be fleets of ships to control the space, and so the capital ships wouldn't be that rare and in fact they rarely would travel alone.

I'm hoping Elite will evolve into something great but as it stands its an empty soulless game, as well as being touted as something its clearly (at least at this point) is not and its not by any means an MMO it is simply a gigantic empty space sandbox with sporadic multiplayer in its current form. So with that said I agree with those claiming game should be delayed and not released in current form especially if release will not contain all/most features including the 25 ships stated to be rdy and available at release. If I were honest I'd say if I could get a refund I would, the progress made from when I jumped in PB2 to now hasn't been impressive wow they increased the galaxy size but any real features that matter, and actually helped the game design has been small, yes they fixed bugs, yes they add little features here and there that added upto a better experience, but overall feel game is being rushed out for whatever reasons vs getting the galaxy or that of controlled space feeling a bit livelier as well adding in systems needed in order to allow multiplayer, especially that of co-op, to truly exist in game..
 
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I gotta agree, 400 billion stars is a great marketing term, but it's way too big compared to number of players. There is very little human interaction, and there's no fun in trolling NPC's.
 
There have not been any injected events yet. Once that happens you will see many players gravitating towards those events looking for action.

I can see the point you are trying to make but there have been a bazillion "everything is empty and nothing is going on" threads but the game has not even launched yet and we have yet to see what FDEV have up their sleeve. If you haven't seen something along the lines of "OMG, go to this system a war has just kicked off!" or similar a week or two after launch then that is the time for these posts.

Most of those 400 billion stars are for explorers who have no interest seeing other players. I expect injected events and the like to lead the rest of us adrenaline junkies around by the nose ;)
 
The game hasn't launched. They'd be silly to inject large amounts of stuff NOW. I'd expect a couple tests before release, but they're definitely not going to burn their powder early on.
 
I do believe pushing it as an MMO has given some people the wrong ideas. The misconceptions are numerous as Triffids, after a meteor-rainy day.
 
Most of those 400 billion stars are for explorers who have no interest seeing other players. I expect injected events and the like to lead the rest of us adrenaline junkies around by the nose ;)

This, remember traders are going to be near the more built up systems, pirates will be near there as a result, which will bring the bounty hunters.

I suspect (and this is me guessing) that as more players are in an area, say near a mix of empire and fed systems: players will start getting hired by one side to mess with the other. The other side will do the same. Hopefully then conflict zones will form, blockades will happen and then WARRRRRRRR! Traders will be able to do desperate food runs for the civilians (those who care about "Human cost" I mean) and others will ship the supplies for the war machine. Luxuries will sky rocket in value and possible become prohibited (a frequent control in war times in the past on Earth) thus bringing in the smugglers.

Of course no war zone is complete without deserters (npcs) and pirates and privateers feeding on the increased shipping carrying war materials. So of course bounty hunters will be employed and it'll be a good time for everyone.

I hope....
 
I agree that ED should not be marketed as an MMO. It's really not.

I disagree that it's empty and soulless however. I think there's a mindset that games must have tons of quests which lead you along some sort of path to advancement. Some sort of goal. I prefer a free, open environment in which the player sets there own path and goals.

I actually enjoy just playing the game. The actual playing of it: flying, trading, missions, exploration, combat, upgrading, etc. I do not need some artificial story or goal at all. I just love playing a modern space flight sim. That's why I find it so confusing when people ask, "But WHY am I flying, docking, fighting? What's the point?"

The point is that it's fun. Playing the game is the point.
 
Agree with the OP to a point. It is all marketed wrong and all that does is setup expectations that will fail miserably leading nowhere good for anyone (people will feel ripped off, they will trash the game, less future players... although it may boost sales in the short term no one wins in the long term).
 
This, remember traders are going to be near the more built up systems, pirates will be near there as a result, which will bring the bounty hunters.

More built up systems? almost every star styem i've come across has at least one station if not a couple outpost, only few sporadic ones have i seen with nothing but stars planets and such. so no sure how or what qualifies as more "built up" systems vs others. I can also agree with those talking about injected events, but again how does one get there if the events are happening 100+ly away and all one has or chooses to have is an eagle. Those saying its not out yet don't understand this is the time you would push system to max to find what system can and cannot handle not after release and yet I've not seen it ever very populated except during PB2 when play area was small, Beta1 wasn't bad, then beta2 from then on became emptier and now its a graveyard.
 
Another whine thread... *sigh*
If you're bored you should probably play something else. Trust me, FD wont suffer. There's plenty of dedicated players who love where the game is heading, but maybe you're right. Maybe the game is marketed wrong, because after all, it attracted you guys! Which in my opinion is regrettable to say the least.

Half the whiners are whining because they want an offline mode and don't want it to be an MMO, the other half wants more MMO. As I said, FD wont suffer because a few rotten eggs leave, in fact the forums would be a lot cleaner for it. So don't let the door hit you on your way out, thanks.
 
I think we should separate the MMO aspect from the emptiness, as they're related but different.

Even if it was a completely offline single player game, it still wouldn't make much sense (as the OP says) that you have systems with populations of billions, but very very very little ship traffic, and very little going on around the planets. You'd reasonably expect to see many stations, ship repair yards etc etc. They don't have to DO anything, but it's a bit hard to believe in what we see now.

And I know it's not launched yet, but it will be 'live' very soon so I do think these are valid criticisms (which sadly are very unlikely to be addressed before 16.12.2014). Hopefully FDev will address it post launch, and hopefully the reviews concentrate on the positives (of which there are many!).
 
I think we should separate the MMO aspect from the emptiness, as they're related but different.

Even if it was a completely offline single player game, it still wouldn't make much sense (as the OP says) that you have systems with populations of billions, but very very very little ship traffic, and very little going on around the planets. You'd reasonably expect to see many stations, ship repair yards etc etc. They don't have to DO anything, but it's a bit hard to believe in what we see now.

Playing devil's advocate here but lets not forget this is a GAME and as such gameplay concerns should be at the forefront. Yes, nice little things like planets having lights on their darkside would be a nice touch to immersion, however... do you really want over 9000 ships displayed on your radar when flying around?
 
I am not trying to be a fanboi or white knight..but the 'emptiness' is more a function of missing the faction based events...and all that this entails. The hope is that the injected events leads to emergent and scripted game play. Unfortunately, we have to wait until the 16th. As far as the MMO complaint...yeah, there's that.
 
More built up systems? almost every star styem i've come across has at least one station if not a couple outpost, only few sporadic ones have i seen with nothing but stars planets and such. so no sure how or what qualifies as more "built up" systems vs others. I can also agree with those talking about injected events, but again how does one get there if the events are happening 100+ly away and all one has or chooses to have is an eagle. Those saying its not out yet don't understand this is the time you would push system to max to find what system can and cannot handle not after release and yet I've not seen it ever very populated except during PB2 when play area was small, Beta1 wasn't bad, then beta2 from then on became emptier and now its a graveyard.

I've stumbled across a few systems with multiple "large stations", multiple commodities markets, selling different items and a high tech world nearby. I imagine these are the sorts of things that will attract players. You should note that the play area has gotten larger, but the player base hasn't increased yet (yes more beta buyers, but not the type of increase I suspect FD is hoping for). Players, by in large are cattle like in their desire to be around each other and ED will end up with Jita-esque area after a little while. Obviously ED will have to step up with some events and things like that. If they don't, people will be sad and the game may fail.
 
Overall I'm getting bored quickly as seems I can travel around a "explore" or trade, and on rare occasion interact/combat with another ship, and even more rare with another human player. Having a whole galaxy to explore sounded awesome at first, but its becoming clear that having such a large play space with out design to create areas of interest where the player base can meet up and congregate and one doesn't feel like one of the only living being in the galaxy. I'm not saying there isn't lonely parts of the galaxy out there and there should be, but in "controlled" space of a faction it should be bustling with ships travelling around as well as seeing a military presence other than the occasional "federation fighter or security force" there would be fleets of ships to control the space, and so the capital ships wouldn't be that rare and in fact they rarely would travel alone.

I'm hoping Elite will evolve into something great but as it stands its an empty soulless game, as well as being touted as something its clearly (at least at this point) is not and its not by any means an MMO it is simply a gigantic empty space sandbox with sporadic multiplayer in its current form. So with that said I agree with those claiming game should be delayed and not released in current form especially if release will not contain all/most features including the 25 ships stated to be rdy and available at release. If I were honest I'd say if I could get a refund I would, the progress made from when I jumped in PB2 to now hasn't been impressive wow they increased the galaxy size but any real features that matter, and actually helped the game design has been small, yes they fixed bugs, yes they add little features here and there that added upto a better experience, but overall feel game is being rushed out for whatever reasons vs getting the galaxy or that of controlled space feeling a bit livelier as well adding in systems needed in order to allow multiplayer, especially that of co-op, to truly exist in game..

I agree with you on this wholeheartedly. The foundation is good for an amazing sandbox, but it lacks essential social tools of an MMO and doesn't have enough filler content. The gigantic stations lack life and activity. The Empire and Federation are only superficially different.

When this game is released, there will be many more complaints like this, because people expect basic MMO features.
 
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first.. way too long post for the content it has, tbh

also you seem to have not informed yourself very well before buying into a beta. DB says in several interviews that space is vast and you will meet other players only occassionally.

i agree that it's not a common MMO and shouldn't be advertised as such. it will dissapoint customers like you, because what you describe sounds very mcuh like the usual MMO concept.
and i don't think i want that. that cold feeling of vastness and loneliness is very much intended.

i would also agree it should feel more alive at some points. although not in the way you describe it, but still. on the other hand, in my starting system there have been many players and also NPCs, so that i had at one point the impression of a space highway.
 
Expectation management problem here?

I don't want ED to be an "MMO" in the Eve sense. That would be like re-creating a special kind of hell all over again. Also I would wait 18 months before you start playing again if you don't like it now.

This is one of the reasons I didn't play ED through beta by the way (paid up at kickstarter, just started playing a few weeks ago). It'll start to bore you before it's even released won't it.

Take a break and come back later.
 
Playing devil's advocate here but lets not forget this is a GAME and as such gameplay concerns should be at the forefront. Yes, nice little things like planets having lights on their darkside would be a nice touch to immersion, however... do you really want over 9000 ships displayed on your radar when flying around?

Yeah. I agree. Actually, I almost made the same point myself... ;-) I think the scanner would need some serious work to handle a 'realistic' simulation of an Elite universe, and probably it'd be a bit of a nightmare. But I do think the OP has a point. TBH if the system populations were scaled down, it'd already make a bit more sense.... After all, with all that space, maybe people WOULD choose to spread out more?
 
The problem is MMO legitimately describes the game
Massively (400bn Star systems... can't get more massively)
Multiplayer (Yep, we are there, we are all playing the same game and can attack each other)
Online (Altho some wish otherwise, it definitely is)

Now, because there is more that affects that it could be dragged out after that but SAYING "Sandbox" is intrinsically undefined and most don't know what it is and would cause some to have to look it up and get that's it... well... see "Massively" again but don't work from a marketing side.

MMO is a self-defined and correct term, however people have played other MMO that are different in how they deal with it, but they are different.. and not Elite. Elite deals with it is a different way but that doesn't make it any less a MMO, just it deals with in a different way.

Now, back to marketing... using what the game IS and using words that actually SELL the product that can't be vague and unknown... how would you suggest it be properly listed? Let's see your marketing point of view.... (realize we are looking for ways to sell it, in a good way, and we will try and poke holes it)
 
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