Except why? Why would an advanced multi million year species that show a clear technological advantage suddenly resort to subterfuge? There's no indication it was necessary against the Guardians who soundly beat them. Why would an insect like hive mind who clearly have zero problems just throwing enough numbers at things as a military tactic suddenly change things up?
That seems to more point to me that it's either a manipulation from The Club for their own personal gain, or the situation is true and there has been a societal upset in Thargoids.
Well if it wasnt subterfuge and the Oresrian Klaxian Civil war is real, then the Oresrians have already come to Humanity to learn better tactics to use against the Klaxians, so already past the just throwing enough numbers at things as a military tactic.
The Guardian logs suggested that the Thargoid were unprepared for a conflict of such magnitude with the Guardians.
They were forced to withdraw against Humanity by the Mycoid last time.
I would think an advanced multi million year species that show a clear technological advantage will plan to adapt, however "unsuited" to adaption they might be, as twice a clear technological advantage paired with just throwing enough numbers at things has not worked.
Well if it wasnt subterfuge and the Oresrian Klaxian Civil war is real, then the Oresrians have already come to Humanity to learn better tactics to use against the Klaxians, so already past the just throwing enough numbers at things as a military tactic.
The Guardian logs suggested that the Thargoid were unprepared for a conflict of such magnitude with the Guardians.
They were forced to withdraw against Humanity by the Mycoid last time.
I would think an advanced multi million year species that show a clear technological advantage will plan to adapt, however "unsuited" to adaption they might be, as twice a clear technological advantage paired with just throwing enough numbers at things has not worked.
I know, hence why I said there's been a societal change which explains the modification of their strategy, but without a societal shift the change is bizarre.
I know what the logs suggest. That's my actual point. They didn't try and use subterfuge in a fight they were losing. If we class the introduction of the virus under the same lens, why the change in tactics when they didn't against the Guardians, especially as the logs also suggest this wasn't a brief conflict?
I would argue that a multi million year old technologically advanced species is the exact opposite of adaptable. They keep repeating the same patterns over and over again. Seed an area. Come back to claim that area. Fight anyone living there. Territorial overwhelming numbers like the social insects they supposedly act like It's slightly reasonable to assume they win in most cases (if we assume there's been more than 3 sentient species to advance to galaxy level) given the whole idea that only victors get to write about it.
I know, hence why I said there's been a societal change which explains the modification of their strategy, but without a societal shift the change is bizarre.
I know what the logs suggest. That's my actual point. They didn't try and use subterfuge in a fight they were losing. If we class the introduction of the virus under the same lens, why the change in tactics when they didn't against the Guardians, especially as the logs also suggest this wasn't a brief conflict?
I would argue that a multi million year old technologically advanced species is the exact opposite of adaptable. They keep repeating the same patterns over and over again. Seed an area. Come back to claim that area. Fight anyone living there. Territorial overwhelming numbers like the social insects they supposedly act like It's slightly reasonable to assume they win in most cases (if we assume there's been more than 3 sentient species to advance to galaxy level) given the whole idea that only victors get to write about it.
In Out of the Darkness, the "Oresrian" Thargoids do contact a Human to work together to create Super Pilots, to study their tactics to then use them against the Klaxian Thargoids, so we already have that adaption in Canon.
Yes they come to Humanity as they say they need our innovation, but it does show a willingness to adapt and seek out solutions.
We also know in the Codex there are multiple queens, and with Agony Aunts post above marking suggesting different Clans, then that suggests even Thargoid society is not a pure monolith, leaving to different points of views and internal competition.
The difference would be the number of Queens is vastly smaller than the number of Humans so the potential for innovation is smaller.
As to the exact details of the Guardian Thargoid War.
As you say, we have it written by the Guardians so is only their point of view.
They state the Thargoids were not interested in negotiations but we don't know what terms the Guardians offered.
After all the Guardians are not the nicest of civilizations either, destroying it's own for wrong think, and having a hunting based society, might have considered the Thargoids prey animals that should submit for all we know.
All I am saying is that reason they gave in Out of the Darkness is a lie for their own ends.
In Out of the Darkness, the "Oresrian" Thargoids do contact a Human to work together to create Super Pilots, to study their tactics to then use them against the Klaxian Thargoids, so we already have that adaption in Canon.
Yes they come to Humanity as they say they need our innovation, but it does show a willingness to adapt and seek out solutions.
We also know in the Codex there are multiple queens, and with Agony Aunts post above marking suggesting different Clans, then that suggests even Thargoid society is not a pure monolith, leaving to different points of views and internal competition.
The difference would be the number of Queens is vastly smaller than the number of Humans so the potential for innovation is smaller.
As to the exact details of the Guardian Thargoid War.
As you say, we have it written by the Guardians so is only their point of view.
They state the Thargoids were not interested in negotiations but we don't know what terms the Guardians offered.
After all the Guardians are not the nicest of civilizations either, destroying it's own for wrong think, and having a hunting based society, might have considered the Thargoids prey animals that should submit for all we know.
All I am saying is that reason they gave in Out of the Darkness is a lie for their own ends.
Again, the adaption by definition is from a societal change because of a civil war. The concept of them lying without the change is what is bizarre. Either the civil war exists, and a change in society can explain a change in tactics and therefore the Oresrians exist, or the civil war is a lie, the Oresrians don't exist and the change in behaviour makes no sense.
Multiple queens doesn't prove there's different opinions, and the markings about clans is speculation and still doesn't prove there's different opinions.
I don't see any evidence of them lying, or why they would change their tactics now.
Yes it is written from their point of view. Why would they not point out any attempt at lying? Nothing about Guardian society at the time of the Thargoid conflict suggests them twisting fact to suit the victors point of view. Their society was open with little to no laws about information sharing and working together. The issues you raise all came after.
I think the point of a change in tactics is to get the enemy to teach you their tactics so you can defeat them. If you know what they will do it's easier to defeat them. In otherwords they are lieing about their identity.
Maybe they always lie. And it would be hard to find evidence of liars if they are always winning. They tend to hide that.
Klaxians and Oresians (as presented in the book rather than as separate species as per the Dark Wheel) were lore at the time. Since then, it's not clear whether this story has been modified given only 'Thargoids' have appeared in game.
The spilt between the Thargoids and Oresians was lore right from the start (2012) as this is also mentioned in T. james' book "Out of the Darkness"
