[Lore] Some questions about the socioeconomics of Elite's time period, and the effects on RP

This is my first post in this board, so OOC as well, I guess. I've lightly RP'd a character since starting the game, but my knowledge of ED's lore is fairly minimal, and broadly shaped as I go along, e.g. it started simply wanting to give context/motivation for why my character wanted to access the Sol system.

So, to the questions, and the general topic.

Is there any official source for the kind of socioeconomics that relate to ship pilots and ownership? As in; how common would it be, how large a proportion of a population group would either want to and/or be able to fly, how challenging is it to gain a Pilot's Federation license, how expensive would ships be relative to income, etc.

Gaining insight into that socioeconomic framework would, surely, unavoidably shape all RP's to varying degrees, and it's never been something I've thought about; I obviously considered my character's ethics and morality, but never their socioeconomic status.

...as an aside, the Sidewinder even poses some problems, because it arguably limits scope for that status, e.g. if your character is from a hugely wealthy family, it doesn't make sense that that hunk of relative junk would be one's first craft (unless there's another lore reason for why that's the player's first craft. I remember Frontier had something about a ship being passed down to you).

And as a more personal note regarding other people's RP's; however you view or treat the economics, what on earth does your character 'do' in their off time, in terms of making a wage? And how do you resolve the problem of a never changing balance, i.e. the cost of daily/weekly/monthly living is never reflected? Perhaps the balance we see in-game can be seen as a kind of ringfenced earnings, somehow related to the licence all players have? That's an explanation for what's seen in the game, but it's a fairly ridiculous notion in terms of how a galactic economy functions.
 
These are interesting questions, and I'd like to learn the answers myself, if only for the novel I'm writing (the link is in my signature). As it stands, I mostly make it up as I go. I'd read Drew Wagar's Reclamation, and from that I gathered that "most" people aren't pilots, they're regular workers (officials, craftsmen, slaves, etc.) for the Federation or the Empire -- it certainly helped with giving me a better insight in how the Empire functions, but didn't really address the questions you'd asked.

You can read The Dark Wheel, which is the book that came with the original game, on Ian Bell's website:

http://www.iancgbell.clara.net/elite/dkwheel.htm
 
These are interesting questions, and I'd like to learn the answers myself, if only for the novel I'm writing (the link is in my signature). As it stands, I mostly make it up as I go. I'd read Drew Wagar's Reclamation, and from that I gathered that "most" people aren't pilots, they're regular workers (officials, craftsmen, slaves, etc.) for the Federation or the Empire -- it certainly helped with giving me a better insight in how the Empire functions, but didn't really address the questions you'd asked.

You can read The Dark Wheel, which is the book that came with the original game, on Ian Bell's website:

http://www.iancgbell.clara.net/elite/dkwheel.htm
Is lore going back that far still applicable to ED? Either way, thanks for the link, I wasn't aware of it.

Apparently the questions I asked either aren't easy to answer, or that not even most RP'ers care about them... which to me seems rather role-playing-ly negligent given the importance of socioeconomics.
 
Is lore going back that far still applicable to ED? Either way, thanks for the link, I wasn't aware of it.

Apparently the questions I asked either aren't easy to answer, or that not even most RP'ers care about them... which to me seems rather role-playing-ly negligent given the importance of socioeconomics.

Very little has been written about socio-economics in the lore of ED actually. There are some technology primers that were made available to the writers, but they are still NDA protected at the moment unfortunately. Space ship ownership is probably best related to house ownership nowadays, possibly the biggest expense an individual is likely to incur. However the economics of today can't be directly compared. Spacepilots, as a % of the entire human population, are a relatively small segment, but the scale of human habitation makes them seem very significant. They're perhaps more akin to owner/driver white van merchants.

Cheers,

Drew.
 
Not a lore expert but the FD galaxy is a dystopian vision of the future. Life appears to be cheap, constant rumbling warfare, slavery, famines and outbreaks. Do Frontier produce stats on the state of the galaxy that would probably help answer the question? E.g. numbers of people effected by various economic states per unit time etc.
 
Very little has been written about socio-economics in the lore of ED actually. There are some technology primers that were made available to the writers, but they are still NDA protected at the moment unfortunately. Space ship ownership is probably best related to house ownership nowadays, possibly the biggest expense an individual is likely to incur.
Ah, cheers for the reply, Drew - I don't think I've run across a post of yours here till now.

Frustratingly, if understandably, players view the universe of Elite through a tiny - and incredibly unrepresentative - window (quite literally... ). Also, one could argue what's in the game isn't representative of anything pertaining to the lore of a persistent, cohesive sci-fi universe, i.e. the economy the players engage with exists in a lore vacuum, merely to represent values plugged in to rewards, ranks, milestones-via-ships-purchased, and so on. A Sidewinder's dirt cheap in the game, but how does that 20 or 30K translate to a non-pilot or 'average' citizen?

Apropos currency: there surely must be denominations below a single credit. If a touch up of a spaceship's paintjob costs just 10Cr, then what the hell does a can of Space-Pepsi cost...

However the economics of today can't be directly compared. Spacepilots, as a % of the entire human population, are a relatively small segment, but the scale of human habitation makes them seem very significant. They're perhaps more akin to owner/driver white van merchants.
Are there any ballpark figures for the total population in human space?

But yeah, I suppose 'space truck simulator' might be the best general comparison, in terms of pilots being the connective lifeblood of a space-faring civilisation. Though our own truckers and commercial ferry/transport personnel don't have the options of refitting their assets on a whim and popping off to do some freelance auxiliary navy, bounty hunting, or privateer work...

Not a lore expert but the FD galaxy is a dystopian vision of the future. Life appears to be cheap, constant rumbling warfare, slavery, famines and outbreaks.
Hm, not sure I'd see FDev's virtual Milky Way as dystopian.

We see no stations going under, as it were. No global failures, no material withdrawal from systems, etc. The famines and outbreaks have no lasting consequences and exist as a variable in the BGS which temporarily affect adjacent variables/values (commodities, mission board options and/or availability, etc). I've no idea what the general quality of life might be, though, or how much it varies across the Sol bubble. Going from the game the human civilisation seems peculiarly - conveniently - quite homogenised.

Do Frontier produce stats on the state of the galaxy that would probably help answer the question? E.g. numbers of people effected by various economic states per unit time etc.
Any official added data or context would be interesting. Lore heavy socioeconomics don't ever seem to be a subject that features in the newsletters or Galnet, at least. ; -)
 
Ah, cheers for the reply, Drew - I don't think I've run across a post of yours here till now.

Frustratingly, if understandably, players view the universe of Elite through a tiny - and incredibly unrepresentative - window (quite literally... ). Also, one could argue what's in the game isn't representative of anything pertaining to the lore of a persistent, cohesive sci-fi universe, i.e. the economy the players engage with exists in a lore vacuum, merely to represent values plugged in to rewards, ranks, milestones-via-ships-purchased, and so on. A Sidewinder's dirt cheap in the game, but how does that 20 or 30K translate to a non-pilot or 'average' citizen?

Apropos currency: there surely must be denominations below a single credit. If a touch up of a spaceship's paintjob costs just 10Cr, then what the hell does a can of Space-Pepsi cost...

Are there any ballpark figures for the total population in human space?

But yeah, I suppose 'space truck simulator' might be the best general comparison, in terms of pilots being the connective lifeblood of a space-faring civilisation. Though our own truckers and commercial ferry/transport personnel don't have the options of refitting their assets on a whim and popping off to do some freelance auxiliary navy, bounty hunting, or privateer work...

Hm, not sure I'd see FDev's virtual Milky Way as dystopian.

We see no stations going under, as it were. No global failures, no material withdrawal from systems, etc. The famines and outbreaks have no lasting consequences and exist as a variable in the BGS which temporarily affect adjacent variables/values (commodities, mission board options and/or availability, etc). I've no idea what the general quality of life might be, though, or how much it varies across the Sol bubble. Going from the game the human civilisation seems peculiarly - conveniently - quite homogenised.

Any official added data or context would be interesting. Lore heavy socioeconomics don't ever seem to be a subject that features in the newsletters or Galnet, at least. ; -)

As for the moment, size of citizenships in systems is static, and if required tweaked manually by FD. They haven't given reasons why occupation sizes aren't part of BGS yet, but I will guess they will additional code and game design (you need to protect it against brigading, etc.). Also I suspect in larger scale of things what we do play little role (few hundred commanders doing refugee missions let's say in Lave most likely won't change numbers that much).

However, I am all for more feedback of what's going on in background in game. I really, really hope it is matter of core updates, that there's serious rethink how BGS impact game and vice versa. We have something, but want more.

As for total size of humanity I think there are calculated somewhere by some curious commanders, but that number are in tens of billions. Considering sold copies of game, and just who play game at once (let's say there are 100k commanders on active duty)....yeah, we are nothing ;) But sure our actions have impact. So yeah, some of that would be nice to see more just an 'mission completed' message.
 
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It's hard to get a handle on anything to do with the economics of the game. There have been several threads speculating about what a credit is worth and the estimates vary wildly depending on what commodity people base their figures on. It would be nice to know what the spending power of a credit is in the ED universe. For example if you went to a bar would a credit just be relatively small change or is it enough to buy a drink or a round of drinks, it may even be enough to treat everyone in the bar, we really don't know.
If you gave a waitress a 1 credit tip would you be seen as a cheapskate or would it be average or generous or even life changing?

Using the 'exploited systems' in powerplay gives us some sense of the size of population. The current figures are Edward Mahon 1.1 trillion, Arissa Lavigny-Duval 520.7 billion, Aisling Duval 455.7 billion, Zachary Hudson 733.7 billion, Li Yong- Rui 391,8 billion, Felicia Winters 516 billion, Zemina Torval 401.5 billion, Denton Patreus 495.5 billion, Pranav Antal 218.8 billion, Yuri Grom 363.3 billion and Archon Delaine 139.5 billion. This gives us a total of 5.3365 trillion people and doesn't include any of the systems not exploited by powerplay. So 2 million players is a drop in the ocean
 
Also I suspect in larger scale of things what we do play little role (few hundred commanders doing refugee missions let's say in Lave most likely won't change numbers that much).
True, but when trying to suss out the lore you have to factor in NPC traffic as well, in which case things could be very different.

(actually, do NPC ships impact the BGS at all? I assume not)

It's hard to get a handle on anything to do with the economics of the game. There have been several threads speculating about what a credit is worth and the estimates vary wildly depending on what commodity people base their figures on. It would be nice to know what the spending power of a credit is in the ED universe. For example if you went to a bar would a credit just be relatively small change or is it enough to buy a drink or a round of drinks, it may even be enough to treat everyone in the bar, we really don't know.
If you gave a waitress a 1 credit tip would you be seen as a cheapskate or would it be average or generous or even life changing?
That's why I feel there must be a currency below a credit which - presumably - has never been addressed in lore or novels (I've not read any yet, and yes I will eventually, Drew!).

As I mentioned previously; a minimum fee for fixing your spacecraft's paintwork is 10Cr, so I highly doubt a can of Space-Pepsi would be anywhere near that. Unless, of course, the materials being used were somehow of much less market value than whatever's used to make a futuristic soft drink... and then there's labour cost; is there any labour involved in 'painting' a ship? One assumes so, for the same reason one assumes 'ground' crew do in fact help with outfitting weapons systems and the like, yet it is never represented when we tweak our ships.

Automation only goes so far, and people still have to supply materials, maintenance, admin etc to that process.

I'm tempted to just believe the economy in-game is flat out broken when trying to plug lore economics into it, or that what we see in-game is actually just something tied to the Pilots Federation (which causes its own headaches in terms of effectively having a dual galactic economy, but largely explains/justifies what we interact with and deflects questions about lore, as it then represents a hermetically sealed system with no reference points beyond it, e.g. price of food/clothing/wages/etc on various planets for people who may never travel between systems).

Using the 'exploited systems' in powerplay gives us some sense of the size of population. The current figures are Edward Mahon 1.1 trillion, Arissa Lavigny-Duval 520.7 billion, Aisling Duval 455.7 billion, Zachary Hudson 733.7 billion, Li Yong- Rui 391,8 billion, Felicia Winters 516 billion, Zemina Torval 401.5 billion, Denton Patreus 495.5 billion, Pranav Antal 218.8 billion, Yuri Grom 363.3 billion and Archon Delaine 139.5 billion. This gives us a total of 5.3365 trillion people and doesn't include any of the systems not exploited by powerplay. So 2 million players is a drop in the ocean
Mahon has that big a population 'lead'? Hm. I don't Powerplay [yet], but is there a particular lore or gameplay reason for that?

Interesting figures, though - I've never seen any ballpark numbers even within PP.

But, again, when coming at this from a perspective of socioeconomics and lore, NPC pilots have to be considered alongside players, so the number would surely be considerably larger than the playerbase. Maybe not much to change things drastically, but still necessary.
 
The reason for the large Alliance number seems mainly to be down to gameplay reasons. Alliance supporting player groups seem more organised and they have the added bonus of their reward module not being seen as highly desirable. This means players are more likely to do stuff for the benefit of the faction rather than just do enough to get whatever module.

If we say 2.5 million accounts (not sure on the actual figure) and multiply by say 20 to include NPCs, then only 1 in 100,000 people are pilots. If we're quite generous and say that the multiplier should be 200 the figure goes down to 1 in 10,000. Even at 2000 NPCs per player it would still mean that only 1 in 1000 people are pilots
 
Not a lore expert but the FD galaxy is a dystopian vision of the future. Life appears to be cheap, constant rumbling warfare, slavery, famines and outbreaks. Do Frontier produce stats on the state of the galaxy that would probably help answer the question? E.g. numbers of people effected by various economic states per unit time etc.
I think that the AEDC or Border Coalition produced something like this a couple of years ago. I think that most information is readily available in EDDB.io if you can write the DB queries to put together the report.
 
Very little has been written about socio-economics in the lore of ED actually. There are some technology primers that were made available to the writers, but they are still NDA protected at the moment unfortunately. Space ship ownership is probably best related to house ownership nowadays, possibly the biggest expense an individual is likely to incur. However the economics of today can't be directly compared. Spacepilots, as a % of the entire human population, are a relatively small segment, but the scale of human habitation makes them seem very significant. They're perhaps more akin to owner/driver white van merchants.

Cheers,

Drew.
I may have misunderstood your post Drew, but I don't think that space-craft ownership in ED is anywhere near the level of % population that home ownership is in RL, or that the % of population who are commercial drivers is at this level either. Human population in ED universe is more than 6 trillion (stated by MB I think, not sure how long ago). I've never been to Sol as I've not earned the permit yet, but Achenar's population is a smidge under 13 billion. If we consider Achenar to be roughly equivalent living standards and prosperity to the UK (optimistic for the UK!), where ~2/3 of the population are owner-occupiers, and assuming that this is 2 adults and 2 children per household, then that would mean 2.5 billion spaceships in Achenar. I don't think I've ever seen more than 20 or so ships in system at the same time. I have a weedy computer, so maybe some people have seen 50-100. People don't fly their ships all the time, but even so, that's still a lot of ships left in the spaceport. Maybe these Imperials collect spaceships like Sheikhs collect supercars!

In my mind, spacecraft ownership is generally either by the government (or their agencies), companies or freelancers. The main purpose for most ships in ED is trade and most of that is by corporations. I'm sure there are plenty of rich-kids riding round in their FdLs and Dolphin's, but all other freelancers need their ships to make a living (in this way they are equivalent to commercial vehicle drivers today). These freelancers either had to take out a massive loan to buy the ship, they rent it (but since life expectancy in space is so low you'd be crazy to run a spaceship-hire business!), they earn the ship (a bit like paying off a loan but by work instead of money), inherit it, steal it or they are gifted it by an anonymous benefactor (the backstory for all of us CMDRs in ED and in previous games). So generally, I think individuals possess spaceships in the hope of making a living, not because they need a roof over their heads.

Going back to the life expectancy thing, most spaceship pilots must be either a) desperate or b) bonkers. I know which one I am :D
 
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The reason for the large Alliance number seems mainly to be down to gameplay reasons. Alliance supporting player groups seem more organised and they have the added bonus of their reward module not being seen as highly desirable. This means players are more likely to do stuff for the benefit of the faction rather than just do enough to get whatever module.
That seems rather odd to me, particularly given the Alliance have no faction ships. I get the impression the number of players engaging with Powerplay is marginal - it'd be nice to see how things would stand with much bigger numbers, and, ideally, more role-players.

If we say 2.5 million accounts (not sure on the actual figure) and multiply by say 20 to include NPCs, then only 1 in 100,000 people are pilots. If we're quite generous and say that the multiplier should be 200 the figure goes down to 1 in 10,000. Even at 2000 NPCs per player it would still mean that only 1 in 1000 people are pilots
One could obviously then reason that if such a small percentage of such an immense population group have PF licenses, that means they represent a kind of top-tier strata of the economy (and in some cases society?). The elite, if you will. ; -)

However, basic market forces would surely dictate that interstellar haulage ostensibly functions rather like an amalgamation of bulk merchant vessels (e.g. oil tankers, shipments of cars, etc) and, say, long range lorry driving, particularly in more hazardous locales. The international merely scales up to the interstellar.

When looking at the lore that's all fine, but satisfyingly resolving what the players might represent is--- well, probably impossible, all in all. Crews of oil tankers in our era do not own their own ships, nor do they dock it at the weekend to do a spot of auxiliary navy support in a gunboat...

Maybe what's in the game will always be a square peg and the lore is a very round hole, but it makes it a tad frustrating to try to RP. Each player can come up with their own solutions, but ideally they need to be broadly on the same page.

If we consider Achenar to be roughly equivalent living standards and prosperity to the UK (optimistic for the UK!), where ~2/3 of the population are owner-occupiers, and assuming that this is 2 adults and 2 children per household, then that would mean 2.5 billion spaceships in Achenar. I don't think I've ever seen more than 20 or so ships in system at the same time.
I play in Solo and it would be nice to see far busier stations and ports, at least in the systems closest to Sol and the other major worlds. It rarely feels as busy as it should.

However, call the lack of representation gaming convenience (I would find semi-regularly having to queue to dock in the busiest regions in general play 'immersive'. but I know most wouldn't... ) or dramatic license - the socioeconomics seemingly haven't been laid out on the lore side, which is what I have an issue with.

In my mind, spacecraft ownership is generally either by the government (or their agencies), companies or freelancers. The main purpose for most ships in ED is trade and most of that is by corporations.
I think how the game currently represents these ideas so far is very poor.

It'd be nice to see real distinctions between government, company, and freelance work. We can pledge to Powerplay leaders, but why not sign a 'contract' with a sub-faction for a wage, with good performances delivering bonuses?

...and yes, I can hear a ton of people screaming they want games as escapism, not a replication of the daily grind. ; -) But as it stands the mission boards and player options suck at making use of the sci-fi lore. The in-game world does not feel very rich in detail. You wouldn't even need to get rid of the freelancer lifestyle - which is the only thing current ED arguably depicts - but you could add these other options for those who want them. It would add greater context (which is a big deal in RP's) to the actions we do in the game, which are, obviously, almost uniformly identical regardless of where we're doing it or for whom.

Most companies would earn a player a reasonable amount (perhaps for a set number of deliveries per week or month. you could even utilise the tier system of CG's, with the player needing to fulfill a minimum to get their contracted baseline, but hit higher tiers and the pay increases), whereas government or aux navy work would usually be poorly paid, but contribute to Influence and/or Reputation far more noticeably.

And freelancers? I suppose they could mostly stay as they are, but perhaps with a far higher proportion being found in independent or anarchy systems - and make the pay higher as well as the risks.

Either way, to add to a sense of realism as well as more involved gameplay progression, I'd like to see licenses added, i.e. you cannot ship X amount of commodities without a certain license, and the same goes for being cleared to be a bounty hunter. It doesn't really make any sense that the baseline license and qualifications the player starts out with cover them for flying a Sidewinder as well as a T9, and a Corvette. Maybe if you're not cleared for combat you can buy whatever ship you wish - but are unable to fit certain weapons? Maybe it renders your ship in breach of various systems laws or codes, and so modest fines are incurred when you dock with such a ship.

I think Elite rather suffers where the lore and representation of its world is concerned, largely because of its iterative evolution; it's easy to become stuck in a design rut, simply because that's how it's always been. And so features and elements are added, but the core remains very bare-bones. I know FDev are looking to some of those issues in the next phase/s of development, but I'm skeptical about them trying to deepen the RPG potential.

These freelancers either had to take out a massive loan to buy the ship, they rent it (but since life expectancy in space is so low you'd be crazy to run a spaceship-hire business!)...
Is it so low? If the game systems are to be believed then no one ever really dies... Or at least the players never can. Is that, then, just another gaming convenience? I rather like the idea of automated ejection and survival systems. I wouldn't mind seeing NPC's survive combat, either.

Going back to the life expectancy thing, most spaceship pilots must be either a) desperate or b) bonkers. I know which one I am :D
I suppose one option I personally have is to refine the RP backwards from the tasks I've been doing in the game; if her primary pursuit is exploration and she is also Fed loyal, then she's surely of a socioeconomic bracket that dictates she already has some financial leeway or stability, i.e. being motivated largely by wanderlust and then political allegiance as opposed to needing to earn a decent wage.

Oh, and I don't believe Drew was trying to draw a direct parallel between house ownership and ships. I took it as a broad comparison with regards to how an individual might perceive a purchase, and what kind of financial hit they might take.
 
If we consider Achenar to be roughly equivalent living standards and prosperity to the UK (optimistic for the UK!), where ~2/3 of the population are owner-occupiers, and assuming that this is 2 adults and 2 children per household, then that would mean 2.5 billion spaceships in Achenar. I don't think I've ever seen more than 20 or so ships in system at the same time. I have a weedy computer, so maybe some people have seen 50-100. People don't fly their ships all the time, but even so, that's still a lot of ships left in the spaceport. Maybe these Imperials collect spaceships like Sheikhs collect supercars!

In my mind, spacecraft ownership is generally either by the government (or their agencies), companies or freelancers. The main purpose for most ships in ED is trade and most of that is by corporations. I'm sure there are plenty of rich-kids riding round in their FdLs and Dolphin's, but all other freelancers need their ships to make a living (in this way they are equivalent to commercial vehicle drivers today). These freelancers either had to take out a massive loan to buy the ship, they rent it (but since life expectancy in space is so low you'd be crazy to run a spaceship-hire business!), they earn the ship (a bit like paying off a loan but by work instead of money), inherit it, steal it or they are gifted it by an anonymous benefactor (the backstory for all of us CMDRs in ED and in previous games). So generally, I think individuals possess spaceships in the hope of making a living, not because they need a roof over their heads.

Going back to the life expectancy thing, most spaceship pilots must be either a) desperate or b) bonkers. I know which one I am :D

The Empire is a Slave owning society, it doesn't get much more socio-econmic than that! Life does seem to be cheap especially for the space farers. Maybe the over all balance of rich and poor is still roughly the same as it ever was, with about 1% of population having the extreme wealth and power, with the lower other straters of the society having less and less proportionally.
 
Ah, cheers for the reply, Drew - I don't think I've run across a post of yours here till now.

Frustratingly, if understandably, players view the universe of Elite through a tiny - and incredibly unrepresentative - window (quite literally... ). Also, one could argue what's in the game isn't representative of anything pertaining to the lore of a persistent, cohesive sci-fi universe, i.e. the economy the players engage with exists in a lore vacuum, merely to represent values plugged in to rewards, ranks, milestones-via-ships-purchased, and so on. A Sidewinder's dirt cheap in the game, but how does that 20 or 30K translate to a non-pilot or 'average' citizen?

Apropos currency: there surely must be denominations below a single credit. If a touch up of a spaceship's paintjob costs just 10Cr, then what the hell does a can of Space-Pepsi cost...

Are there any ballpark figures for the total population in human space?

But yeah, I suppose 'space truck simulator' might be the best general comparison, in terms of pilots being the connective lifeblood of a space-faring civilisation. Though our own truckers and commercial ferry/transport personnel don't have the options of refitting their assets on a whim and popping off to do some freelance auxiliary navy, bounty hunting, or privateer work...

Hm, not sure I'd see FDev's virtual Milky Way as dystopian.

We see no stations going under, as it were. No global failures, no material withdrawal from systems, etc. The famines and outbreaks have no lasting consequences and exist as a variable in the BGS which temporarily affect adjacent variables/values (commodities, mission board options and/or availability, etc). I've no idea what the general quality of life might be, though, or how much it varies across the Sol bubble. Going from the game the human civilisation seems peculiarly - conveniently - quite homogenised.

Any official added data or context would be interesting. Lore heavy socioeconomics don't ever seem to be a subject that features in the newsletters or Galnet, at least. ; -)

Still think it is on the dystopian side (glass might be half empty i suppose!) but a lot of good sci-fi has that element. Where technologically there is great advancement but socially or polictically the human race has stood still. It would be good if there was some lore on the adoption of the credit, when did it get adopted as the standard galactic currency? With the creation of bitcoin as a virtual currency could we be seeing a climps of the credit. Maybe central banks are becoming obsolete! Food/water would be a good starter to work out the power of a credit. Followed by gold, although it is more abundant in space if you know where to look. I suppose working out the relative prices of all the commodities and taking the means would be a measure of the credit also. Great idea for the thread Fray I have attached the gapminder website which has some useful info on socio economic things in todays world, worth a look if you haven't seen it.
http://www.gapminder.org/
 
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Are there any ballpark figures for the total population in human space?

Alliance Office of Statistics produced these numbers from their galactic census in 3301/2015:

19,019 inhabited systems.
6,572,987,331,639 people.
The Federation has a total of 6542 star systems, with 2,886bn citizens.
The Empire gathers 5514 systems, and 1,919bn people live inside its border.
The Alliance is made up of 369 independent systems, for a total of 219bn inhabitants.
And there are 6593 independent non-aligned systems, with 1,549bn living souls.

As for credits, my personal take on the subject is that the credits we trade in are some "super-currency" or reference unit used everywhere, which local currencies would be converted into and back. So 1cr would be equivalent...say, one month's wages of minimum wage worker in Federal or Imperial or what's your local border world's currency. Value of some absolutely cheap currencies like hydrogen or biowaste skew this though so its not a 100% match.
 
As for credits, my personal take on the subject is that the credits we trade in are some "super-currency" or reference unit used everywhere, which local currencies would be converted into and back. So 1cr would be equivalent...say, one month's wages of minimum wage worker in Federal or Imperial or what's your local border world's currency. Value of some absolutely cheap currencies like hydrogen or biowaste skew this though so its not a 100% match.

well, don't forget, its also possible for it to be the galactic general purpose currency, meaning that we as CMDR's earn the most money then almost anyone else (with exxpesion to those ulta-trilionair NPCs)
 
Alliance Office of Statistics produced these numbers from their galactic census in 3301/2015:

19,019 inhabited systems.
6,572,987,331,639 people.
The Federation has a total of 6542 star systems, with 2,886bn citizens.
The Empire gathers 5514 systems, and 1,919bn people live inside its border.
The Alliance is made up of 369 independent systems, for a total of 219bn inhabitants.
And there are 6593 independent non-aligned systems, with 1,549bn living souls.

As for credits, my personal take on the subject is that the credits we trade in are some "super-currency" or reference unit used everywhere, which local currencies would be converted into and back. So 1cr would be equivalent...say, one month's wages of minimum wage worker in Federal or Imperial or what's your local border world's currency. Value of some absolutely cheap currencies like hydrogen or biowaste skew this though so its not a 100% match.
That's the info I was looking for, thanks for telling us the source.
I think the same about credits.
 
I agree with local currencies. Greece would not have had as severe problems several years ago if they were using a currency that floated against European currencies instead of using the Euro. Dictatorships would also not appreciate lack of monetary control.

I think the way we get local currencies is through selling information. We bring market prices from one system and sell them to information brokers in another system. They also buy digital newspapers from other systems and sell them to local media outlets.
 
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