Make Sensors a valid option. Connect Sensors to silent running, turrets, chaff!

TheoZ

TheoZ
Hey Commanders,

I've sure some of you have noticed, silent running ships with hull reinforcements tends to be a very popular PVP choice. I do have 4 different silent running ships myself.

Also, when making a serious PVP build, usually Sensors D class is the usual option. You don't want to sacrifice bringing a big or bigger (energy hungry) gun, for putting the kind of useless A class sensor.

Currently better sensors just make you to see what targets you have available on radar in a bigger distance, and that's it. And that's crap! Experienced pilots will just boost towards the flashy enemy radar icon, and that's it.

To make Sensors a valid option, 2-3 suggestions can take place.

Here there are:

a) having better sensors makes you target a silent running ship easier. Maybe increase the distance that you can target the enemy silent running ship if you use better sensors?

b) having better sensors makes you being able to hit the target who is chaffing more frequently. I am not saying 100% hits, but we could have an increase of hits to target who chaffs for a certain % like 10-30%?

c) having better sensors makes turrets locking speed faster. Turrets are still very under-powered. Why not correlate your sensors to a better targeting of the turrets themselves?

I don't know if you have more suggestions, feel free to toss them in but in terms of balancing, I am sure you will agree that currently Sensors D class is the most frequent choice for PVP builds (unless you have a silent running ship that you usually have all modules A class in the first place).
 

Psycho Romeo

Psycho Romeo
TheoZ said:
a) having better sensors makes you target a silent running ship easier. Maybe increase the distance that you can target the enemy silent running ship if you use better sensors?

b) having better sensors makes you being able to hit the target who is chaffing more frequently. I am not saying 100% hits, but we could have an increase of hits to target who chaffs for a certain % like 10-30%?

c) having better sensors makes turrets locking speed faster. Turrets are still very under-powered. Why not correlate your sensors to a better targeting of the turrets themselves?
Click to expand...
A) I agree. Better sensors should resolve contacts easier.
B) I don't particularly agree with chaff mechanics the way they are. I think chaff needs to be changed to be a little more grey/fluid and less on/off before it can support a mechanic like this.
C) Turrets require time to lock?

Better sensors should basic scan ships quicker.
 

DragoonKnight

DragoonKnight
Psycho Romeo said:
A) I agree. Better sensors should resolve contacts easier.
B) I don't particularly agree with chaff mechanics the way they are. I think chaff needs to be changed to be a little more grey/fluid and less on/off before it can support a mechanic like this.
C) Turrets require time to lock?

Better sensors should basic scan ships quicker.
Click to expand...

There is no lock time for turrets, but ship turrets have a certain amount of inaccuracy that was intentionally built-in by FD. Station turrets are 100% accurate.
Source: One of the Developers recently explained how turrets work in a forum post.
 

MrFuddyDuddy

M
I would settle for increased accuracy of Turreted and Gimballed weapons based on Sensors. I mean its in the description for gods sake, that the sensors are responsible for targeting. Maybe add variations like whats seen in CQC and have Military grade sensors that have enhanced tracking at the cost of increased weight and power draw, and exploratory sensors that have enhanced scanning capabilities in cruise and are lighter but have terrible target tracking for turrets and gimballed. This idea can span across many other systems as well, just a thought I had.
 

CTCParadox

CTCParadox
I would add that the fact that exploration ships are leaving for the deep black with D grade sensors is strange.
Outside of combat sensors should have an effect on detecting things in supercruise (maybe allows extra items like DSS, BDS/IDS/ADS, KWS etc. to be installed into the sensor module like the scarab SRV into the hanger).

CMDR CTCParadox
 

X-Terminator

Banned
X-Terminator
Sensors only need a Nerf. Then you'd need to use your headlook more if you want to chase ships with D rated just because they are light and most economic just as Life Support is. Why should a Sensor module have anything to do with anything separate? Then what next - link Life Support with how long it takes for the canopy to breach? It has zero connection and shouldn't.
However, the range adjustment should act the same as it does on the surface within the SRV, i.e. it shows a wider or shorter range adjustment instead of always showing the outer most limit on the edge.
Nerf them so we find a use for better Scanners or use more pilot skill with headlook for a compromised one.
 
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Psycho Romeo

Psycho Romeo
X-Terminator said:
Sensors only need a Nerf. Then you'd need to use your headlook more if you want to chase ships with D rated just because they are light and most economic just as Life Support is. Why should a Sensor module have anything to do with anything separate? Then what next - link Life Support with how long it takes for the canopy to breach? It has zero connection and shouldn't.
However, the range adjustment should act the same as it does on the surface within the SRV, i.e. it shows a wider or shorter range adjustment instead of always showing the outer most limit on the edge.
Nerf them so we find a use for better Scanners or use more pilot skill with headlook for a compromised one.
Click to expand...
Headlook isn't something that a lot of pilots can make use of, so to design a mechanic around it is absurd. Like adding something only a mouse can do to an xbox game.
 

nrobidoux

N
TheoZ said:
a) having better sensors makes you target a silent running ship easier. Maybe increase the distance that you can target the enemy silent running ship if you use better sensors?

b) having better sensors makes you being able to hit the target who is chaffing more frequently. I am not saying 100% hits, but we could have an increase of hits to target who chaffs for a certain % like 10-30%?

c) having better sensors makes turrets locking speed faster. Turrets are still very under-powered. Why not correlate your sensors to a better targeting of the turrets themselves?
Click to expand...

a) oopsie. thought that was part of the mechanic already. IDK about a ship that's completely silent (well I guess there's always your thrusters...) but if someone tried to minimize their signature outside silent running I would hope a better sensor could resolve a sensor blip easier.

b) get up close on the bigger ships, you'll still get them ~100% of the time. :) maybe I'm fighting a lot closer tan you but ~10% (or more) of my shots land when they chaff on most of the mid and small ships. Depending on your loadout you might want to detarget and use your weps as "fixed" hardpoints til the chaff dissipates.

c) I think turrets were nerfed. Track slower then before. They seem a waste now, before they were a viable option.
 
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-Joe

J
I think that regular sensors should be much easier to damage. They are currently not worth targetting in a fight.

Better quality combat sensors would major on being more resistant to damage.
Explorer version better for supercruise worse for sublight speed.
Mining version provide better mining details.
Bounty hunters version with better forward range less range for rear view.
Better planetary sensors feature terrain avoidance option.

At the same time we could have slightly different HUDs to reflect the different sensor suites fitted.
 
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DragoonKnight

DragoonKnight
X-Terminator said:
Sensors only need a Nerf. Then you'd need to use your headlook more if you want to chase ships with D rated just because they are light and most economic just as Life Support is. Why should a Sensor module have anything to do with anything separate? Then what next - link Life Support with how long it takes for the canopy to breach? It has zero connection and shouldn't.
However, the range adjustment should act the same as it does on the surface within the SRV, i.e. it shows a wider or shorter range adjustment instead of always showing the outer most limit on the edge.
Nerf them so we find a use for better Scanners or use more pilot skill with headlook for a compromised one.
Click to expand...

64 Tons of sensors is just as good as 160 Tons of sensors. And the equipment needed to actively scan for and detect targets at ranges of less than 10km sure as hell would not need to weight anywhere near that much in real life.

Is that enough of a nerf for you?
If they were to nerf sensors any more than they are now I would need a crew member with a periscope on my Anaconda just to know if there are ships around me.
 
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X-Terminator

Banned
X-Terminator
The ship sensor range adjustment is mostly useless to alter. Best to have the same as the SRV. I always check the Target range on the left to see how far away a target is. I much prefer it as a 1:1 zoom. But just nerf the more basic ones anyway. I often search for laser fire when there's nothing on my scanner. Just nerf 'em and all platforms do have a headlook feature that even Braben uses on the XBOX controller with his PC.
 

DragoonKnight

DragoonKnight
X-Terminator said:
The ship sensor range adjustment is mostly useless to alter. Best to have the same as the SRV. I always check the Target range on the left to see how far away a target is. I much prefer it as a 1:1 zoom. But just nerf the more basic ones anyway. I often search for laser fire when there's nothing on my scanner. Just nerf 'em and all platforms do have a headlook feature that even Braben uses on the XBOX controller with his PC.
Click to expand...

If only we could apply your brilliant logic to everything else in life. We would still be stuck in the stone age.
"Something is not useful for me or not as good as it can be. Just eliminate it"
 

nrobidoux

N
Why are people all about the headlook? Every modern fighter jet has this thing called radar. If a pilot can actually see you they'll use both. Let's not bring dogifhting back to WWI / WWII.

I would like to think sensors in normal flight (which is about the same speeds as modern jets) would be a little more advanced in 1290 or so years.
 

DragoonKnight

DragoonKnight
nrobidoux said:
Why are people all about the headlook? Every modern fighter jet has this thing called radar. If a pilot can actually see you they'll use both. Let's not bring dogifhting back to WWI / WWII.

I would like to think sensors in normal flight (which is about the same speeds as modern jets) would be a little more advanced in 1290 or so years.
Click to expand...

For the same reason that if you were to give a caveman a gun, he wouldnt know what to do with it. Some people are still stuck in the stone age and want headlook to be used for finding opponents.
 

Mitore

Banned
M
Better sensors would increse gimbal/turret accuracy! Problem solved. :)
Now we need some cloaking shields. :D
 
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TheoZ

TheoZ
Psycho Romeo said:
A) I agree. Better sensors should resolve contacts easier.
B) I don't particularly agree with chaff mechanics the way they are. I think chaff needs to be changed to be a little more grey/fluid and less on/off before it can support a mechanic like this.
C) Turrets require time to lock?

Better sensors should basic scan ships quicker.
Click to expand...

Yeah they do. As soon as a target gets in range and "angle" for your turret to be activated, you can see the specific weapons moves slowly pointing that target and starts firing. If the target is versatile enough, it will certainly make the turrets miss a few times. I've noticed that when I would fire with a turret against a target, the turret will miss the first 2-3-4 shots before actually start landing hits.
 

Psycho Romeo

Psycho Romeo
TheoZ said:
Yeah they do. As soon as a target gets in range and "angle" for your turret to be activated, you can see the specific weapons moves slowly pointing that target and starts firing. If the target is versatile enough, it will certainly make the turrets miss a few times. I've noticed that when I would fire with a turret against a target, the turret will miss the first 2-3-4 shots before actually start landing hits.
Click to expand...
That's not turrets locking on. That's turret traverse speed and that has nothing to do with sensors.
 
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