Making ship launched fighters useful

[Ayra]

It's been announced that Horizons will allow for ships being allowed to launch fighters. The Anaconda description states that it can launch a Sidewinder size ship, so this one is a given. We can probably assume that the Corvette, Cutter and Panther will also have this capability. Since it has an immense port called "bay 01" on the bottom, I can see the Federal Gunship being able to launch a Condor (it would also give the ship a niche as the cheapest "carrier" ship).

While the ability to launch another ship sounds super cool and fun (especially with the upcoming multi-crew functionality), being able to launch a Sidewinder or Condor sounds pretty limited in actual usage. A tiny ship firing two small pulse lasers is not terribly significant compared to the armament an Anaconda caries, and while it can circle around a target in a different direction, it will probably get blasted in a few seconds. I assume that you have to get a new one from a station if it gets blown up also. So how could ship-launched fighters be useful? I thought of the following three things, the latter two requiring the first one to exist:

1) Allow you to outfit the Sidewinder/Condor. A stock Sidewinder or shieldless Condor is not very useful. An A-ranked Sidewinder is a bit more significant.

2) Allow you to reload the weapons of a docked Sidewinder. It is a docking bay afterall, so being able to refill the ammo of a docked fighter makes sense. This would allow you to have a Sidewinder with two missile launchers for example. Or Fragmentation guns. The fighter would now both pack a punch and be of use to the mother ship, as well as give a purpose to those weapons with sorely limited ammo.

3) Make the launched ship affected by insurance. When your carried ship gets blown up, you will most likely have to go back to a station to replace it which is fine. However, having to reoutfit a complete ship every single time from scratch would be time consuming, annoying and extremely expensive for something that can be blown up in seconds.

Does anyone else have any other ideas for ship-launched fighters?

 

[generationship]

woukld it not be cool if your trading away and you can launch vipers ( battlestar galactica) style when attacked

 

[Iskariot]

It's been announced that Horizons will allow for ships being allowed to launch fighters. The Anaconda description states that it can launch a Sidewinder size ship, so this one is a given. We can probably assume that the Corvette, Cutter and Panther will also have this capability. Since it has an immense port called "bay 01" on the bottom, I can see the Federal Gunship being able to launch a Condor (it would also give the ship a niche as the cheapest "carrier" ship).

While the ability to launch another ship sounds super cool and fun (especially with the upcoming multi-crew functionality), being able to launch a Sidewinder or Condor sounds pretty limited in actual usage. A tiny ship firing two small pulse lasers is not terribly significant compared to the armament an Anaconda caries, and while it can circle around a target in a different direction, it will probably get blasted in a few seconds. I assume that you have to get a new one from a station if it gets blown up also. So how could ship-launched fighters be useful? I thought of the following three things, the latter two requiring the first one to exist:

1) Allow you to outfit the Sidewinder/Condor. A stock Sidewinder or shieldless Condor is not very useful. An A-ranked Sidewinder is a bit more significant.

2) Allow you to reload the weapons of a docked Sidewinder. It is a docking bay afterall, so being able to refill the ammo of a docked fighter makes sense. This would allow you to have a Sidewinder with two missile launchers for example. Or Fragmentation guns. The fighter would now both pack a punch and be of use to the mother ship, as well as give a purpose to those weapons with sorely limited ammo.

3) Make the launched ship affected by insurance. When your carried ship gets blown up, you will most likely have to go back to a station to replace it which is fine. However, having to reoutfit a complete ship every single time from scratch would be time consuming, annoying and extremely expensive for something that can be blown up in seconds.

Does anyone else have any other ideas for ship-launched fighters?

I share your concerns.
I did not voice them, because I felt it was so plain obvious that I immediately expected FD to realize this too and therefore they will have to come up with something to make the setup useful.

Sidewinders and Condors have no combat value.
They are nothing more than ineffective cannon fodder.
Currently I can only see use for these small ships as shuttles.

If I owned an Anaconda and had a Sidewinder on board I would be mad to launch it in a fight.
It would be like flushing money down the drain.
It would be best to keep the vulnerable sidewinder safe in my hold and use my Anaconda to destroy attackers.

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woukld it not be cool if your trading away and you can launch vipers ( battlestar galactica) style when attacked

Vipers?
I heard no talk about carrying Vipers.
Vipers are quite big ships.

If I carried a condor or a sidey I would certainly not use it to do battle for me. It would be a waste of money.

 

[Muetdhiver]

If the idea is to pilot small ships like the sidewinder, eagle and condor, these will have mighty short lifetimes.
So, if one has to go to the starport to regain it, it will probably not be worth the internal space sacrifice.
Also, they have to pack some punch or be completly useless.


One possibility would be to possibility to use an AFMU to 'repair' the destroyed fighter and so being able to
use it several time without going back to a station.

Plus, once we get the multicrew thing, one player can pilot the fighter, then repair it and man the turrets of the mothership,
then go back in again. That would be mighty cool from a gameplay point of view.

If wings stay limited to four ships, but not four players, I can see several ships using fighters in swarming assaults as good fun.

 

[goemon]

going somewhere with your anaconda, than exploring with your sidey a planet, land with it, get into your scarab....

or: go with your anacoda to a system that just have outposts, take your sidey to pick up missions (or cargo even?).

i will love it.

concerning using fighters in a fight ... if the AI is using your turreted tradeconda in a clever way ... maybe.

 

[Vandaahl]

It was also mentioned that big ships might not be able to land on planets, plus the fact your CO-pilot (AI or HI) would be able to pilot the smaller craft while you keep operating the hosting one.

In the first case its a nice way to switch to the small ship and use it as an elevator. In the latter its an expansion of the carrier (you fight with 2 ships), not a choice between a big or small ship.

 

[testmate]

anyone knows if we will be able to carry an imperial courier or an adder?
Small ships (courier has only 35t mass!) and not too useless. especially the courier can be very useful with high shielding an medium mounts.

 

[Iskariot]

going somewhere with your anaconda, than exploring with your sidey a planet, land with it, get into your scarab....

or: go with your anacoda to a system that just have outposts, take your sidey to pick up missions (or cargo even?).

i will love it.

Yes that is exactly the only kind of application I can picture for a sidey.
Or perhaps we could use the sidey to bring a few tonnes of cargo to an outpost where our large vessel is unable to dock.
I think that kind of use is quite interesting and cool.

But for combat? Nope. Can't see it. Sidewinders and Condors are 5-second-ships in combat and then they deliver a nice explosion.
They will not even be able to breach the average shield of enemy ships before they turn to dust.

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anyone knows if we will be able to carry an imperial courier or an adder?
Small ships (courier has only 35t mass!) and not too useless. especially the courier can be very useful with high shielding an medium mounts.

I think the size of these ships might be a problem.
They are quite big compared to a Sidewinder.

 

[Iskariot]

I was thinking.
We will of course have no need for an FSD in those small ships.
Perhaps that room and surplus energy can be used for upgrades that make them more useful in combat and other situations?

 

[Rob_the_Sparky]

IMHO jump drive equipped launched ships make no sense, the mothership deals with this. If you remove the no jump drive then it can be smaller or better equipped. I.e. a what would a sidewinder with the jump drive deleted be capable of?

Damn it, too late!

 

[Muetdhiver]

Maybe, but even then, if the fighter dies after like 20 seconds of fight in a CZ, then what is the point of bringing one ?

Unless there is a way of 'respawning' the fighters, their utility in combat will be naught.*

*esp if by bringing one, your Conda shield is A6 instead of A7...

 

[Munial]

We also know they plan to use assets from CQC in the main game - maybe mission / combat objectives will only be possible with a small fighter when you're required to fly inside a superstructure... ? After all a small one-man fighter should be able to penetrate their outer defenses....

 

[generationship]

Maybe, but even then, if the fighter dies after like 20 seconds of fight in a CZ, then what is the point of bringing one ?

Unless there is a way of 'respawning' the fighters, their utility in combat will be naught.

omg any help u can get is help

 

[Zeta Legion]

We also know they plan to use assets from CQC in the main game - maybe mission / combat objectives will only be possible with a small fighter when you're required to fly inside a superstructure... ? After all a small one-man fighter should be able to penetrate their outer defenses....

Maybe we'll get a Targeting Computer module too!

... Actually that's not a bad idea. We could use more combat oriented utility modules aside from SCBs especially for those small slots.

We should at least be able to cram an Eagle or Viper into the hold. The Viper is a bit longer than the sidey but has similar width and I'll bet you could make the wings on the Eagle/Imperial Eagle fold up.
As for shuttle runs, a Hauler would be better for that imo though it is somewhat larger than the sidey.

But I don't imagine it would take that much work to retrofit an Anaconda hull to take a Viper instead of just a Sidey.

 

[Iskariot]

As for shuttle runs, a Hauler would be better for that imo though it is somewhat larger than the sidey.

Of course a hauler would be better. But I doubt we will be able to use a hauler.
We will have to work with what we get and as far as I know that will be a Sidewinder or a Condor.
A sidewinder will be able to carry ten tonnes if you remove the shield. I think that is doable for most hauling missions.
But FD will have to add the mechanics to do missions this way. Currently we can not break up cargo deliveries in parts.
FD will also have to make it possible to remove the FSD from carried ships. This will give us another size 2 slot, which could be used for another 4 tonnes of cargo.

 

[sonicology]

I think the size of these ships might be a problem.
They are quite big compared to a Sidewinder.

Perhaps we could see the introduction of a dedicated carrier-variant of one of these ships? For example, an Eagle with its FSD removed to save space/weight and fold up wings to allow it to fit snugly within the tight confines of the mothership.

 

[Pinkie]

Does anyone else have any other ideas for ship-launched fighters?

The obvious use for me is to park your large ship just off an outpost and use the fighter to offload your cargo on the small / medium landing pads.

Actually, why not a limpet controller for offloading cargo? That seems an even better idea so larger ships CAN stop at outposts.

 

[Iskariot]

Actually, why not a limpet controller for offloading cargo? That seems an even better idea so larger ships CAN stop at outposts.

I would love that.
You should post a proposal in the Dangerous Suggestions forum.

 

[Zandraak]

Yeah but like trade, smuggling, Exploration, conquest and "players group" it's all about RP. It's useless, they do nothing but it's "RP"

LOL.

 

[CMDR Cillian Raynor]

i think everything that is small landing pad should be launchable. or anyway, Sidewinder, eagle, cobra, viper, hauler and adder if nothing else.


I haven't tried cqc, i imagine the condor is still shieldess even in cqc? they should release a different version of the condor with Horizons, one with a shield. Otherwise what use is a condor going to be in open world. I really like its look but have to think it'll always be a pretty useless ship. they should have a buffed up version. Maybe a special Federal Condor.