Mandalay is too cheap! This is broken balance

CMDR Matredo

CMDR Matredo
Why does Mandalay cost only 18 million while Krait Phantom is nearly three times more expensive? This isn’t just strange – it’s unfair to other ships.
  • Mandalay is faster, more maneuverable, and has a much longer jump range than Phantom.
  • Yet, it costs almost three times less!
Phantom used to be the go-to choice for long-range travel, but now Mandalay does it even better and for a fraction of the price. Where’s the logic?

If it's superior in key aspects, then its price should reflect that. Right now, anyone with 18 million can get one of the best medium ships in the game.

FDev, Mandalay should cost at least 50-60 30 million.
Balance is at risk, and it needs fixing.


Edited: not 50-60 but at least 30.
 
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Alaska Sædelære

Alaska Sædelære
Since it is paid in fantasy credits instead of real money, this is utterly inconsequential. Once you're past the first few millions, making credits is nearly effortless and shouldn't be the sole focus of gameplay anyway, yet many people can't escape this mental jail.

There are so many inconsistencies and things that seem unbalanced grown out of historical developments that you can go crazy diving down that rabbit hole. There is more important stuff which needs fixing to keep the team busy. That said, I understand where you're coming from. Personally what throws me off is when newly introduced items are so OP that they make existing things obsolete, rather than complementing them. Like SCO, instead of balancing its advantages with some other property which would make it a choice depending on use case rather than a default. And things like that you cannot take back or change after release.
 
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CMDR Matredo

CMDR Matredo
Alaska Sædelære said:
Since it is paid in fantasy credits instead of real money, this is utterly inconsequential. Once you're past the first few millions, making credits is nearly effortless and shouldn't be the sole focus of gameplay anyway, yet many people can't escape this mental jail.

There are so many inconsistencies and things that seem unbalanced grown out of historical developments that you can go crazy diving down that rabbit hole. There is more important stuff which needs fixing to keep the team busy.
Click to expand...
Overloaded with credits pocket does not fix the problem, this is not the topic of disscussion. It is not hard to change price, it won't take a week of developers time.
 
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anShpan

A
CMDR Matredo said:
Overloaded with credits pocket does not fix the problem, this is not the topic of disscussion.
Click to expand...
Why it is so hard to assume that in EDO word, 1300 years after our "present days" price of ships is calculated based on actual materials spent on construction, modules sizes, tech. expenses and anything else other than Marketing "features" and effort spent on promo activities? Especially when those marketing features are defined by forum members. Besides:
  • Phantom almost x2 in mass, thus more materials.
  • Most base E-rated modules are 1-2 class bigger, thus more expensive.
  • Mandalay few years younger, manufacturing process could be significantly optimised since.
CMDR Matredo said:
It is not hard to change price, it won't take a week of developers time.
Click to expand...
Estimations of someone else's work/effort, especially when not authorized to do so was never considered a proper and useful info nor argument(s)
 

Eldr Reign

Eldr Reign
I would like to introduce you to: Dimondback Explorer. Which we had before Mandalay arrived. Having a Higher jump range, faster, and more manuverable than Krait Phantom. Best of all it costs almost 10% the price of a mandalay. Of about 1.8mil.

Mind you i didn't perfectly engineer either of the spacecrafts.

The price is not solely based on the capabilities of the fsd or engine. It's based on everything. Such as size or other capabilities of the spacecrafts. Which enables it to have bigger core internals and bigger optional internals. Doesn't mean you have to use them. But the size also imposed limits to it. Such as forcing the use of a bigger and more expensive engine. Because otherwise it wont move.

To figure out the price you can't just compare 1 aspect and ignore everything else it can do or it has.

Edit: added other somewhere
Edit: links fixed.
 
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IstvaanDCIV

IstvaanDCIV
The Phantom is a bigger ship, and it can do multi-role work better than the Mandalay, like its Mk2 sibling. The Phantom being more expensive makes perfect sense.
 

CMDR Matredo

CMDR Matredo
anShpan said:
Why it is so hard to assume that in EDO word, 1300 years after our "present days" price of ships is calculated based on actual materials spent on construction, modules sizes, tech. expenses and anything else other than Marketing "features" and effort spent on promo activities? Especially when those marketing features are defined by forum members. Besides:
  • Phantom almost x2 in mass, thus more materials.
  • Most base E-rated modules are 1-2 class bigger, thus more expensive.
  • Mandalay few years younger, manufacturing process could be significantly optimised since.

Estimations of someone else's work/effort, especially when not authorized to do so was never considered a proper and useful info nor argument(s)
Click to expand...
We are talking about balance here, not that stuff. If you are so in love with realistic stuff then tell me, why other ships are not that optimized for "tech expenses"? Why anaconda was released back in 2856 and there is no mkII?
 

CMDR Matredo

CMDR Matredo
Eldr Reign said:
I would like to introduce you to: Dimondback Explorer. Which we had before Mandalay arrived. Having a Higher jump range, faster, and more manuverable than Krait Phantom. Best of all it costs almost 10% the price of a mandalay. Of about 1.8mil.

Mind you i didn't perfectly engineer either of the spacecrafts.

The price is not solely based on the capabilities of the fsd or engine. It's based on everything. Such as size or other capabilities of the spacecrafts. Which enables it to have bigger core internals and bigger optional internals. Doesn't mean you have to use them. But the size also imposed limits to it. Such as forcing the use of a bigger and more expensive engine. Because otherwise it wont move.

To figure out the price you can't just compare 1 aspect and ignore everything else it can do or it has.

Edit: added other somewhere
Edit: links fixed.
Click to expand...
does make sense
 

SlickPBW

S
For practical purposes, nowadays credits are meaningless IMO. So obtaining any new ship for only credits is trivial. Everything you do makes credits, and with a little investment in a ship, you can very easily make hundreds of millions of credits in a day. This can be done via many gameplay options: combat, trade, mining, exobiology just to name a few.
 

CMDR Matredo

CMDR Matredo
SlickPBW said:
For practical purposes, nowadays credits are meaningless IMO. So obtaining any new ship for only credits is trivial. Everything you do makes credits, and with a little investment in a ship, you can very easily make hundreds of millions of credits in a day. This can be done via many gameplay options: combat, trade, mining, just to name a few.
Click to expand...
Easy for you but not for newbies. If you have a lot of credits that's great, you are rich and can buy everything.
 

Alaska Sædelære

Alaska Sædelære
CMDR Matredo said:
Easy for you but not for newbies. If you have a lot of credits that's great, you are rich and can buy everything.
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You are not a newbie for very long, a few weeks if you're not in a rush, even days if you're eager or those who start a new commander knowing the ropes already. Why is this even a point?

Edit: Saw after writing that you edited your post. Take it easy, good luck out there o7
 

anShpan

A
CMDR Matredo said:
We are talking about balance here, not that stuff. If you are so in love with realistic stuff then tell me, why other ships are not that optimized for "tech expenses"? Why anaconda was released back in 2856 and there is no mkII?
Click to expand...
We talking about what we are talking about. Did you mentioned any more or less not strictly subjective criterias for such "balance"? No?

Then why not to ask Zorgon Peterson directly how they are managed to release such a beautiful ship for such a low price? Especially if we are comparing specialized explorer with twice bigger multipurpose, any way. My speculation would be that they are more care about newbies to supply them with excellent explorer ship.

P.S. Who will win what if newbies on a budget (mentioned by you) will be paing x3-4 Mandalay's price? What is your point exactly?
 

anShpan

A
BTW, as a newbie (joined summer 3310) I was using Phantom as my first Bubble-jumper multipurpose for some months. Purchased Mandalay within an hour after it appeared in ARX store. Subjectively, last thing I would do is to compare those ships directly.
As a Bubble-jumper for my tasks Phantom currently outclassed by my beloved Cobra mk V (base cost 1,993,861). And I don't see anything off-balance in its price (as a newbie).
 
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