(Disclaimer - I am fully aware that this post is going to cause a LOT of hate. I can only ask that, instead of directly attacking ME for having my opinion on, which is after all, an open forum, you direct your attention to the points in my post. They are made solely in the interests of the game, which I want to enjoy.)
So I'm reading through the replies to the latest dissatisfaction post from a player who has had enough, and naturally I see the same tired responses from those who just can't resist from posting a sarcastic remark to bolster their post count (you'll make Deadly in no time!).
I also saw a few posts regarding something that deserves more discussion, that of longevity and value.
Getting your money's worth, burning out after 5000 hours of play. Are these things mutually inclusive?
I have not played the game for about 2 months. I have, according to Steam, 1310 hours of play. You can probably quadruple that, as I have been playing since early beta.
That's a lot of play.
Did I burn out? Absolutely, usually after I achieved certain goals I set myself, such as grinding my way to a Cutter. Because, y'know - shiny.
I look back at the time I have spent playing the game, and I find myself asking the question 'what do I remember, what were the stand out bit that made those thousands of hours worth playing?'
Well, let's see. Flying through my own solar system was quite nice, getting up close and personal with Saturn, yes that was quite good.
FINALLY moving up from my free Eagle to a Cobra MK III was (back then) a great achievement, and, as I suspect for a lot of early players, was a great feeling of accomplishment and freedom from the shackles of the Sidey (or Freagle).
Landing on a planet for the first time was impressive - if a bit jarring - still dislike the obvious transition from space to instance.
Exploring a few star systems and seeing things like Neutron Stars, and a couple of other things I can't really remember.
Um...
Oh, the PR stunt for the Thargoid thing was very good.
Um...
I think thats about it.
Now... what about what I DIDN'T like.
No, I am not going to sit here and list it. Far too numerous. Suffice to say that the hundreds of hours wasted on each and every 'mystery' ingame is probably the highlight. Reasons I have covered in other threads.
The point of all this? It's the original question. Did I get my money's worth? Because I have played thousands of hours?
No. No I haven't. And do you know why? Because almost nothing of which was promised, advertised and expected, has materialised. Instead, we have what has virtually become a meme for Elite - a shell of a game, a framework for a masterpiece. If Da'Vinci could just find the right paintbrush, he'd turn this blank canvas into the Great Work it sorely deserves.
Instead.... instead we get pewpew, lovage for the PvP crowd, pointless updates with no actual content for those who choose not to just fly around shooting each other.
I see discussions in beta - and here - about the fine details of weapon systems, meta builds and shield strength - from both players AND FDev. I see the ridiculous lengths people are going to to wring that last bit of DPS from their build, and then complaining to FDev that X weapon isn't right because it affect's Y strength.
And I see FDev responding.
I see groups of players arguing about wings... ganking (and how to do it right)... I see players defending the pointless playerkilling, stating it's 'part of the game'. I see spreadsheets, full of data on how to get the absolute best possible build for PvP.
I see Eve.
That, is what this game is slowly turning into. The very thing that people, who defend the way the game is being designed, were vehement in their dismissal of having anything to do with.
There are LESS rules in Elite than in Eve. Sure, there are no official corporations (thankfully), but the amount of vitriol I see spouted towards anyone who isn't 'One of Them' is ridiculous. Eve is, by it's very nature, a player-run PvP-centric game - and Elite is starting to very much emulate it.
When I first heard about the remake of Elite, I was overwhelmed with excitement, because what was promised was almost the polar opposite of Eve. And, for a while, that's how it seemed to be.
But today? Today it's all about the numbers, about the DPS, the RNG and the shield ratings. It's about who can kill who, in the most efficient way possible. It's all about time and money. Which is EXACTLY what Eve is about.
I have often remarked on these forums about the issues I perceive Elite to have - lack of content, direction etc. Now however, it's VERY clear on what direction Frontier want for Elite. They want it to become solely player driven, and they're doing it via PvP combat.
Now, I am fully aware that a certain subset of the playerbase are elated by this, and of course, they did, afterall, pay for the game the same as me. And, while I don't personally like PvP combat, it was, from the very beginning, to be part of Elite in some manner. Unfortunately, since those early days, PvP has become more and more the focus of development, tacking on one update after another, all to make ships shoot things better, and to....encourage... multiplayer gaming.
I am pretty confident in suggesting that the vast majority of players on the PC (I'm discounting console players for the time being), did NOT buy the game back in beta and the original release, just to play PvP pewpew. In fact, this was confirmed in a well-known FDev post a while back (stating there were far more non-PvP players).
It is also, in my opinion, and also an opinion shared by a significant number of other posters, largely down to the opening up of the game to console players, which has led to this direction. The (probably incorrect) view on console players, is they actually all play CoD and Battlefield. Therefore, they will buy a space combat game with lots of emphasis on shooting things, which will make Frontier lots of money. This is of course sound business. Provide a product that the majority of customers will be willing to pay for. That's great for the large influx of new players, absolutely awesome.
Unfortunately, I personally don't think they have that quite right. I have read and spoken to numerous players on XBox who are just as disgruntled with the mainly combat direction of the game in the last few months. I can't possibly say if they represent all console players - but I would surmise that if one player feels such, then there must be more.
My main concern however, is that those of us - the MAJORITY of us PC players, who were here from the early days, and are still here, are literally losing the game they paid money to bring to life. Don't forget, while the Kickstarter was not a REQUIREMENT in terms of cash, it was NEEDED to establish a desire for the game to be developed - and based on the promises of that kickstarter, we all voted with our wallets.
In closing, I would suggest that, while all long-term projects tend to deviate from their original path, I feel that Elite has not just deviated, but is now walking an entirely new path altogether. And while the inevitable outcries of 'But what about PP!' and 'Use your imagination!' (which is my personal most hated excuse - I don't pay money to imagine things, thanks.), and other such stuff will soon fill the first few pages of this thread, I would simply respond with this.
Elite was originally a space trading game. That's it. Combat was literally about self-defense from pirates. Elite Frontier introduced bounty hunting against NPC's which was an alternative method of play - which was also great.
The combat we have in today's game however has morphed, from the original styles from the original games, to PvP-centered stats and figures. We never bothered with DPS numbers in Elite: Frontier. Sure, we had weapons and shields and other nice toys to choose from. But I don't believe we sat there, with a spreadsheet or website, designing the perfect killing machine. We didn't need to because it wasn't something we needed to do.
Elite: Dangerous has lost it's way, in the eyes of the majority of it's original backers and players. This is not an arbitrary comment, it is based on the multitudes of threads and posts on this, and many other forums. It comes down to this. If this is the direction Frontier WANT this game to go, to be another Eve, with offensive and aggressive players in game and on the forums, and primarily about the combat and DPS, balance, etc... Can you please just tell us, so those of us who are tired of hoping for better things, can leave the game quietly, without the need to make the leaving posts that are apparently so disliked.
So I'm reading through the replies to the latest dissatisfaction post from a player who has had enough, and naturally I see the same tired responses from those who just can't resist from posting a sarcastic remark to bolster their post count (you'll make Deadly in no time!).
I also saw a few posts regarding something that deserves more discussion, that of longevity and value.
Getting your money's worth, burning out after 5000 hours of play. Are these things mutually inclusive?
I have not played the game for about 2 months. I have, according to Steam, 1310 hours of play. You can probably quadruple that, as I have been playing since early beta.
That's a lot of play.
Did I burn out? Absolutely, usually after I achieved certain goals I set myself, such as grinding my way to a Cutter. Because, y'know - shiny.
I look back at the time I have spent playing the game, and I find myself asking the question 'what do I remember, what were the stand out bit that made those thousands of hours worth playing?'
Well, let's see. Flying through my own solar system was quite nice, getting up close and personal with Saturn, yes that was quite good.
FINALLY moving up from my free Eagle to a Cobra MK III was (back then) a great achievement, and, as I suspect for a lot of early players, was a great feeling of accomplishment and freedom from the shackles of the Sidey (or Freagle).
Landing on a planet for the first time was impressive - if a bit jarring - still dislike the obvious transition from space to instance.
Exploring a few star systems and seeing things like Neutron Stars, and a couple of other things I can't really remember.
Um...
Oh, the PR stunt for the Thargoid thing was very good.
Um...
I think thats about it.
Now... what about what I DIDN'T like.
No, I am not going to sit here and list it. Far too numerous. Suffice to say that the hundreds of hours wasted on each and every 'mystery' ingame is probably the highlight. Reasons I have covered in other threads.
The point of all this? It's the original question. Did I get my money's worth? Because I have played thousands of hours?
No. No I haven't. And do you know why? Because almost nothing of which was promised, advertised and expected, has materialised. Instead, we have what has virtually become a meme for Elite - a shell of a game, a framework for a masterpiece. If Da'Vinci could just find the right paintbrush, he'd turn this blank canvas into the Great Work it sorely deserves.
Instead.... instead we get pewpew, lovage for the PvP crowd, pointless updates with no actual content for those who choose not to just fly around shooting each other.
I see discussions in beta - and here - about the fine details of weapon systems, meta builds and shield strength - from both players AND FDev. I see the ridiculous lengths people are going to to wring that last bit of DPS from their build, and then complaining to FDev that X weapon isn't right because it affect's Y strength.
And I see FDev responding.
I see groups of players arguing about wings... ganking (and how to do it right)... I see players defending the pointless playerkilling, stating it's 'part of the game'. I see spreadsheets, full of data on how to get the absolute best possible build for PvP.
I see Eve.
That, is what this game is slowly turning into. The very thing that people, who defend the way the game is being designed, were vehement in their dismissal of having anything to do with.
There are LESS rules in Elite than in Eve. Sure, there are no official corporations (thankfully), but the amount of vitriol I see spouted towards anyone who isn't 'One of Them' is ridiculous. Eve is, by it's very nature, a player-run PvP-centric game - and Elite is starting to very much emulate it.
When I first heard about the remake of Elite, I was overwhelmed with excitement, because what was promised was almost the polar opposite of Eve. And, for a while, that's how it seemed to be.
But today? Today it's all about the numbers, about the DPS, the RNG and the shield ratings. It's about who can kill who, in the most efficient way possible. It's all about time and money. Which is EXACTLY what Eve is about.
I have often remarked on these forums about the issues I perceive Elite to have - lack of content, direction etc. Now however, it's VERY clear on what direction Frontier want for Elite. They want it to become solely player driven, and they're doing it via PvP combat.
Now, I am fully aware that a certain subset of the playerbase are elated by this, and of course, they did, afterall, pay for the game the same as me. And, while I don't personally like PvP combat, it was, from the very beginning, to be part of Elite in some manner. Unfortunately, since those early days, PvP has become more and more the focus of development, tacking on one update after another, all to make ships shoot things better, and to....encourage... multiplayer gaming.
I am pretty confident in suggesting that the vast majority of players on the PC (I'm discounting console players for the time being), did NOT buy the game back in beta and the original release, just to play PvP pewpew. In fact, this was confirmed in a well-known FDev post a while back (stating there were far more non-PvP players).
It is also, in my opinion, and also an opinion shared by a significant number of other posters, largely down to the opening up of the game to console players, which has led to this direction. The (probably incorrect) view on console players, is they actually all play CoD and Battlefield. Therefore, they will buy a space combat game with lots of emphasis on shooting things, which will make Frontier lots of money. This is of course sound business. Provide a product that the majority of customers will be willing to pay for. That's great for the large influx of new players, absolutely awesome.
Unfortunately, I personally don't think they have that quite right. I have read and spoken to numerous players on XBox who are just as disgruntled with the mainly combat direction of the game in the last few months. I can't possibly say if they represent all console players - but I would surmise that if one player feels such, then there must be more.
My main concern however, is that those of us - the MAJORITY of us PC players, who were here from the early days, and are still here, are literally losing the game they paid money to bring to life. Don't forget, while the Kickstarter was not a REQUIREMENT in terms of cash, it was NEEDED to establish a desire for the game to be developed - and based on the promises of that kickstarter, we all voted with our wallets.
In closing, I would suggest that, while all long-term projects tend to deviate from their original path, I feel that Elite has not just deviated, but is now walking an entirely new path altogether. And while the inevitable outcries of 'But what about PP!' and 'Use your imagination!' (which is my personal most hated excuse - I don't pay money to imagine things, thanks.), and other such stuff will soon fill the first few pages of this thread, I would simply respond with this.
Elite was originally a space trading game. That's it. Combat was literally about self-defense from pirates. Elite Frontier introduced bounty hunting against NPC's which was an alternative method of play - which was also great.
The combat we have in today's game however has morphed, from the original styles from the original games, to PvP-centered stats and figures. We never bothered with DPS numbers in Elite: Frontier. Sure, we had weapons and shields and other nice toys to choose from. But I don't believe we sat there, with a spreadsheet or website, designing the perfect killing machine. We didn't need to because it wasn't something we needed to do.
Elite: Dangerous has lost it's way, in the eyes of the majority of it's original backers and players. This is not an arbitrary comment, it is based on the multitudes of threads and posts on this, and many other forums. It comes down to this. If this is the direction Frontier WANT this game to go, to be another Eve, with offensive and aggressive players in game and on the forums, and primarily about the combat and DPS, balance, etc... Can you please just tell us, so those of us who are tired of hoping for better things, can leave the game quietly, without the need to make the leaving posts that are apparently so disliked.
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