Hardware & Technical New PC. Advice required.

[Stealthie]

It's time to bite the bullet and replace the 10 year old (yes, really!) PC that I've been playing ED on up until now.

In a nutshell, I'm about to pull the trigger on a Ryzen 5 5600x CPU, mobo and 16gb RAM.

The mobo has 4x DIMMs. I'm planning on buyng 2x 8gb RAM modules with a view to buying another 2 later on.
Already got a case, a 1tb SSD, a 4tb HDD, PSU and a stopgap GFX card (GTX 780ti) which I'll use until gfx card prices/specs stabilise.

Anybody care to offer any advice for additions, alternatives, suggestions, or reasons why this isn't a good choice?

 

[Chris Simon]

I wholehartedly support your CPU choice.
The only thing I'd advise would be - don't cheap out on the motherboard if you can and buy a decent x570 one (I have a good experience with lower-end ASUS Strix ones. Now using their "Gaming-E" model) and good RAM (3600MHz or around that. Using that or overclocking to 3800MHz so you can run it 1:1 with 1800 or 1900MHz FCLK respectively makes a whole heap of difference compared to some slower RAM sticks.)

 

[The Chairmaker]

Check the way the ram works on the motherboard, either daisy chain or T topology
Also when buying ram check if its single or dual channel.

See this link for detailed info on memory setups as can impact performance by a few frames.

RAM Guide: Trouble with Memory? – Part 1

www.sapphirenation.net

Ryzen chips benefit from lower CL so look for CL 14 or CL16 memory. Ideally 3200 or 3600 speed.
Dont get anything with a higher frequency as its just wasted due to the way the infinity fabric as its called which links the memory to the cpu works


Ryzen 5600x is a superb all round cpu with excellent price to performance, ideally paired with X570 or B550 board.
Best matched with a mid range graphics card such as a Amd 6700XT /6600XT or nvidia 3070 or 3060 class card.

If dreaming of a 3080 class nvidia card or 6800xt AMD when they become available at sensible prices, then i would go with a 5900x or if thats stretching finances a 5800x as will offer that little bit extra performance . Only a couple of frames mind you. So not overall that big an issue. just something to think about if your looking for a beast mode pc.

 

[Stealthie]

Well, that changed pretty quickly...

Seems I can get a Ryzen 7 3800x CPU for £50 less than the Ryzen 5 5600x and it benchmarks a bit better (overall) too....so, erm, I bought one.

Mobo' is an Asus TUF B450m.
I probably could do a little bit better, there, but I bought it from somebody who upgraded their PC a while back and it was a bargain.
Checked the Asus website and it's compatible with the 3800x.

RAM is fairly generic PC4 19200 DDR4 2400MHz (8gb x2).
Again, could do better there but I really just want to get this thing up and running without breaking the bank.

I know I could have done a bit better but it it'll be a big step up from my current system (Intel Q9450/8gb RAM - which is still surprisingly capable) and it'll leave me scope for future upgrades when tech' has moved on again and I can pick up compatible parts for peanuts.


I guess my car will have to wait another month for a new set of tyres.

 

[Morbad]

Is that the Asus TUF B450M-Plus or Pro? The "Plus" variant has a rather low-end VRM. Probably won't be an issue, but it's something to keep in mind, especially if the board is used.

The 3800X is better for mutlitasking and well-threaded apps, but worse for gaming, relative to the 5600X.

Memory clock is pretty important for Ryzen 3000 and 5000 series parts, especially the former. FCLK is normally directly linked to memory clock and this determines how each CCX communicates with the others and the processors I/O-die. This is why 3600MT/s memory at 1800MHz FCLK is considered optimal, it's the fastest memory/FCLK that is virtually guaranteed to work on these parts. 2400 isn't going to keep it from being a massive upgrade over what you've been using, but it will hurt performance more than it would on other platforms. Chances are any 2400 stuff you get today will have quite a bit of headroom, if you're inclined to overclock it.

 

[Stealthie]

Is that the Asus TUF B450M-Plus or Pro? The "Plus" variant has a rather low-end VRM. Probably won't be an issue, but it's something to keep in mind, especially if the board is used.

The 3800X is better for mutlitasking and well-threaded apps, but worse for gaming, relative to the 5600X.

It's the Plus version.
Hopefully the VRM won't be an issue.
I bought it almost-new, from somebody who is seriously into overclocking, who replaced it because they said it wasn't especially suitable for overclocking.

Personally, I've learned not to worry too much about overclocking.
Instead, I just wait a year and then replace components once the prices start to fall.

I realise the 3800x might be slightly worse than the 5600x for gaming but there's not a lot in it and I also use my PC for video-editing too so, swings & roundabouts... and it was £50 cheaper.
Again, there's scope to get myself a decent upgrade in a year or so.

 

[Stealthie]

Blimey!

I'm kind of glad all this stuff is arriving gradually in the post.
It gives me the time I need to figure out how it all works without rushing things.

CPU arrived this morning and, erm, there's more connectors on the cooling fan than my first PC had altogether!

Firstly, it seems the previous owner of the mobo had a "type 2" fan (the one that screws directly to the mobo) because, before I bought it, he must've re-attached the hooks for a "type 1" fan... the wrong way around.
Spent about 5 minutes trying to figure out how the fan attaches, before realising the hooks are supposed to face away from the CPU.
That's something to look out for if you're putting one of these mobo's together.

Then there's the connectors.
The fan's got the standard 4-pin connector and two others as well - one for RGB LEDs and another that connects to one of the mobo's USB headers.
I also, apparently, need to download softaware and drivers for the fan.
It'd better be bloody impressive, given all the faff involved.

Shame that the PC, even though it's got glass sides on the case, is going to be up against a wall.

 

[Chris Simon]

Blimey!

I'm kind of glad all this stuff is arriving gradually in the post.
It gives me the time I need to figure out how it all works without rushing things.

CPU arrived this morning and, erm, there's more connectors on the cooling fan than my first PC had altogether!

Firstly, it seems the previous owner of the mobo had a "type 2" fan (the one that screws directly to the mobo) because, before I bought it, he must've re-attached the hooks for a "type 1" fan... the wrong way around.
Spent about 5 minutes trying to figure out how the fan attaches, before realising the hooks are supposed to face away from the CPU.
That's something to look out for if you're putting one of these mobo's together.

Then there's the connectors.
The fan's got the standard 4-pin connector and two others as well - one for RGB LEDs and another that connects to one of the mobo's USB headers.
I also, apparently, need to download softaware and drivers for the fan.
It'd better be bloody impressive, given all the faff involved.

Shame that the PC, even though it's got glass sides on the case, is going to be up against a wall.

Yeah, RGB build with glass case is cool for about 40 minutes. Or until you have to use it at night. Then it's just annoying and you'll end up with some very dim red hue to save your eyes or turn it off completely anyway.

 

[Stealthie]

Yeah, RGB build with glass case is cool for about 40 minutes. Or until you have to use it at night. Then it's just annoying and you'll end up with some very dim red hue to save your eyes or turn it off completely anyway.

Uhuh.

No idea if it'll do this but, given that the fan attaches to a USB header and the RGB header (as well as the standard PWM header), I suppose it'd be kind of cool if the fan glowed blue when it was cold, green when it was working normally and red to alert you that the CPU was overheating.

It'll all be lost on me, though.
The PC lives on a shelf under my desk, up against a wall, which means I won't see anything.
About the only benefit of the glass sides on the case is it makes it easier for me to check how much dust has got inside.

 

[Chris Simon]

Uhuh.

No idea if it'll do this but, given that the fan attaches to a USB header and the RGB header (as well as the standard PWM header), I suppose it'd be kind of cool if the fan glowed blue when it was cold, green when it was working normally and red to alert you that the CPU was overheating.

It'll all be lost on me, though.
The PC lives on a shelf under my desk, up against a wall, which means I won't see anything.
About the only benefit of the glass sides on the case is it makes it easier for me to check how much dust has got inside.

Depends on the software. Some can do this.
Of course you don't have to use the RGB and USB connectors if you don't want to clutter your PC with additional bloatware.
The fan should still work fine.

Good luck with the build, anyway. I think I forgot to say that earlier.

 

[Stealthie]

Well, new PC is almost finished.

Would have been done last week except that I spent bloody days trying to figure out a problem with it, where it'd work perfectly for a few hours but then become unreliable and, eventually, fail to boot completely.
Turned out that the SSD I bought was a fake one, which is reporting 1TB capacity but is, in fact, only 64gb - which means it's just about big enough to install W10 on but then, once you install a couple of other things, it starts overwriting the W10 files with other stuff until, eventually, Windows can't boot.

Will be pursuing a refund for that next week.

Handy in a way, I suppose, because my new mobo has an M.2 slot on it and I think I'll get an M.2 SSD for it rather than a SATA one.

Incidentally, the SSD I bought was branded "INMAS", available from this guy on eBay: https://www.ebay.co.uk/usr/marvinxznd955
Definitely to be avoided!

 

[Chris Simon]

Well, new PC is almost finished.

Would have been done last week except that I spent bloody days trying to figure out a problem with it, where it'd work perfectly for a few hours but then become unreliable and, eventually, fail to boot completely.
Turned out that the SSD I bought was a fake one, which is reporting 1TB capacity but is, in fact, only 64gb - which means it's just about big enough to install W10 on but then, once you install a couple of other things, it starts overwriting the W10 files with other stuff until, eventually, Windows can't boot.

Will be pursuing a refund for that next week.

Handy in a way, I suppose, because my new mobo has an M.2 slot on it and I think I'll get an M.2 SSD for it rather than a SATA one.

Incidentally, the SSD I bought was branded "INMAS", available from this guy on eBay: https://www.ebay.co.uk/usr/marvinxznd955
Definitely to be avoided!

I've seen USB sticks like this, never an SSD. That's just shameful.

But yeah, I think you will like M.2 much more. They're great. Much snappier experience in file explorer and blistering load times.
One general advice with M.2s though is to not overfill them. Due to how the memory chips and controller works (it basically keeps shuffling the bits around to keep it fresh) it is recommended to always have at least 10% or more of free space. If you fill it to the brim, you're shortening the life of individual NAND chips.

I hope you get your money back. I don't have exactly stellar experience when comes to eBay, so... yeah.

 

[Morbad]

Make sure you're getting an NVMe drive. M.2 is a form factor, not an interface. There are SATA, PCI-E AHCI (though these are very rare nowadays), and PCI-E NVMe M.2 SSDs.

You also probably want to avoid DRAM-less drives, and QLC, unless pinching every penny is important.

 

[Stealthie]

One general advice with M.2s though is to not overfill them. Due to how the memory chips and controller works (it basically keeps shuffling the bits around to keep it fresh) it is recommended to always have at least 10% or more of free space. If you fill it to the brim, you're shortening the life of individual NAND chips.

Will keep that in mind, although I don't think it'll be a problem.

My current PC has a 4TB HDD for file storage and I recently upgraded from a 500gb HDD to a 2TB HDD which it boots from.
After a year of use, the 2TB HDD is [opens file explorer to check] 20% full.

Basically, all my PC has installed on it is W10, MS Office, ED, Steam, Skyrim and, erm, about 200 mod's for Skyrim.
I've installed a few other games, occasionally, but nothing that stays on the HDD permanently.

As I said, I do a bit of video editing and photography as well but the files live on the 4TB HDD and I guess I can move them across to the SSD temporarily to take advantage of improved access times and then move them back to the HDD for long-term storage.
Even that's a bit redundant 'cos all the "important" stuff is saved onto an external HDD as well.

EDIT

Should say, despite the SSD being a "fake", it did give me a taste of the benefits of an SSD, with only W10 installed at least, and it was quite impressive.
Cold boot took about 15 seconds to arrive at the W10 desktop with the SSD, including the 5 seconds of POST after it boots.
Once I realised the SSD was causing my problems, I temporarily swapped it out for an old 250gb laptop HDD and the boot time increased to about 35 seconds.
35s isn't the end of the world, I guess, but SSD's are clearly speedier.

 

[Stealthie]

Make sure you're getting an NVMe drive. M.2 is a form factor, not an interface. There are SATA, PCI-E AHCI (though these are very rare nowadays), and PCI-E NVMe M.2 SSDs.

You also probably want to avoid DRAM-less drives, and QLC, unless pinching every penny is important.

Thanks.

Literally, only just started looking at M.2 SSDs about 10 minutes ago.
Will be sure to keep this in mind.

 

[Stealthie]

Well, finalised my build with a 1tb M.2 Seagate BarraCuda NVMe SSD.
Nice and fast and kind of amazing that something the size of a couple of postage stamps replaces a HDD.

Having just installed the SSD and tidied up all the wiring (which was temporarily configured to accommodate a SATA HDD to boot from), I feel like I need to mention the case I bought.

It's a thing called an IONZ K17.
There's nothing really "premium" about it, like there might be if it was made by Corsair or Thermaltake, but they've designed it so the base-plate, which the mobo' fits to, is about an inch inside the case and has a variety of holes in it.

That means you can fit all the components to the PC then run all the cables behind the base-plate and poke them through a hole near where they need to plug into your mobo/gfx card/fans etc.
The result is that there's no wires cluttering up the main area inside the case, interfering with air flow across the CPU and GPU.

A simple tweak to a conventional design that makes a PC look lovely and tidy when it's finished!

Link to IONZ KZ17 on Amazon: https://www.amazon.co.uk/ionz-TEMPERED-GLASS-GAMING-MICRO/dp/B08FMQMP42

 

[Hedy]

Just finished a new build myself. It was so much more awkward and difficult than last time. My hands now hate me for trying to slip them down along the inside of a massive cpu cooler.

 

[Patrick_68000]

Just finished a new build myself.

We will now have even more beautiful ED:O images than usual